Foxing

Don’t always shoot them when I see them , I’m a bit hard on them at my bit as the grey partridges are making a comeback due to me giving Charlie a hard time.

Everything has to live I suppose.

Other areas I just watch them and let them get on with whatever unless I get told otherwise
 
I reckon badgers and cats do more damage to ground nesting birds, ducklings, etc than foxes.

I also reckon hares do more damage to restock plantations than deer

But there are definitely both pest managers who do it for biodiversity, and there are the foxing obsessed sporters with NV gear and tactical junkies who secretly wish they were special forces 😂
 
I've been hard on them this year, few months before my lambing started,
Lambed everything outside this year and the fox numbers were excessive,
Happy enough to see them going about the rest of the year, and wouldn't want them totally wiped out of the area,
 
I reckon badgers and cats do more damage to ground nesting birds, ducklings, etc than foxes.

I also reckon hares do more damage to restock plantations than deer

But there are definitely both pest managers who do it for biodiversity, and there are the foxing obsessed sporters with NV gear and tactical junkies who secretly wish they were special forces 😂
Much the same as people who have a dabble in stock refurbishment :norty: 🤣
 
I reckon badgers and cats do more damage to ground nesting birds, ducklings, etc than foxes.

I also reckon hares do more damage to restock plantations than deer

But there are definitely both pest managers who do it for biodiversity, and there are the foxing obsessed sporters with NV gear and tactical junkies who secretly wish they were special forces 😂

Not a chance
Fox is the real killer
 
I only shoot foxes these days if asked to do so, these days better management of how sheep lamb and poultry is kept reduces the need to kill every fox on sight. Yes some control is required but with modern NV far more are being shot than ever before by many just because they can.

Several years back I kept chickens, first thought when losing them to a fox was shoot the fox, which I did, but I quickly learned the reason for the fox getting into the chicken pen is because the pen was not up to the job of keeping the fox out. As kill a fox and another takes its place. Effort spent improving the pen stopped the problem.

Would be a sad day if we lost the fox from being part of the countryside.

badgers, cats and on occasion dogs are just as much of a problem.
 
Not a chance
Fox is the real killer
I don’t know really. Have seen the damage of hares in restock where even with a modest deer population there’s very little as they feed more on regeneration undergrowth. Duck ponds with no fox, or virtually none, destroyed of duck nests year on year by badgers caught in the act.

Looking at the impact just my domestic cat has on our garden, which is only 1.5 acres, it’s very visible what just one house cat can do. Then add the neighbours two scoundrel cats and voila!

There’s no doubt fox are notorious killers, you are right, but I’m not sure they are as bad as laid out sometimes, and since every right to be part of nature - we cannot be justifying nature management and biodiversity and simultaneously arguing for shooting every fox we see. There’s a natural balance of course.

I also think deer are laid out as tree killers, and I’ve been around this game long enough to know that’s simply not the case apart from isolated cases such as exceptionally large fallow herds - but that’s introduced, and a man made deer problem.

Speaking of man made deer problems - shooting every fox one sees as a gamekeeper to protect released birds- this is a money game, so hard to justify on the biodiversity front. Yes, I’m aware that biodiversity increases with the removal of predators, but also don’t forget that foxes eat a lot of mice and rats etc, so it’s a careful what you wish for job.

Arachnophobics will argue for the extinct of spiders, yet the world as we know it would seize to be habitable within a few years at best.

Whilst I do shoot foxes, it’s in moderation and not heavily targeted practises. I also question whether the hard target fox control is doing us any favours as a shooting community in the public eye.
 
I don’t know really. Have seen the damage of hares in restock where even with a modest deer population there’s very little as they feed more on regeneration undergrowth. Duck ponds with no fox, or virtually none, destroyed of duck nests year on year by badgers caught in the act.

Looking at the impact just my domestic cat has on our garden, which is only 1.5 acres, it’s very visible what just one house cat can do. Then add the neighbours two scoundrel cats and voila!

There’s no doubt fox are notorious killers, you are right, but I’m not sure they are as bad as laid out sometimes, and since every right to be part of nature - we cannot be justifying nature management and biodiversity and simultaneously arguing for shooting every fox we see. There’s a natural balance of course.

I also think deer are laid out as tree killers, and I’ve been around this game long enough to know that’s simply not the case apart from isolated cases such as exceptionally large fallow herds - but that’s introduced, and a man made deer problem.

Speaking of man made deer problems - shooting every fox one sees as a gamekeeper to protect released birds- this is a money game, so hard to justify on the biodiversity front. Yes, I’m aware that biodiversity increases with the removal of predators, but also don’t forget that foxes eat a lot of mice and rats etc, so it’s a careful what you wish for job.

Arachnophobics will argue for the extinct of spiders, yet the world as we know it would seize to be habitable within a few years at best.

Whilst I do shoot foxes, it’s in moderation and not heavily targeted practises. I also question whether the hard target fox control is doing us any favours as a shooting community in the public eye.
I dont think any / many would want to see the last fox - but on our ground and the same with many where ground nesting birds have found a refuge no quarter can be given. The issue is that now so many foxes lives in town / villages / motorway banks / industrial estates and simply multiply so rapidly and then raid at will.
I engage with the public quite a lot and although some pull a face at first i ask them to stand look and listen at the birds - the hares we have on the ground - before "my project" started we had limited numbers - now we are thronged with wildlife and predator control is a vital tool in that box.

We perhaps have as many / or more badgers per acre than most and i still continue nightly to watch them bounce past potential prey species - 5 years on monitoring them - this still surprises me every night ! I do wonder as i have said elsewhere if its because we have a no fertiliser - no pesticide - low ground compaction policy - allowing for plenty of their "favourite" food - coupled with easy access to our wheat feeders all year round.
 
Catch 22 situation. Biggest killer of roe kids is silage mowers. 2nd is foxs. So if we were philosophical then if roe getting out of control encouraging foxs might be a good idea. Unfortunately foxs also eat everything else and roe kids only available for a week or so once a year.
Issue is that fox and badger population is out of control and in case of foxs impossible to eradicate them all esp on a semi urban environment .
Add predation of fledglings by crows magpies gulls and alike and no wonder some species are in severe decline.
D
 
Catch 22 situation. Biggest killer of roe kids is silage mowers. 2nd is foxs. So if we were philosophical then if roe getting out of control encouraging foxs might be a good idea. Unfortunately foxs also eat everything else and roe kids only available for a week or so once a year.
Issue is that fox and badger population is out of control and in case of foxs impossible to eradicate them all esp on a semi urban environment .
Add predation of fledglings by crows magpies gulls and alike and no wonder some species are in severe decline.
D
Spot on! The population of predatory species, such as you describe, has increased out of all proportion since I was young. Huge flocks of crows were never seen years ago, but now we have them around here in hundreds. As for the badgers, I won't go down that road again!
As was mentioned earlier, the number of cats around is ridiculous. I echo your last few words, "No wonder some species are in severe decline"!
 
Imo it's not purely predators that suppress numbers of rarer species, but they are a leg of the stool of management.

The biggest factor (not reason) that some species are flourishing & others struggling is adaptability. The more versatile & adaptable a species is, the more it not only survives with the changes (mainly driven by humans) but actively benefits = their numbers are artificially swelled.
Adversely, the more specialist & set in their ways creatures (grey partridge right through to giant pandas!!) are hit with double whammy, of habitat/food loss AND trying to dodge all the extra predators.

It's up to us, those who properly understand, to try to tip the scales a bit more towards the middle.

That's basically how I explained it to a class full of 10 year olds couple of years ago & the response was overwhelmingly accepting & understood. But that is in a small rural village primary school.
 
The group I’m involved with supply SASA and APHA with shot foxes, preferably with undamaged livers for analysis.

Last year 44 foxes were supplied from the area and only 4 from the rest of Scotland.
SASA recently picked up 14 foxes.

The reason for testing.


“The main reason we’re collecting the foxes is to contribute to UK disease testing requirements – in this case Echinococcus multilocularis (see Assessment of E. multilocularis surveillance reports 2015). We have also used your foxes to contribute to UK Trichinella testing. In both these cases, the UK has to prove disease-free status in order to trade livestock, and the fox is an easy source of tissue to test for environmental contamination.

Wherever possible we pass on tissue to labs where tests can be performed in order to enhance our understanding of disease/pathogen and even environmental contamination. However, I think your foxes have so far contributed to the above.

Regards,”


Also this for those that handle foxes, always use gloves as this was from a fox that succumbed to infection after a fight with either another fox or dog.

“30-04-2025
Streptococcus canis has been isolated in sparse, pure growth from the thoracic fluid and the spleen.
Streptococcus canis is carried in the mouth and gastrointestinal tract in dogs, foxes and a number of other species. It is a well recognised cause of severe, fatal infections. It is highly likely that the healing wounds on the chest were bite wounds from a fox or a dog. Penetration of the chest introduced the Streptococcus canis from the mouth into the chest cavity and led to pyothorax and septicaemia.”

Lastly this from an email 10 years ago.

The story of Fox around here has reached a very interesting stage. Years ago (i.e. in the 20th century) we had tons of them and they had become a real problem, even released ‘city’ foxes were a regular ‘take’ and the annual cull levels were often reaching a combined total in excess of 100 p.a. for just the parishes of XXXXXXXXX and YYYYYYY.

Then in the 90’s ‘brock’ started to really grow in numbers, such that fox numbers steadily dwindled. In 2013 I shot precisely four foxes and they were all shot because they made an unacceptable nuisance of themselves by frequenting a near neighbour’s hens, ducks and geese. Last year I shot only two, for the same reason. This year has been very educational. There is now sustained evidence of badger numbers tumbling, from want of food I think. Put simply I think that between them and those equally noisome ‘brown crows’, they’ve hit the available food sources so damned hard for so long that the resulting serious reduction in numbers of hedgehogs, ground nesting birds, brown hares, bunnies et al, has finally trimmed their sails. This year I am monitoring only three fox dens and I am practically on friendly terms with the vixen who patrols my poultry owning neighbour’s land. Since she behaves so well and does him no harm (and as an experiment) she’s allowed to stay… and she seems to keep all other, potentially ‘naughty’ foxes off her turf. Maybe she even educates some earth-pigs to good effect. The experiment continues. I suspect her cubs will decide the next policy.

I have to say though; it’s a truly depressing thing around here in spring these days. At one time May and June brought a veritable cacophony of wild bird calls, particularly in the evening…. Peewits, Curlews, Oystercatchers, Snipe, Grey Partridge, various Gulls, Duck, wild Pheasant and as a special treat on warm afternoons the song of one my personal favourites, the wee Skylark… high flying and often unseen, their song is/was my definition of Summer here … but all of these species are now pretty much gone from our land, save for the occasional plaintive call of a single bird or very rare pair. Incidentally magpies don't get to breed within about a mile of my house and one of those black and white feathered marauders is rarely seen here. Those that are spotted receive, wherever humanly possible, a quick injection of warm copper and lead. I find that 75 grains of .224” A-max, provides a very sound and rapid remedy. So, at least our hedge and tree dwelling bird species remain at good population levels. Although, there is even a new worry for them. I’ve recently discovered some grey tree-rats in the district for the first time. They obviously need some firm career advice. I think the No6 plan might be best.
 
Though retired I still do it for game bird protection ,it’s such a worthwhile endeavour.Sitting at dawn or dusk the sights and sounds can be truly amazing.Only last week I saw a goss hawk pick a squirrel up and settle with it 40 yard from me.I can study deer (they are recent arrivals with us) for hours.So enjoyable particularly with this spring weather.
 
The group I’m involved with supply SASA and APHA with shot foxes, preferably with undamaged livers for analysis.

Last year 44 foxes were supplied from the area and only 4 from the rest of Scotland.
SASA recently picked up 14 foxes.

The reason for testing.


“The main reason we’re collecting the foxes is to contribute to UK disease testing requirements – in this case Echinococcus multilocularis (see Assessment of E. multilocularis surveillance reports 2015). We have also used your foxes to contribute to UK Trichinella testing. In both these cases, the UK has to prove disease-free status in order to trade livestock, and the fox is an easy source of tissue to test for environmental contamination.

Wherever possible we pass on tissue to labs where tests can be performed in order to enhance our understanding of disease/pathogen and even environmental contamination. However, I think your foxes have so far contributed to the above.

Regards,”


Also this for those that handle foxes, always use gloves as this was from a fox that succumbed to infection after a fight with either another fox or dog.

“30-04-2025
Streptococcus canis has been isolated in sparse, pure growth from the thoracic fluid and the spleen.
Streptococcus canis is carried in the mouth and gastrointestinal tract in dogs, foxes and a number of other species. It is a well recognised cause of severe, fatal infections. It is highly likely that the healing wounds on the chest were bite wounds from a fox or a dog. Penetration of the chest introduced the Streptococcus canis from the mouth into the chest cavity and led to pyothorax and septicaemia.”

Lastly this from an email 10 years ago.

The story of Fox around here has reached a very interesting stage. Years ago (i.e. in the 20th century) we had tons of them and they had become a real problem, even released ‘city’ foxes were a regular ‘take’ and the annual cull levels were often reaching a combined total in excess of 100 p.a. for just the parishes of XXXXXXXXX and YYYYYYY.

Then in the 90’s ‘brock’ started to really grow in numbers, such that fox numbers steadily dwindled. In 2013 I shot precisely four foxes and they were all shot because they made an unacceptable nuisance of themselves by frequenting a near neighbour’s hens, ducks and geese. Last year I shot only two, for the same reason. This year has been very educational. There is now sustained evidence of badger numbers tumbling, from want of food I think. Put simply I think that between them and those equally noisome ‘brown crows’, they’ve hit the available food sources so damned hard for so long that the resulting serious reduction in numbers of hedgehogs, ground nesting birds, brown hares, bunnies et al, has finally trimmed their sails. This year I am monitoring only three fox dens and I am practically on friendly terms with the vixen who patrols my poultry owning neighbour’s land. Since she behaves so well and does him no harm (and as an experiment) she’s allowed to stay… and she seems to keep all other, potentially ‘naughty’ foxes off her turf. Maybe she even educates some earth-pigs to good effect. The experiment continues. I suspect her cubs will decide the next policy.

I have to say though; it’s a truly depressing thing around here in spring these days. At one time May and June brought a veritable cacophony of wild bird calls, particularly in the evening…. Peewits, Curlews, Oystercatchers, Snipe, Grey Partridge, various Gulls, Duck, wild Pheasant and as a special treat on warm afternoons the song of one my personal favourites, the wee Skylark… high flying and often unseen, their song is/was my definition of Summer here … but all of these species are now pretty much gone from our land, save for the occasional plaintive call of a single bird or very rare pair. Incidentally magpies don't get to breed within about a mile of my house and one of those black and white feathered marauders is rarely seen here. Those that are spotted receive, wherever humanly possible, a quick injection of warm copper and lead. I find that 75 grains of .224” A-max, provides a very sound and rapid remedy. So, at least our hedge and tree dwelling bird species remain at good population levels. Although, there is even a new worry for them. I’ve recently discovered some grey tree-rats in the district for the first time. They obviously need some firm career advice. I think the No6 plan might be best.

Can you not see what you are saying though ? You have foxes but very few ground nesters ? You are happy they are not eating chickens - do you not think they will be eating the last few ground nesters ?

As for foxes keeping other foxes off their patch - tbh what a lot of rubbish - i shot 130 and 127 or something off our 270 acres 3 and 4 years ago - you only need to watch springwatch if you can stomach it to see 5,6,7 different foxes sharing a carcass they put out
 
I have to say though; it’s a truly depressing thing around here in spring these days. At one time May and June brought a veritable cacophony of wild bird calls, particularly in the evening…. Peewits, Curlews, Oystercatchers, Snipe, Grey Partridge, various Gulls, Duck, wild Pheasant and as a special treat on warm afternoons the song of one my personal favourites, the wee Skylark…
That is very depressing indeed. Round me we have all the above species of birds.

Very noticeable on the edges of the grouse moors where all these birds thrive 👍

My local farms too still have Curlew, Lapwings, Grey partridge, Oystercatcher and skylark as I hammer the foxes so must be beneficial.
 
Can you not see what you are saying though ? You have foxes but very few ground nesters ? You are happy they are not eating chickens - do you not think they will be eating the last few ground nesters ?

As for foxes keeping other foxes off their patch - tbh what a lot of rubbish - i shot 130 and 127 or something off our 270 acres 3 and 4 years ago - you only need to watch springwatch if you can stomach it to see 5,6,7 different foxes sharing a carcass they put out
The email was from an old acquaintance who lived about 20miles away and has lived life and sees things through a different perspective.

Foxes have two options, either go where they know there is a supply of food albeit possibly awkward to get (as well as prey picking up the scraps around the chicken area). Or expand energy hunting which may be a hit or miss affair and not all their hunting trips will involve ground nesters.
I suppose it depends on how hungry the fox is.

At certain times of the year I can see a vixen seeing off other foxes if it’s to protect her cubs. After all it’s known that dens will be defended.
I know that male lions will kill offspring from another male if they take over a territory. Will an incoming dog fox tolerate another fox’s offspring? That I don’t know.

The owner of the small holding where I shoot, took 54 foxes off 5 acres the first year he took over the small holding.
So his ratio was 10 foxes per acre to you 1 fox per 2 acres.
Granted the foxes are transient rather than resident.

When I first got to know the owner there were no hares on his or the adjacent properties. Last year I counted 6 within a three hundred yard radius of the buildings, in fact I was watching one two days ago at 1:30 in the afternoon enjoying the sun. At the same time I heard 2 cock pheasants calling at opposite ends of the property.

The foxes in the area are now behaving differently now. Previously the foxes would go directly to points in the fence where they knew there was a crossing point. Now they wonder up and down the fence looking to cross.
Could it be an indication that suburban foxes are more predominant that country ones? In which case do they know where the territories are? Have they lived in the town so long that they have lost their instincts to identify when they should move on?

Fox behaviour will vary from area to area and what may be common in your area might be totally alien to the local foxes here.

A quick search on Google and came up with this, which I think is interesting reading.

 
And a worthy competitor is the Badger, 54 years observations tell me this is so.🧐

Believe me im no badger hugger / fan - but respectfully i think we have learnt more in the past 5 years with the advent and then seemingly constant improvement in thermal than the last 500 years
I have asked on several threads for any videos of badgers actively hunting - so far however none - with them being so far numerous i did expect to see a few clips tbh
 
Believe me im no badger hugger / fan - but respectfully i think we have learnt more in the past 5 years with the advent and then seemingly constant improvement in thermal than the last 500 years
I have asked on several threads for any videos of badgers actively hunting - so far however none - with them being so far numerous i did expect to see a few clips tbh
I've seen one my mate recorded where brock is ripping apart a chicken , very ferocious.

Unfortunately I don't have a copy.
 
Back
Top