Failure to renew???

[Brittany boy]

They don’t want to issue sec. 7 as this is traceable and a freedom of information request would show how many times they had failed to meet the time constraints which is their fault. This is why they turn it back onto the licence holder , who not wishing to rock the boat and be seen as unreasonable takes the financial hit and inconvenience. The shooting organisations need to take this on board.

 

[spanj]

Covers the last 10 years, Interesting ,my force wants the last 67 years worth

Ridiculous and a significant part of the (self inflicted) admin burden

 

[spanj]

It’s really not acceptable - this is extremely poor service and as always the costs only go one way - and that’s up.

Why should law abiding certificate holders have to cover the costs for storing firearms when it’s completely outwith their control? The costs should be burdened by the police as an incentive for them to do a better job.

100%

 

[spanj]

They don’t want to issue sec. 7 as this is traceable and a freedom of information request would show how many times they had failed to meet the time constraints which is their fault. This is why they turn it back onto the licence holder , who not wishing to rock the boat and be seen as unreasonable takes the financial hit and inconvenience. The shooting organisations need to take this on board.

This. We are our own worst enemy

 

[shortshot]

I don’t think it would be unreasonable to take a few days to lodge with a rfd. Most aren’t open 7 days a week. So if told the day before expiry that they won’t be renewing (having met all timescales yourself ) it is most likely you will be in breach.
It would be upsetting but interesting to know the outcome of letting it lapse for a day or two.

However there is a veiled warning under section 1. of the original post. ie. Possession without a valid cert. (under any circumstances) is non negotiable as very problematic!
D&C give automatic time extension for renewals because of inefficiencies. You expect the new licence any day, right up to there self imposed deadline. It is a cliff edge, then out of the blue they ring you at 9am and say “You need to lodge your firearms today before midnight.”
Fortunately he is self employed and it was possible to rearrange his day.

 

[Lever357]

I have just joined Country Cover Club as a premium member to have £250,000 of legal expenses cover. For £1.15 per week, it is not worth being without as I presume this is the type of situation they would deal with

 

[Essexsussex]

I have just joined Country Cover Club as a premium member to have £250,000 of legal expenses cover. For £1.15 per week, it is not worth being without as I presume this is the type of situation they would deal with

Would they though? You’d still have to lodge your firearms somewhere if you wanted to avoid an AR visit even if you had legal representation, no lawyer can fix something like this with the 24hrs notice given. Might help with the aftermath.

 

[Lever357]

Would they though? You’d still have to lodge your firearms somewhere if you wanted to avoid an AR visit even if you had legal representation, no lawyer can fix something like this with the 24hrs notice given. Might help with the aftermath.

I wasn't meaning on the day!! Join before you need them and then in this situation, I would have contacted them when the police refused to issue a Section 7.

 

[Confidis]

Thinking on this if the police are being less than helpful during the failure of their duties.
If you have to store your weapons.
Buy one or two 2nd hand cabinets pack your guns in the cabinet (s) pack/stuff bubble wrap between them . Deliver to police on a little wheelie trolley. They can have a look . But no keys for them .
Probably won't end well but you get my point.

 

[shortshot]

Without a revocation there is no appeal hence no automatic route to challenge injustice.
The effect of failing to renew on time is the same effect but without safeguard of appeal process.
So question is does one do as BASC says “be patient.” Or seek to sue your County Police service for unreasonable/unlawful behaviour??

 

[Smellydog]

My advice is to communicate in writing or email regularly enquiring how the process is progressing. That way you have a paper trail that exposes any short coming on their part and emphasises your diligence.
If they think you don't care they won't either until oh **** , his license has expired and they toss the grenade in your lap.
If they then revoke your licence you can advise them that you will be submitting your evidence to a defence lawyer.
That should get it fixed pronto.

 

[VSS]

I would not remove my guns to an RFD if my certificate were to lapse through no fault of my own. Period.
The furthest I would be prepared to go (under extreme duress) would be to lodge my cabinet keys with either an RFD or my solicitor.

 

[weblyish]

Not trying to be argumentative but I would love to see how all those people who suggest sending an invoice for storage in to the plod behave when it is them and their guns

 

[shortshot]

I would not remove my guns to an RFD if my certificate were to lapse through no fault of my own. Period.
The furthest I would be prepared to go (under extreme duress) would be to lodge my cabinet keys with either an RFD or my solicitor.

Fail to see a discernible difference other than risking armed response and angle grinder home invasion by defying there sect.1 edict in OP.

 

[VSS]

Fail to see a discernible difference other than risking armed response and angle grinder home invasion by defying there sect.1 edict in OP.

I don’t think it would come to that, to be honest.
I think there's a lot of drama queens who comment on threads like this.
Most things can be sorted out. Firearms licensing staff are human, believe it or not.

 

[Chris Richardson]

And now we see gents as I posted on the other thread what happens when we let them walk all over us / give unreasonable conditions

 

[Chris Richardson]

I don’t think it would come to that, to be honest.
I think there's a lot of drama queens who comment on threads like this.
Most things can be sorted out. Firearms licensing staff are human, believe it or not.

No offence to you Tim but it seems your opinion is “ I’ve always had good advice and reasonable FEOs so everyone’s must be “ I’m happy for you that you have but I can assure you that’s not the case

 

[VSS]

No offence to you Tim but it seems your opinion is “ I’ve always had good advice and reasonable FEOs so everyone’s must be “ I’m happy for you that you have but I can assure you that’s not the case

Maybe you're right, but I can't help thinking that a lot of FAC holders and wannabe FAC holders don't really help themselves in these situations.
I think FEOs have quite a difficult job, really. But I've always found that through a combination of honesty and humour I've got exactly what I wanted within a reasonable timeframe. There's a fair bit of psychology involved I suppose: He's trying to assess you, but you also have to assess him in order to pitch yourself at the right level.

Let me tell you a tale:
A little while back, I posted this:

A couple of days ago I shot a very large and very angry cow with my .243. It dropped on the spot. I don't see that an elk can really be that much harder to kill, can it?

(Incidentally, in case anyone's wondering why I didn't choose to use the mighty .270 for such a task, it's because my .243 is moderated, and it was one of those situations where you don't really want to draw too much attention to yourself. Particularly as I was shooting across a road. And it wasn't my cow).

There was a lot more to the story than that obviously, but the bottom line is that I was acting outside the conditions of my FAC.
I told the story to my FEO at my recent renewal visit, and when my new FAC arrived in the post it had "humane dispatch" added as a condition for my .243
No questions asked.

These guys are human. Treat them as such, and a lot of your perceived problems dissappear!

 

[spanj]

Not trying to be argumentative but I would love to see how all those people who suggest sending an invoice for storage in to the plod behave when it is them and their guns

I didnt send an invoice but I did formally hold them responsible for my (unnecessary) expenditure should they make it necessary. I had my ticket within 2 weeks. Looking fwd to my next renewal

 

[Chris Richardson]

Maybe you're right, but I can't help thinking that a lot of FAC holders and wannabe FAC holders don't really help themselves in these situations.
I think FEOs have quite a difficult job, really. But I've always found that through a combination of honesty and humour I've got exactly what I wanted within a reasonable timeframe. There's a fair bit of psychology involved I suppose: He's trying to assess you, but you also have to assess him in order to pitch yourself at the right level.

Let me tell you a tale:
A little while back, I posted this:

There was a lot more to the story than that obviously, but the bottom line is that I was acting outside the conditions of my FAC.
I told the story to my FEO at my recent renewal visit, and when my new FAC arrived in the post it had "humane dispatch" added as a condition for my .243
No questions asked.

These guys are human. Treat them as such, and a lot of your perceived problems dissappear!

Ok that’s great but I’ll counter with another couple of scenarios both of which are true ,
1, a friend of mine wanted a .22-250 for foxing fro refused as “ it’s a cannon “ but happily granted .223
2, a chap had a 6.5 but wanted to swap it for .243 he was open on 6.5 but .243 closed as I quote “ he didn’t have experience with a 6mm “
I know both of these fellows pretty well and have no reason to disbelieve them clearly the FEOs in question should not be in that job as the ignorance is staggering