17hmr vs 22 hornet

[Bowland blades]

My hornet with a T12 scout mod is quieter than the HMR with a SAK . It isnt audible from the kitchen , which is near the range . The HMR was audible in the kitchen . A lot of that is of course the quality and volume of the T12 scout compared to a SAK

 

[25 Sharps]

"Yeah, well known as bullet stoppers those light bodied, thin skinned foxes, perfect back stop !!"

This is I suspect why the question arises the hmr is generally stopped by a fox not always but often . If it does get through it's not got much left .
Some of my areas are a bit flat and surrounded for comfort so the smallest most fragile projectile that will do the job Is my best option . Less is more in my situation. I don't disregard the 17s potential danger but certainly use it in places I'd not consider the 223 /308. Range is obviously the compromise and I don't go past 120 .

I’m all for fast, very frangible bullets as an added layer of safety but the idea of a foxes body being used to reduce ricochet is quite frankly a nonsense! If there is a good chance of ricochet don’t take the shot, particularly if you know the bullets are prone to ricochet which is what was originally said about the PPU hornet ammo further up the thread and what was being referred to punching through a fox.

As for HMR breaking up on grass, being super frangible etc. it’s marketing nonsense. HMR shoots bullets at low speed relative most CF calibres. 2650 fps is slow!! Most CF foxing calibres are well north of 3000 fps, equally thin jacketed and more likely to break up as there is more mass to disrupt the thin jacket, my .223 ackley spits a 50 gr at 3500 fps. I still wouldn’t rely on that for safety or the idea that it wouldn’t exit a fox and ricochet!

And you are not shooting the smallest, most frangible projectile if you’re shooting an HMR, for 17s get a hornet or 17 rem / fireball and fire them at proper speeds if you want to ensure, as far as you can, they don’t exit or bounce!

 

[25 Sharps]

22 Hornet will comfortably match that with 40gr V-Max. Really is a good, cheap, no nonsense, all-rounder out to those distances

And a lot further in your hands……

 

[Finnwolf VL63]

Just thinking,… what’s.22 hornet like in non toxic??

Hornady have none toxic for the elder statesman the 22 Hornet.I have used my 1952 Bruno for 48 years ,best calibre around when Fox pelts were worth £35 each.

 

[njc110381]

get a hornet or 17 rem / fireball and fire them at proper speeds if you want to ensure, as far as you can, they don’t exit or bounce!

That's my game plan. I've got a little Sako action and a Walther barrel being screwed together at the moment, with the intention of sending Kranks 17gr bullets at just below the velocity that they fall apart all on their own. You can never guarantee safety, but there are steps you can take to improve your chances.

As for the HMR vs .22 Hornet debate, I quite quickly dumped my HMR in favour of a .22 Hornet many years ago. The HMR is not a fox cartridge in my opinion and I'd rather use a .22lr if I have to use a rimfire. The Hornet is quite a considerable step up in performance - although seen as small and insignificant now, there was a time when it was the roe stalkers cartridge of choice. If used sensibly it'll put foxes down with no trouble at all. The only down side to it really that I can think of is that it's best suited to someone who home loads. If factory ammunition is a must I'd perhaps look at a .22WMR. The heavier bullets from that will penetrate more reliably than a little .17. I don't even know if the velocity of the fireball will be enough to make those little bullets work, not the light ones at least.

 

[25 Sharps]

That's my game plan. I've got a little Sako action and a Walther barrel being screwed together at the moment, with the intention of sending Kranks 17gr bullets at just below the velocity that they fall apart all on their own. You can never guarantee safety, but there are steps you can take to improve your chances.

As for the HMR vs .22 Hornet debate, I quite quickly dumped my HMR in favour of a .22 Hornet many years ago. The HMR is not a fox cartridge in my opinion and I'd rather use a .22lr if I have to use a rimfire. The Hornet is quite a considerable step up in performance - although seen as small and insignificant now, there was a time when it was the roe stalkers cartridge of choice. If used sensibly it'll put foxes down with no trouble at all. The only down side to it really that I can think of is that it's best suited to someone who home loads. If factory ammunition is a must I'd perhaps look at a .22WMR. The heavier bullets from that will penetrate more reliably than a little .17. I don't even know if the velocity of the fireball will be enough to make those little bullets work, not the light ones at least.

My HMR stayed with me for about 10 months before it got swapped for a hornet, too many hang fires and lodged bullets. I also have 2 WMRs, one bolt and one semi auto, a cracking round

 

[Smellydog]

My two HMR rimfires are staying put. They have downed plenty vermin including fox , as many as any other rifle I have owned. I don't get ammo issues.
The 17 kills as well as the WMR daddy. The 17 is easier to get a result on a distant crow over the WMR.
That said, I would gladly own another WMR and I would also enjoy another hornet.
What I won't do is condemn one over the other. That is folly.

 

[Clive Ward]

Thinking of a short range foxing rifle, I already have a 17hmr but my experience over the years has shown it to be a little underpowered for Foxes. Would a 22 Hornet be a better choice and how do the 2 compare in noise levels ?. Its for use in smaller paddocks around houses where my 22 250 has just too much bark .

The .22 Hornet will be perfect for this. Mine's a very short barrel 13" or so with a JetZ CQB still pushing the 35 Grain V-Max at 3,000 FPS. It's not any noisier than the .17 HMR. If I can't be bothered to reload, then the Remington 35 Grain AccuTip are a good enough substitute.

Using the 35 Grain, I would suggest avoiding the shoulder, especially on a fox quartering into you. Head, neck or just behind the shoulder bones (if side on) works perfectly. Don't try and pin with it.

I'm happy to use mine out to 200 yards, but LRF and knowing the trajectory is very important, and that's a hard 200 yard limit. Most shots are 60-120 though.

Foxes I've taken with it (and it's an awful lot over the years) look like they have died in their sleep.


Cheers





Clive

 

[Bowland blades]

The .22 Hornet will be perfect for this. Mine's a very short barrel 13" or so with a JetZ CQB still pushing the 35 Grain V-Max at 3,000 FPS. It's not any noisier than the .17 HMR. If I can't be bothered to reload, then the Remington 35 Grain AccuTip are a good enough substitute.

Using the 35 Grain, I would suggest avoiding the shoulder, especially on a fox quartering into you. Head, neck or just behind the shoulder bones (if side on) works perfectly. Don't try and pin with it.

I'm happy to use mine out to 200 yards, but LRF and knowing the trajectory is very important, and that's a hard 200 yard limit. Most shots are 60-120 though.

Foxes I've taken with it (and it's an awful lot over the years) look like they have died in their sleep.


Cheers





Clive

Do try some 45 grain seirra hornet , you will find it a heck of a site easier as 35 v max dispite having 150 fps lead on a stiff load arrives at 200 later and takes far more wind and more drop . There are many others that outperform those 35 v max , 40 v max (if your rifle can handle feeding them) are a different beat altogether ! Mine wont without single feeding
At 200 yards i am 2 moa low and 5.6 moa FV 10mph wind from the CZ under the inch if i am not dealing with much wind

 

[Smellydog]

Do try some 45 grain seirra hornet , you will find it a heck of a site easier as 35 v max dispite having 150 fps lead on a stiff load arrives at 200 later and takes far more wind and more drop . There are many others that outperform those 35 v max , 40 v max (if your rifle can handle feeding them) are a different beat altogether ! Mine wont without single feeding
At 200 yards i am 2 moa low and 5.6 moa FV 10mph wind from the CZ under the inch if i am not dealing with much wind

How are you single feeding the mini Mauser action? Via the magazine or push feeding?