20 Vartarg
- Thread starter Woodmister
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6pt-sika
Well-Known Member
My experience in 20 cals is limited to a couple Rugers in 204 Ruger . One a 77 Mark II VT and the other a #1B . The 77 was a sub 1/4 MOA rifle the #1B not as much so . Personally Iâd be more inclined to go with the 204 . But Iâm not as eager to do as much specialized stuff as I once was .
Griggo06
Well-Known Member
What do you mean by this?
221 brass can be simply sized down to 20 vartarg without the need to neck turn .
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
I beg to differ on nearly as fast. I can get over 4000fps from my 20 Tac. Admittedly with more powder but it isnât 40% more like 25-30% more. No felt recoil and the same as far as watching your target.
A well used CZ527 (like mine) doesnât feel agricultural itâs not like weâre talking about a Baikal. The trigger is easy enough to cure I believe mine has had a Rifle Basix (not by me) trigger fitted. Itâs the same as the Cz550 you just trim the blade a little.
I have a liking for the 20 cals, when I got chance of a good deal on one I took it.
However prior to that I had a 527 with a knackered barrel (mod left on previous owner). I had invested too much time into getting it to shoot and it is a nice rifle.
Anyway the topic of a few conversations was calibre choice 222 again 20 VarTarg amongst others.
Getting the VarTarg to feed properly was one concern itâs not a given (apparently) although not insurmountable.
The other comment was why limit yourself. You can build a 20 Tac or Practical on the same size action and get an extra five hundred feet per second. Or download it to VarTarg speed (which I have) all in one cartridge.
As much as VarTarg appeals it wouldnât be my first choice on the 527 or Sako action.
My Sako is the Tac the CZ stayed 222.
Unless youâre doner action is specifically a fireball ie already got one or more magazines. I would go down a slightly different route. If starting from scratch ie no dies etc.
20 Practical, itâs just a different bushing in a 223 bushing die. Lube size and youâre done. Get a fast twist (9â+) and you can launch 32gn bullets at VarTarg speeds to 50/55gn for 600yd+ shooting. All in the same size action.
I already have a potential replacement barrel for my 20. Itâs seriously underrated in my opinion.
Todd Kindlers book Terrific Twenties is worth trying to get hold of.
Be warned though itâs a slippery slope
It can also be made from 223 brass with form dies which is a real labour of love, and would need to be neck turned.
Tom D
Well-Known Member
The original VarTarg was designed with a tight chamber in the neck area, this means that brass has to be neck turned in order to fit properly. The idea is that the turned brass perfectly fits the chamber making the round more accurate. In reality though mine is very accurate with a little more play in the neck area.
It was my understanding that the 222 was the parent case , as always , I never mind being corrected .
I'm always a little puzzled (just generally,really) , when the 527 is referred to as agricultural . That Mauser action has been on around for an awful long time ,unfettered . Though the trigger is tragic , Timney CZ550 (not 550 magnum) for me .
I believe there are benefits to using a controlled feed action for Fireball derived cases , I should add this is hearsay, in relation to case ejection .
FT
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
Turned neck is to even out the thickness as standard brass is not necessarily even. Sometimes itâs a thou or two out.
When you are looking at having two thou neck tension itâs supposed to make more accurate. The chamber is usually the neck size (loaded) plus a couple of thou to allow release of the bullet.
See attached, it can be either. I went the 223 route as it was easier to get better quality brass at the time, approximately 8-9 years ago.
Attachments
Oh yeah
The 20 VarTarg "Turbo" was based off a .222 case, the .20 VarTarg is based off the .221. Yes, 222 can be used to form 20VarTarg, but you may have to neck turn the brass. I'd have to look in my "Terrific Twenties" reloading manual to confirm...
The 527 actions are a viable solution for feeding from a mag, especially with their plentiful availability in the UK/Europe. Were it I though (in the US), I'd give the Zermatt Origin action a good hard look. Utilizing AICS pattern .223 mags, the CRF of the Origin makes feeding (and more importantly) extraction a cinch in these short cases. The mechanical ejector (like on the Origin and 527) ensures the case stays on the bolt face, until it is properly positioned at the ejection port, before ejection occurs. The Origin just makes it easy to acquire mags and generic Rem700 inletted stocks or chassis, vice the 527 which is somewhat constrained in aftermarket support.
And yes, the .20 Tac can easily achieve 4100 fps (4300 fps is your really running it hard).
That said, I've seen the 20 VarTarg run stupidly fast using LC .223 brass (very thick case head and walls), shooting life sized steel silhouettes of rabbits at 600yds. IIRC (this was circa 2008), he was running them at 4100 fps, but the pockets only held for 3-4 reloadings. I'd imagine Lapua brass is very similar to LC (I know the NAMMO labelled stuff is pretty close), and would handle those pressures as well, but think if you wanted to run that hot, you just get a 204 or a 20 Tactical. but I digress....
When I wrote parent case , I was referring to the Fireball derived chamberings . Wasn't very clear
, me bad .
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
No mention of 222 brass as far as I can see (quick scan through TTâs) VTT is though
I canât get Todd Kindlers speeds even with Dakota (Lapua) brass but he coats his bullets I donât.
I do like the idea of the 20 VarTarg. But I canât justify more than one 20 cal.
I suspect he was also using Lake City .223 brass for some of his cases to achieve some of those speeds. I never pushed my 20 Tac past 4100fps regularly, there was just never a need. And some of those loads could go from fine, to major pressure issues with the 40* temperature swings we have here in the desert Southwest of the US.
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
It doesnât take much to go from fine to pressure signs in mine. I have had 32âs over 4000. Mind you they didnât actually hit the target, just flew in bits.
I run 50âs at 3500 but get primer cratering if pushed for more.
39 blitz kings are just something else. I donât suppose it matters much what you launch them from. Crows and foxes donât like them.
Yes, I think the early VMax (and Berger) bullets had a much thicker jacket. Some of these newer bullets do not hold up well to high RPM's. I ran the older 33gr VMax to stupidly high velocities in the .20 Tac...
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
Not sure on the brand. They were flat base with a large hollow point. I donât think a 9â twist helped much either.
I have a few hundred 50 Berger along with a couple of hundred 40 Vmax and a part box of 32âs so plenty to go at.
I (possibly) have the next barrel sorted depending on if it cleans up or not. So I wonât be without a 20 for a while.
hedge hunter
Well-Known Member
My vartarg fed flawless out of a sako action. Not one jam or hang up.lapua fireball brass necked down.i could shoot crows at three and four hundred yards all day long .that's when the wind behaved its self lovely caliber and gun.
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