Shotgun Safety Course

New Avon Arms
paul o' said:
Any training is better than none .How the user then goes on to use it and then can't be bothered to continue in the same vain is what makes a safe shooter or an unsafe one .
Btw we're you trained or did you just roll along monkey see monkey do.
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Training, experience yes but that can come about in many ways and not just by a formal course.

I once knew a university lecture with lots of letter after his name, was teaching semiconductor material science but confessed he did not know how to wire a three pin mains plug. So qualification or training are not a substitute to practical experience.

What’s that old saying, those that can, do; those that can’t teach.
 
Agree hands on little to no class room is what is called for most if not all clubs will have teams of guys willing to help if they don't join another same go's for clay grounds as it benefits them not only there safty record but should you shoot at another range they will see you have been trained and not led or wrote a paper on it .
Honestly I can't believe the amount of wall builders that can't see the benefits of training into days world with so many reading and waiting to ban our sports :eek:
 
spanj said:
No. THEY want you to do it but are not legally allowed to demand it. The sooner FL is taken away from the Police the better IMO
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Weather or not it’s legal we all know everyone here does what their firearms officer asks them to do as we all want to be on the correct side of them, he did say I could get where I go clay shooting or my gun club to write a letter but I go clay shooting over a few different places so don’t really have a solid foundation there, a course is much easier..
Pass the course forward over the email done and dusted
 
Liveonce said:
What experience do you have? assume it is none? if so then some logic in what the FEO requested, if however you have been clay shooting several times or live pigeon shooting for crop protection with a friend then I would consider the course unnecessary. They just need to know you can safely handle the shotgun for your own safety and that of others.
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I have shot shotguns for years with friends that have SGC the issue is I’m always a guest to where ever we go clay shooting
 
f17ant said:
I have shot shotguns for years with friends that have SGC the issue is I’m always a guest to where ever we go clay shooting
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Did you not inform the FEO of that fact? was one of the friends also a referee for your SGC application?
If so looks to be backside covering attitude by the FEO. Obviously you are accommodating the request to do the course to smooth the application process.

But given what you have said I would go back to the FEO and ask what they expect you to gain by doing the course, given the knowledge and experience you have obtained over the years by effectively being mentored by your friends and no legal obligation to do the course.
 
Liveonce said:
Did you not inform the FEO of that fact? was one of the friends also a referee for your SGC application?
If so looks to be backside covering attitude by the FEO. Obviously you are accommodating the request to do the course to smooth the application process.

But given what you have said I would go back to the FEO and ask what they expect you to gain by doing the course, given the knowledge and experience you have obtained over the years by effectively being mentored by your friends and no legal obligation to do the course.
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My mentor (for everything deer stalking, game shooting with shotguns and clay shooting) was my reference and my FEO is aware he holds a SGC & FAC he said he can write a letter but he still pushing for the course. When my FEO called my reference he did tell my FEO all the experience we have together but he was more concerned about my mental state if I’m violent standard questions really. To be fair when I was chatting to my FEO he actually seems like a nice guy, I did question why I need to do it as if I wasn’t safe and aware my gun club wouldn’t have my shooting there, but I guess it’s a requirement for MET

Honestly it’s no problem me doing the course and like I said earlier my FEO is easy to chat to I rather start out on good terms with him 👍🏼

I made the post not to avoid the course but to find a suitable one
 
f17ant said:
My mentor (for everything deer stalking, game shooting with shotguns and clay shooting) was my reference and my FEO is aware he holds a SGC & FAC he said he can write a letter but he still pushing for the course. When my FEO called my reference he did tell my FEO all the experience we have together but he was more concerned about my mental state if I’m violent standard questions really. To be fair when I was chatting to my FEO he actually seems like a nice guy, I did question why I need to do it as if I wasn’t safe and aware my gun club wouldn’t have my shooting there, but I guess it’s a requirement for MET

Honestly it’s no problem me doing the course and like I said earlier my FEO is easy to chat to I rather start out on good terms with him 👍🏼

I made the post not to avoid the course but to find a suitable one
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Understand your desire to keep on friendly terms with the FEO but the MET cannot make up the law only apply it.
The danger is one force start insisting on the course and before we know it they all are, that’s how the GP reports started.

You look to have plenty of experience to be granted a SGC without being told to do a course.

@Conor O'Gorman comment please.
 
Liveonce said:
Understand your desire to keep on friendly terms with the FEO but the MET cannot make up the law only apply it.
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Read the whole thread again.

Then (more importantly) read between the lines.

The MET are not 'insisting' on anything. They are 'suggesting' a course of action that will assist someone in their application.

Why are you seeking to bother @Conor O'Gorman?
 
Liveonce said:
Understand your desire to keep on friendly terms with the FEO but the MET cannot make up the law only apply it.
The danger is one force start insisting on the course and before we know it they all are, that’s how the GP reports started.

You look to have plenty of experience to be granted a SGC without being told to do a course.

@Conor O'Gorman comment please.
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Training requirements should not be happening. This cropped up with Gloucestershire Constabulary on this forum last month and we contacted the force and bottomed this out.

C

Post in thread 'Gloucestershire Police - Requiring Training before Shotgun Certificate Grant'

We have had feedback from the force that applicants would not be told they had to go on an Ian Coley shooting school course but they would be asked about what safety handling/training they have had as the force would expect at least some knowledge. I think that is a reasonable explanation in the context of the details provided in the OP about the person that told them about their meeting with a FEO.
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I will raise the concerns raised about Met Police with colleagues on Monday but mindful of the views of OP also. Each case is individual but at the same time there are certain principles to be followed.
 
paul o' said:
Any training is better than none .How the user then goes on to use it and then can't be bothered to continue in the same vain is what makes a safe shooter or an unsafe one .
Btw we're you trained or did you just roll along monkey see monkey do.
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Mentoring system for the most part….but a good portion was trial and error with a good amount of caution and respect for the items being handled (reloading components etc) and research.

The statistics show that the sport is inherently safe - there are no trends to suggest that formal training should be compulsory, the concern would be that it has an adverse effect on the current system whereby people lose the caution and respect for firearms because if they have a certificate is won’t happen to them as they’re “trained”….
 
ColinJ said:
Mate as soon as you post anything about the police the haters come out!
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ColinJ said:
Mate as soon as you post anything about the police the haters come out!
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Its not a case of haters, its a case of resisting mission creep. As has been stated here, the police enforce the law they dont make it.
f17ant said:
This is mad I only posted for someone to share a decent place to do my shotgun safety course
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I have been shooting for over 40 years and held an open cert for probably 30 of them. When I requested a .308 (only about 5 years ago)i was told I “needed” to have dsc1. I challenged this in a factual and polite way. I got the .308 without the course. FLOs arent god, they have responsibilities but they arent entitled to make up conditions. Sadly, they do. Even more sadly people roll over because they want a good relationship. In a domestic situation that would be considered coercive and controlling.
 
Stalker62 said:
Read the whole thread again.

Then (more importantly) read between the lines.

The MET are not 'insisting' on anything. They are 'suggesting' a course of action that will assist someone in their application.

Why are you seeking to bother @Conor O'Gorman?
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Think Connor and spanj have answered that for you.

So if they have only suggested a course, the OP certificate is in the post to him then?
 
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