landkeeper
Well-Known Member
it's along time ago now but my memory of things was that it was the otterhound packs that started to raise the alarm over dwindling numbers
Otter?
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it's along time ago now but my memory of things was that it was the otterhound packs that started to raise the alarm over dwindling numbers
basil
Distinguished Member
Your memory is correct. There was a program on the BBC a couple of weeks ago about the otter, and they talked about how it was the Otterhound packs who originally noticed the decline in otters, alerted the wildlife authorities and voluntarily stopped hunting. It was nice to hear the BBC telling the facts for a change.
willie_gunn
landkeeper
Well-Known Member
in about 1970 i was a small child fishing on a little stream in Cornwall i was quietly watching my float when a very large otter glided through the pool i was fishing in, it spent what seemed like a hour fishing 5 feet in front of me , eventually it climbed out of the water right at my feet and sat eating some kind of small fish ,plopped back into the water and vanished , that left an impression on me that has lasted a lifetime , i have watched many others over the years in england ireland scotland and wales but i have never forgotten that one
What a great memory to have - you're a lucky man!
Although I've fished for 30 odd years, I never saw an otter until a couple of years ago on the North Tyne, when I was wading and fishing a pool first thing in the morning. There was a mist on the water and I'd only just started fishing the pool when I heard whistling. Figuring it must be an otter I kept still and, sure enough, it made it's way up through the pool, occasionally hopping out onto the bank. After about 5 minutes it suddenly realised I was there, did a classic double take and then was gone. I didn't catch a salmon but by my reckoning my day could already be classed as successful.
Then last year I was fishing the Blackwater (a tributary of the Brora) for the 17th year in succession. In previous years I'd found the remains of salmon on the bank that had been caught by otters, and others in our party had seen them, but I'd not been lucky. It was blowing a gale and I was fishing down the river and standing on the bank casting into a pool when a movement downstream caught my eye. Again I kept still and the otter made it's way up the river. It must have seen, smelt or heard something as it disappeared before getting as far up the pool as where I was standing, but it was definitely an otter.
I've not seen any otters down here in Oxfordshire but one was knocked over and killed on the A420 a year or so ago, so they're definitely here.
These experiences all go firmly on the credit side of life's balance sheet!
willie_gunn
1st Pattern Paul
Well-Known Member
I lost a 12lb common carp and a 25lb grass carp to an otter on a pool that I have been trying to restock, so not my favorite animal just now. Though I have to admit to having a soft spot for them, just not now.
paul k
Well-Known Member
It was, but it took a while for the penny to drop!
Yes, it's a bit like the relationship between fox and hound. As R S Surtees' says; "It isn't that I love the fox less, but that I love the 'ound more"
willie_gunn
Certainly on the Blackwater the otters don't seem to have affected salmon numbers. We're still catching, on average, between 15 and 20 each week that we're up there. There is a resident pair of otters - or maybe it's now down to one, as one was found dead a couple of years ago - and we regularly find salmon on the bank in the mornings.
As one of the previous posters has said, it would seem that in rivers they catch what they need, whereas faced with stillwaters they catch what they can. Would be good to see some research on this.
willie_gunn
It's not actually I'm afraid (or at least not in the traditional sense pre ban). Mink aren't listed specifically in Section 1 of the hunting act so it's legal to use two hounds to 'flush' a mink to a gun but not to use a full pack. It is of course legal to hunt rats.
Just another absurdity of the Hunting Act!
And rabbits......or you could use a couple of minkhounds to flush the mink to a bird of prey
willie_gunn
And rabbits......or you could use a couple of minkhounds to flush the mink to a bird of prey
willie_gunn
You are almost correct, my learned friend, except for the fact that if you are flushing to a bird of prey, you could use as many hounds as you wished. One could of course hunt an injured mink with two hounds which could quite legitimately kill it. An injured hare on the other hand can be hunted and killed with as many hounds as one can muster.
Everyone still with us? Very simple and transparent law. Obviously based on sound welfare principles.... Excellent legislation.
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You are almost correct, my learned friend, except for the fact that if you are flushing to a bird of prey, you could use as many hounds as you wished. One could of course hunt an injured mink with two hounds which could quite legitimately kill it. An injured hare on the other hand can be hunted and killed with as many hounds as one can muster.
Everyone still with us? Very simple and transparent law. Obviously based on sound welfare principles.... Excellent legislation.
I stand (or rather sit) corrected
To confuse the antis, and somewhat akin to Long John Silver, I am thinking of sewing one of these onto the shoulder of my jacket:
http://www.bird-stop.co.uk/ShowDetails.asp?id=87
willie_gunn
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I stand (or rather sit) corrected
To confuse the antis, and somewhat akin to Long John Silver, I am thinking of sewing one of these onto the shoulder of my jacket:
http://www.bird-stop.co.uk/ShowDetails.asp?id=87
willie_gunn
That's superb - I will suggest it to the pack I hunt with. I'm not even going to ask you what the original model you looked at was like.
nuttyspaniel
Well-Known Member
Where I fish for Sea Trout on the River Till there are a good few about. Weve watched them fishing by stirring the silt up-stream of fish then following the dirty water down before lauching their ambush. 3 years ago a lad I had with me hooked his 1st Sea Trout on for a hungry Otter to take a fancy to his hooked fish. It gave him a bonny run till all parted, then to rub salt into his wound the Otter dragged a nice shiney troot opposite us and start crunching its head. Thats where my sympathy ended and I burst into fits of laughter. Another trick they have is to get as close as they dare in the middle of the night surface and take a breath it always gives me a wee start. I do like seeing them but I also know what predation they are capable off.
Nutty
Nutty
No need to ask:
I just thought Long John Silver would look a bit....well.....soft
willie_gunn
Otters were not controled to such low numbers , infact otterhound packs packs hunted during the summer months so the usual thing was a short draw to a holt then bolt the otter , give it law then hunt it , if the holt contained a female with young the pack moved on . About 1970 otter hound packs started to report a seriouse drop in numbers , in 1973 most packs dispanded those remaining carried on as mink hounds and after the ban survived as rat packs . The last otter hunted in this country was bolted by a russel dog called Tigger belonging to Burt Gripton of shiffnel . The best way to proof a pond/lake is 2 strands of electricfied high tensile wire side by side about 8 inches off the floor , bang a 4 inch fence post in , cut it off about a foot high on the angle so water runs off and put an insulator either side for your wire . Anyone interested in otter hunting should read "a chain of bubbles" or "reflections along a chain"Years ago Otters were controlled, to the point they weren't a significant problem.
These day that is not an option, and as fisheries are now more numerous and with higher stock densities Otters are a huge threat.
As for fisheries being able to afford Otter proofing their fisheries, not going to happen for most.
As a club of 360 members, with 6 waters of which I am the Fishery Officer, I can tell you now that the cost of doing that work is not sustainable by any
smallish angling club, and without it we lose the fish, which costs us members, and makes it impossible to pay the rent.
Everybody loses out, we have a an annual rent bill of nearly 20k, and running costs are another 15k, I'll leave you to do the maths, but suffice to say finding 100k to fence 6 waters isn't going to happen if we have to pay for it.
Neil.
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