Suggested copper for 308

[Leec6.5]

You don’t like lighter copper bullets because of the increased meat damage, yet you don’t bother using the shoulders? Is that not contradictory?

Not at all I used to bone all the shoulders many moons ago, but these days I don’t have the time for it so I sling the front end but a heavy copper bullet would be far more beneficial than a light one going at light speed.

What you have to remember if you didn’t already know is I’ve been shooting copper bullets for over 15 years, across now 4 different calibres (6.5x55, 270 win, 30-06 ans now 7x57) I have half an idea of what I’m up to

And yes you are quite correct, I do hate light bullets the heaviest bullet I shot admittedly with the 270 was 130 grain that is only because I could not get 150’s to group, for the 6.5 x 55 I had to drop to 120s purely because I needed extra range and I hated it with a passion, so I went back to 140’s.

All barnes TTSX

I basically detest light bullets going fast if you’re gonna do that go shoot foxes you don’t need light and fast bullets to shoot deer effectively but each to their own.

 

[Selous]

Not at all I used to bone all the shoulders many moons ago, but these days I don’t have the time for it so I sling the front end but a heavy copper bullet would be far more beneficial than a light one going at light speed.

What you have to remember if you didn’t already know is I’ve been shooting copper bullets for over 15 years, across now 4 different calibres (6.5x55, 270 win, 30-06 ans now 7x57) I have half an idea of what I’m up to

And yes you are quite correct, I do hate light bullets the heaviest bullet I shot admittedly with the 270 was 130 grain that is only because I could not get 150’s to group, for the 6.5 x 55 I had to drop to 120s purely because I needed extra range and I hated it with a passion, so I went back to 140’s.

All barnes TTSX

I basically detest light bullets going fast if you’re gonna do that go shoot foxes you don’t need light and fast bullets to shoot deer effectively but each to their own.

Interesting, can I ask what you used in the 06 and what you didn’t like about the 120g 6.5x55? I am going over this exact ground at the moment and found the 120g TTSX to give narrow wound channels and poor blood trails.

 

[Leec6.5]

Interesting, can I ask what you used in the 06 and what you didn’t like about the 120g 6.5x55? I am going over this exact ground at the moment and found the 120g TTSX to give narrow wound channels and poor blood trails.

In the 30-06 its was the lapua Naturalis 165gn but I’m hoping to be corrected on that been a long time, that is a bullet if I could get hold of for reliably I would use wholesale full stop End of subject.

And with the 120 in 6.5x55 it was purely I was stretching it on lowland red deer to its effective limits, I was shooting Hinds 300+ with a 6.5 x 55 that just doesn’t work sold it for 270 problem solved, after I bought the 270 I shot the 6.5 with 140 for a little while and then I sold it again. I didn’t need.

 

[Mike1979]

Not at all I used to bone all the shoulders many moons ago, but these days I don’t have the time for it so I sling the front end but a heavy copper bullet would be far more beneficial than a light one going at light speed.

What you have to remember if you didn’t already know is I’ve been shooting copper bullets for over 15 years, across now 4 different calibres (6.5x55, 270 win, 30-06 ans now 7x57) I have half an idea of what I’m up to

And yes you are quite correct, I do hate light bullets the heaviest bullet I shot admittedly with the 270 was 130 grain that is only because I could not get 150’s to group, for the 6.5 x 55 I had to drop to 120s purely because I needed extra range and I hated it with a passion, so I went back to 140’s.

All barnes TTSX

I basically detest light bullets going fast if you’re gonna do that go shoot foxes you don’t need light and fast bullets to shoot deer effectively but each to their own.

Lee ...sorry if this is has been asked before (and for once Im not taking the pee) ..do you normally pin your deer through the front shoulders (on the basis that you dont worry about damage) or do you opt for standard heart and lung shots? Ta

 

[Leec6.5]

Lee ...sorry if this is has been asked before (and for once Im not taking the pee) ..do you normally pin your deer through the front shoulders (on the basis that you dont worry about damage) or do you opt for standard heart and lung shots? Ta

Go back 15 years ago to about 5 years ago, front end, bullet, bang nowadays I’m a little bit more picky because I’m not shooting at range anymore. You go back to the early years when I was proper whacking and stacking mercilessly. I was busting shoulders and looking for the next target and then the next and then the next, and then the next.

I was shooting 5-10 red deer a week back then over sugar beet, I needed a bullet that would do the job do it effectively with minimal fuss and damage and when I was pinning shoulders with my 270 and 130hn Barnes TTSX the exit with bruising was the size of a £2 coin

I’m semi retired now so I can be more favourable with my shot placements Should I wish to, I’m a busy man and I don’t have time to bone and shoulders anymore.

 

[Mike1979]

Go back 15 years ago to about 5 years ago, front end, bullet, bang nowadays I’m a little bit more picky because I’m not shooting at range anymore. You go back to the early years when I was proper whacking and stacking mercilessly. I was busting shoulders and looking for the next target and then the next and then the next, and then the next.

I was shooting 5-10 red deer a week back then over sugar beet, I needed a bullet that would do the job do it effectively with minimal fuss and damage and when I was pinning shoulders with my 270 and 130hn Barnes TTSX the exit with bruising was the size of a £2 coin

I’m semi retired now so I can be more favourable with my shot placements Should I wish to, I’m a busy man and I don’t have time to bone and shoulders anymore.

Ta. Just started shooting copper in the Gaymoor and havent changed anything with bullet placement vs lead but always interested in the more experienced (old farts ) views. Cheers

 

[Selous]

In the 30-06 its was the lapua Naturalis 165gn but I’m hoping to be corrected on that been a long time, that is a bullet if I could get hold of for reliably I would use wholesale full stop End of subject.

And with the 120 in 6.5x55 it was purely I was stretching it on lowland red deer to its effective limits, I was shooting Hinds 300+ with a 6.5 x 55 that just doesn’t work sold it for 270 problem solved, after I bought the 270 I shot the 6.5 with 140 for a little while and then I sold it again. I didn’t need.

Really helpful, your reply is appreciated

 

[Leec6.5]

Ta. Just started shooting copper in the Gaymoor and havent changed anything with bullet placement vs lead but always interested in the more experienced (old farts ) views. Cheers

my advice is if you’re not loading the bullet yourself and you’re using factory, shoot them how you normally would you will soon learn either way if it does the job or it doesn’t and I’m afraid that’s the only way to learn.

Like I’ve said before back when I started shooting copper all I had was a Barnes reloading manual, there was none of this light bullets go fast malarkey, I just loaded the bullet up got it to group with what powder I had in stock at the time and killed deer

 

[Mike1979]

my advice is if you’re not loading the bullet yourself and you’re using factory, shoot them how you normally would you will soon learn either way if it does the job or it doesn’t and I’m afraid that’s the only way to learn.

Like I’ve said before back when I started shooting copper all I had was a Barnes reloading manual, there was none of this light bullets go fast malarkey, I just loaded the bullet up got it to group with what powder I had in stock at the time and killed deer

Cheers Only shot 4 with copper so far so a little limited experience but all 4 are dead and only 1 ran about 30 yards (quartering shot through front shoulder and chest).

 

[Leec6.5]

Cheers Only shot 4 with copper so far so a little limited experience but all 4 are dead and only 1 ran about 30 yards (quartering shot through front shoulder and chest).

Done the job then

 

[Mike1979]

Done the job then

No complaints thus far. Nowt challenging so lets see how we go (80 yard heart, 25 yard head, 30 yard chest and 170 yard pinning shot (deer had a hanging front leg - hit by a car so needed to get it on the deck).

 

[Rutland lad]

Really helpful, your reply is appreciated

I struggled so much to obtain a good group during load development in 6.5x55 with 120 grain Barnes TSX that I gave up and went onto 123 grain Fox Classic Hunter. Should’ve done it earlier and saved myself lots of time, money and powder.

 

[CookM]

I buy any box of anything and reload it,on woodland deer up to 150 yards ,they all fall over through my t3x varmint.

Have reloaded ppu Zgrom 170gr,at the start,these may stop the pigs firmly l would suggest.

Try some different ones,find your confident reload for deer ,and boar possibly a dissimilar loading.
Use those, shoot,be confident in your bench work.

 

[CookM]

Am I the only one on here who would shoot a 150gn bullet?

All the posts bar mine are all light, the bread and butter weight for the 308 is 150gn lead or copper, lighter bullets usually means faster bullets which equals damage in my non educated opinion

No,you are not alone.
I started non lead with tsx 150gr and 168gr.
Ppu 170gr Zgrom and have other"heavies".
Have shot roe,fallow and munties.
No real damage and very quickly on the ground.
I have a box of light Fox factory but working my way through reloads from part boxes from the classifieds.
Not saying the conventional wisdom is wrong,but dead is dead.

 

[Heym SR20]

No,you are not alone.
I started non lead with tsx 150gr and 168gr.
Ppu 170gr Zgrom and have other"heavies".
Have shot roe,fallow and munties.
No real damage and very quickly on the ground.
I have a box of light Fox factory but working my way through reloads from part boxes from the classifieds.
Not saying the conventional wisdom is wrong,but dead is dead.

I can’t help feeling that many completely overthink this subject. As you say dead is dead. And in the vast majority of cases you don’t need sub MOA accuracy. If you can hit a coke can, large cooking apple etc then thats more than adequate for deer. And deer don’t work very well for very long with a bullet sized hole through their vital organs.

 

[Leec6.5]

No,you are not alone.
I started non lead with tsx 150gr and 168gr.
Ppu 170gr Zgrom and have other"heavies".
Have shot roe,fallow and munties.
No real damage and very quickly on the ground.
I have a box of light Fox factory but working my way through reloads from part boxes from the classifieds.
Not saying the conventional wisdom is wrong,but dead is dead.

At last, someone with some common sense on this bloody forum!

Light fast bullets only mean one thing in my opinion, and that is people who don’t know how to shoot at range with heavy bullets, they try to iron out the inconsistencies over distance by going light taking the need to think away, where as if you know what you’re doing you can shoot a brick at 300 yards as long as you know the drop not really rocket science

 

[Selous]

At last, someone with some common sense on this bloody forum!

Light fast bullets only mean one thing in my opinion, and that is people who don’t know how to shoot at range with heavy bullets, they try to iron out the inconsistencies over distance by going light taking the need to think away, where as if you know what you’re doing you can shoot a brick at 300 yards as long as you know the drop not really rocket science

Not necessarily, many many years ago when I first started with non lead bullets some time between 2000 and 2002 I bought a 7mm Rem Mag which I grew to love dearly. I loaded it with 160 grain lead bullets that shot well but were messy so then changed to the 140 grain Barnes TSX. They killed OK, about the same as a 150 grain soft point from my .308 but lacked the lightning bolt drop to the shot effect that I had read about in an article written by Ross Seyfried in the American Guns and Ammo that I had picked up. When my bullet stock dwindled I tried the 120 grain TTSX and noticed a massive difference. All of a sudden deer were folding up and staying where they stood, I had no difficult tracks (I had no dog at that time) and my life had got much easier. Choosing to go light and fast was nothing to do with trajectory and everything to do with terminal effect. I saw no problems with lack of penetration or surface wounds as everything I shot had entrance and exit with a good blood trail that was virtually never needed. Meat damage was slightly greater than the 140g TSX but not excessive at all and certainly far less than the 150 and 165 grain Hornady interlocks in my .308 or the 162g SSTs in the 7mm that I had been using at the time. I simply saw no disadvantage to the lighter bullets and no tangible advantage to using heavier bullets. Now 23 years later I have still never recovered a bullet from a deer I have shot, and I have shot deer from close in out to 400m which is beyond the range I prefer to shoot at. Not saying slower and heavy is wrong at all, just reporting an alternative experience.