Softer-shooting than .308?

[Emilio]

If you want to go down in weight for caliber, i suspect non fragmenting non leads like the fox classic hunters and barnes ttsx might be good initial options to look at.
But there are several threads on here discussing the different brands of non leads, and some of them might even be caliber specific too, i believe.

I doubt it will be a problem finding already loaded options for barnes in the NLs in 308, and maybe not fox either, as the 308 is so popular. In fact if you're not reloading, and cant find help for it either, that might be another reason to stay with the 308, if you're going for light for caliber non lead loads in the future.

Will look in to some options. Hope I am able to find something affordable, with range shooting it can get pricey pretty quick.
A quick look on a couple of sites shows that this will probably turn out tp be a challenge...

 

[Scipio]

Will look in to some options. Hope I am able to find something affordable, with range shooting it can get pricey pretty quick.
A quick look on a couple of sites shows that this will probably turn out tp be a challenge...

Hello again Emilio,

Well, if the NLs is anything like Denmark, where i am based, buying and shooting pre loaded non leads can get very expensive. That, and because i shoot calibers which arnt as common as the 308, is why i have turned to reloading myself. However that carries with it an intial extra cost too of course.

Now I must humbly admit not to know the shooting scene, or the legal circumstances of reloading in the NLs, so caveats do apply, but if you and Samantha have a shooting range, or even better, a shooting club that you belong to, and where you typically practice shooting, finding someone there who reloads, and who can maybe help you find the right load for Samantha and her Blaser, and then load for you for a decent price, might be the best solution.

If that isnt possible, then finding cheap light for caliber training ammo like for example the one seen here: Sellier & Bellot 308 FMJ 8.0g/124gr 50stk (2958) and then save the more expensive pre loaded light for caliber non leads for hunting could also be an option.

Plz do keep us update on how you eventually manage to resolve this, and the very best of luck from me!

Knæk og bræk!

 

[enfieldspares]

I still think the cheapest solution is to get an different (possible third party if not genuine Blaser) stock of a style that can have weight added from the rear of the butt and lead load it!

 

[Emilio]

Hello again Emilio,

Well, if the NLs is anything like Denmark, where i am based, buying and shooting pre loaded non leads can get very expensive. That, and because i shoot calibers which arnt as common as the 308, is why i have turned to reloading myself. However that carries with it an intial extra cost too of course.

Now I must humbly admit not to know the shooting scene, or the legal circumstances of reloading in the NLs, so caveats do apply, but if you and Samantha have a shooting range, or even better, a shooting club that you belong to, and where you typically practice shooting, finding someone there who reloads, and who can maybe help you find the right load for Samantha and her Blaser, and then load for you for a decent price, might be the best solution.

If that isnt possible, then finding cheap light for caliber training ammo like for example the one seen here: Sellier & Bellot 308 FMJ 8.0g/124gr 50stk (2958) and then save the more expensive pre loaded light for caliber non leads for hunting could also be an option.

Plz do keep us update on how you eventually manage to resolve this, and the very best of luck from me!

Knæk og bræk!

I am guessing there will not be a big difference with prices inside the EU, so I agree it will probably be a bit too costly.

Reloding for now is no option, we are in the middle of a big renovation, which limits useable space for now. When we are further along it probably will happen, but not for now. Besides the space, there is indeed the investment but also the time involved to get everything right. Because of the renovation, getting our hunting licences sorted, doing dsc-1 time is also a bit limited. So realistly, reloading will take at least 2 years.
We may be able to find somebody to reload for us, but I do not realy like to be depending on somebody else for our shooting and would like to buy something we are able to shoot regardless. So in my opinion the option we choose has to also work with factory ammo.

The 124gr you linked I had also found, but that did not do all that well in the online calculator I used. Will have to give the other calculator linked somewhere above a go, see if that gives a better outcome. If so, we will definitively give it a go.

And thanks! Hou je op de hoogte!

 

[Emilio]

I still think the cheapest solution is to get an different (possible third party if not genuine Blaser) stock of a style that can have weight added from the rear of the butt and lead load it!

Lugging around a heavy gun while stalking has the same medical risks as shooting heavy loads. So as light and soft as possible is the way to go.

 

[NoIDeer]

Not sure if it's been said, why not get two calibers? You put far more strain on everything at the range a smaller calibre could lower the assault on your body massively.

 

[Emilio]

Not sure if it's been said, why not get two calibers? You put far more strain on everything at the range a smaller calibre could lower the assault on your body massively.

That is an option, but a costly one. Should be somewhere above. For now we have to choose one calibre and 6.5 is the smallest legally possible for hunting.

 

[jthyttin]

I only read first 3 pages since there were apparent difficulties to ask the correct question and understand the problem.

First, say it aloud if you have a R8 and want to stick with it.

Secondly, please understand that something else might be better.

Thirdly, lay down all the other facts also, like are there energy / velocity / bullet weight limits in addition to 6.5mm or larger that you implied you want to use.

In addition, everybody doesn't read intro's etc. so it might be good to express your relation to the OP (before post #45) if somebody is "putting their spoon in to the soup" and argue the comments.

Now we can take a look at the solution:

- find what is the least bullet weight and terminal velocity you're comfortable with (from the hunting perspective)
- find what is the way to achieve that with least momentum at the muzzle (energy is not preserved, momentum is)
- find out, from the person who suggested to limit the impact on body, whether mercury recoil reducers are acceptable
- find what is the most weight in a rifle you're content with, including balance and the recoil reducers if acceptable

Now you can go and find a rifle to satisfy the above.

 

[big ears]

Due to an injury from a car accident, I would like to reduce recoil. I currently use a .308 with a muzzle brake. I'm looking for a softer-shooting caliber suitable for general hunting.

In the Netherlands, the legal minimum caliber for hunting anything bigger than roe deer is 6.5 mm.
I've read mixed reviews about the 6.5 Creedmoor.

Who can give me advice about low-recoil hunting caliber(s)?

Look at 7mm for definite. Keeps your options open if you want to look at bigger quarry.
For me the 7x57 is a good balance. Mild recoil and good bullet performance. The 7-08 is the shorter action version but can be harder to come by. The 7x64 is quite snappy and more like the 308.

 

[HonestJohn]

Having owned most of all mentioned - 6.5x55, .308, 7x57, 7-08, etc there’s so little in it recoil wise that you’re wasting your time.

The 6.5 Grendel is your easy answer, but you’ll need a custom barrel or alternative rifle.

The other answer is to get rid of the R8 (thank me later), and get a stock that fits really well, with a good recoil pad and mercury tube system installed to absorb recoil. Carbon fibre stocks, although light, absorb recoil very well, so in something like the 6.5grendel, you’d have a light to carry rifle, legal, no noise and no recoil.

Unless you make a big change as suggested, you’re spending money to gain virtually nothing

 

[ejg]

R8 is quite heavy indeed, but at the moment I cannot hold any rifle up no matter the weight. The R8 suits me, I can shoot very well with it. Shooting sitting, lying down or from sticks works all good for me.

We have a scope, because we use the R8 for shooting long range and hunting.

The way a rifle is set up will play a big role how she will recoil. Most hunting rifles have their centre of gravity well below the line of the bore making them difficult to shoot accurately and the muzzle flip will give you a fright as the scope rotates towards the eye. A much heavier scope possibly even mounted a bit higher reduces this. With the centre of gravity closer to the bore your rifle will recoil straighter and make for nicer shooting and will have better precision overall. This will be the case for any recoiling cartridge. I also think a 6.5CM with say 120 - 130gr will have quite a bit less recoil than the 308. For stalking ranges the 308 is the better hunting cartridge...... with a little more recoil. We are designing a balance device for rifle at the moment that we will introduce at Shot Show in Jan 26. This device will show the state of balance that a rifle has.
edi

 

[nun_hunter]

6.5cm makes sense if that’s the minimum calibre, plenty of factory ammo if that’s a concern plus light loads down to 100gr. Always been a fan of .260 but it basically does the same thing.

Have you tried lighter loads in .308? I find the 130gr pretty mild to shoot

Bit of a nerd also, so much appreciated.

We just starting of with hunting, but we will probably be hunting in NL (stangely enough likely hardest to get a chance here on bigger game), DE, FR and the UK to start of, so besides deer species (reds being the biggest) we will most likely be hunting boar also.

As stated we also shoot for sports, so softer loads are possible as long as they are perfectly stable. But I would prefer to not have to big of a difference if possible, to have a better feel with the riffle when hunting.

We have a new riffle on order and can choose from a lot of calibres. It is an extra, a gift from me to Sam, with the medical advice for low recoil in mind. We could even, after a little saving up, buy another 308 barrel should we go for another calibre now.

Please keep the feedback coming, it helps the decisionmaking proces along.

From everything you and your wife have said the Creedmoor will tick all your boxes of less recoil, great accuracy, available ammo, good for target shooting etc.

Just going with lighter bullets in a 308, while it will reduce recoil it won't reduce it as much for a given weight of bullet compared to a bullet with a smaller diameter/bearing face. To put it simply, a short fat bullet (120g 308) will be much easier to accelerate up to a faster velocity than a longer and narrower bullet (12g 6.5mm) assuming other variables are the same. This means that the recoil will be more from the 308 than the 6.5 (as shown in the post by @Selous

This is why a "fatter" bullet is often used in a shorter barrel to get the same velocity. Such as using a 338 Federal with a 200g bullet in a 16" barreled rifle to replicate the velocity of a 200g bullet from a 308 in a much longer barrel. Obviously you sacrifice some BC with the wider bullet for the same weight but for most hunting this isn't an issue and as your wife wants to do some target shooting the step down to a 6.5mm makes even more sense.

 

[tackb]

Having owned most of all mentioned - 6.5x55, .308, 7x57, 7-08, etc there’s so little in it recoil wise that you’re wasting your time.

The 6.5 Grendel is your easy answer, but you’ll need a custom barrel or alternative rifle.

The other answer is to get rid of the R8 (thank me later), and get a stock that fits really well, with a good recoil pad and mercury tube system installed to absorb recoil. Carbon fibre stocks, although light, absorb recoil very well, so in something like the 6.5grendel, you’d have a light to carry rifle, legal, no noise and no recoil.

Unless you make a big change as suggested, you’re spending money to gain virtually nothing

the grendel whilst an excellent calibre may struggle with their energy requirements to be legal

 

[Polar Lynx]

If Emilio has a proven medical issue perhaps the gun licence department may accept an exception for a moderator.
If 6,5 is the lowest possible then go for one. Recoil is both about energy backwards and imagined recoil.

 

[nun_hunter]

the point Im making is that if your sending the same weight bullet at the same speed then the diameter of the bullet makes not one jot of a difference to the recoil.

How fast the bullet accelerates has a big impact on recoil. A bullet of the same weight but a larger diameter is easier to accelerate in a given distance compared to a longer thinner bucket of the same weight. Usually a longer bullet (same weight but smaller diameter) will utilise a slower powder and lo ger barrel to achieve the same velocity meaning less felt recoil.

 

[Emilio]

If Emilio has a proven medical issue perhaps the gun licence department may accept an exception for a moderator.
If 6,5 is the lowest possible then go for one. Recoil is both about energy backwards and imagined recoil.

It was Sams question, so her issue.
In holland no exceptions on regs will be accepted. It will not be allowed in fear of creating a precedent.

For now I think we will start of with checking which light loads our current .308 is able to shoot well and test those to get an idea of the difference in recoil and simultaniously keep trying to find a 6.5 CM or SE to test.

 

[tackb]

It was Sams question, so her issue.
In holland no exceptions on regs will be accepted. It will not be allowed in fear of creating a precedent.

For now I think we will start of with checking which light loads our current .308 is able to shoot well and test those to get an idea of the difference in recoil and simultaniously keep trying to find a 6.5 CM or SE to test.

also , not all muzzle breaks are equal

 

[Kalahari]

What, if any, are the legal requirements for muzzle velocity, energy and minimum bullet weight in the Netherlands? As far as I can see you want a 6.5mm or larger but no other requirement given. This will affect the advice given.

David.

 

[Bowland blades]

Due to an injury from a car accident, I would like to reduce recoil. I currently use a .308 with a muzzle brake. I'm looking for a softer-shooting caliber suitable for general hunting.

In the Netherlands, the legal minimum caliber for hunting anything bigger than roe deer is 6.5 mm.
I've read mixed reviews about the 6.5 Creedmoor.

Who can give me advice about low-recoil hunting caliber(s)?

is it legal to use 100 grain bullets ? Can you handle a bit more weight into the Butt of the Rifle ? sound Moderator ? . If these could all be employed to reduce recoil but will add weight .

 

[Kalahari]

also , not all muzzle breaks are equal

Pedant alert, muzzle brakes! Sorry just one of my finger nails down a blackboard things!!!

David.