I was but the lack of consultation made me leave , what difference does it make if I’m a member or not as regards this shambles ?
Lead ammunition restrictions - government announcement
- Thread starter Conor O'Gorman
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Unwarranted?? You’ve rude rough shod over members then have the gall to start name calling ?? Have you thought of a career as a Labour politician sir ?
Dunwaters
Well-Known Member
You are absolutely right.I'd imagine that will only take a few questions and a bit of lobbying pressure thou?
After all no one would ask the WHO that before it becomes normal.
Like i said will be just like the General Licences an endless battle trying to defend
U know they make water pipes out of lead right?
I mean wot could be safer?
Just saying.
I
U also used to make weedkiller out of copper.
In the old days i was told they would put a copper strip on top of the roif to try to stip moss growing on it.
And they say trees really dontvlike copper nails ( never tried it myself) but if a copper nail kills a tree u dont want to be hanging ur zeroing target on a tree.
Some livestock species can be very susceptable to copper both deficancies and too much.
In reality no one knows wot will happen if and when folk start to actually ingest steel or copper.
I dare say just like lead no one really knows.
Possibly even with steel will the exact mix matter??
We do however have hundreds of years ingesting lead with little to no side effects.
I’m completely convinced.
I'd imagine that will only take a few questions and a bit of lobbying pressure thou?
After all no one would ask the WHO that before it becomes normal.
Like i said will be just like the General Licences an endless battle trying to defend
U know they make water pipes out of lead right?
I mean wot could be safer?
Just saying.
U also used to make weedkiller out of copper.
In the old days i was told they would put a copper strip on top of the roif to try to stip moss growing on it.
And they say trees really dontvlike copper nails ( never tried it myself) but if a copper nail kills a tree u dont want to be hanging ur zeroing target on a tree.
Some livestock species can be very susceptable to copper both deficancies and too much.
In reality no one knows wot will happen if and when folk start to actually ingest steel or copper.
I dare say just like lead no one really knows.
Possibly even with steel will the exact mix matter??
We do however have hundreds of years ingesting lead with little to no side effects.
The thing is with copper that plants / animals actually need some of it - lead they dont
No - its use is potentially to be banned - the end
Mate uses copper all the time and finds its very effective - found it causes more bruising with his creed than me using lead however on roe with my .270
We dont shoot many however so others may / will have better experience
Your mate using the copper rounds in a .243 ?
Conor O'Gorman
Well-Known Member
It matters because 9 organisations announced the voluntary transition away from lead shot for live quarry shooting so why single out BASC? As for consultation there has been over 5 years of that including on this forum. On the topic of consultations did you reply to any of the HSE consultations?
If you are referring to my post highlighting the hypocrisy in stating that BASC has always opposed lead shot restrictions when you have routinely posted in favour of such restrictions and spent multiple hours detailing ingestion rates of lead in various bird populations while failing to quantify the effect of such ingestion that is hardly BASC bashing. It is instead drawing attention to an uncomfortable reality that contradicts your generalisation that BASC has always opposed restrictions on the use of lead ammunition. From your own past posts it is evident that your own part has been to justify restrictions and in doing so misrepresented what was and still is BASC’s official stance on the subject. I take it that the views you expressed in support of further restrictions were unofficial in nature.
A simple google should bring up substantial data that confirms that the major contribution made on shooting forums by BASC’s representatives regarding the lead shot issue was speaking out in support of further restrictions by highlighting the incidence of lead shot ingestion.
Earlier in this thread @enfieldspares highlighted an exchange with yourself where you stated your concern for the number of birds that may be at risk from one shot at a rat with a 9mm rimfire shot cartridge. A second example was your tall tale of a jackdaw being shot at over wetlands and which resulted in the death of “two prized pintail” due to the shot from the cartridge aimed at the jackdaw being ingested by the two birds.
In conclusion BASC bashing ? No . Calling out hypocrisy and the failure to be accountable for opinions expressed ? YES.
Edit to add Google minefields of lead for poor wee partridges for an example of emotive pro restriction sentiment
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I did , then I joined the one org who saw this as an attack on shooting the sga , the thing is if you put yourself out there as the “ voice of shooting “ sorry I’ll try and stop laughing
be prepared for people pointing out your failures , I refuse to believe constant capitulation is the answerWhitefront
Well-Known Member
I have just read the SGA's apocalyptic statement on the forthcoming ban. I can only presume they are going to spend the next few years preparing their tiny membership for a future without any shooting - and certainly no role for gamekeepers - given that non-lead ammo is allegedly a threat to human life and inhumane, to boot. Either that, or they know they are spouting nonsense but intend to keep currying favour with the tiny, dwindling band of lead-heads whose fervent support give them a meaning in life. They really don't seem to care about the future of shooting.
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Hopefully one day we will have a shooting organisation with the capability to match the pro grouse shooting stance taken by Rishi Sunak and the other members of parliament recently. It’s time wild justice, RSPB and WWT were put on the back foot. Start by highlighting the extent of predator control on RSPB reserves ,that should inject a bit of context and a reality check for contributors to for example Raptor Persecution UK who would gladly see the end of all live animal shooting tomorrow. Let’s see a level playing field with no uncomfortable inconvenient facts brushed under the carpet.
Nice stereotyping , do you consider that the risks entailed in the use of lead ammunition on a walked up shoot where all the game taken is consumed by those shooting merits a total lead ban, just imagine for a minute that the scale of pheasant release wasn’t numbered in millions and that shot game as a marketable commodity was no longer. Under those circumstances do you think that the case for a total ban would be as strong as you seem to think it is now ?
Conor O'Gorman
Well-Known Member
When did you join the SGA??I did , then I joined the one org who saw this as an attack on shooting the sga , the thing is if you put yourself out there as the “ voice of shooting “ sorry I’ll try and stop laughing
Whitefront
Well-Known Member
Yes.
The only reason we are not facing a total ban is because BASC have managed to negotiate exemptions.
I haven't used lead for any type of shooting for years. Like so many, I would never go back to it. Taken overall, shooting doesn't need lead - which is just as well, as lead ammunition has no future.
The SGA's stupid scaremongering comments about non-lead ammo are liable to be used to tarnish the whole shooting community in years to come.
Conor O'Gorman
Well-Known Member
BASC has not done that, your assertions are hyperbole. BASC is run by its members for its members with strategy and policy set by its elected Council. The members can hold Council to account via AGMs and EGMs. If you were a BASC member and disagreed with the voluntary transition what did you do?
On that point Conor, I have previously asked who came up with the idea, I understand that 9 organisations signed, I don't think they all had the same idea at the same time, so, which of the 9 organisations suggested it please?
Thats the thing though, we are having less and less available
A couple of years ago I reckon and here’s why
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