Available: 3 days Traditional Hunting for Moose with Dogs in Lapland

[Stephenl]

Paul, don't forget that one of the moose was shot by one of the club members. The young bull should not have been shot but was, why was that our fault and what happened to the club member? Had you been in the shooters position when the adult female appeared are you saying you would not have pulled the trigger? How would you have known the female was in milk having shot as many moose as I have ie 0. I would have pulled the trigger under those circumstances and based on what we where advised to do by Christian.Before blaming others about their actions please put yourself in the exact same scenario and then tell me you would have done any different. If I recall correctly I believe everyone in the group, including you,agreed that night over a few beers that we would have all pulled the trigger. It was down to miscommunication/poor or misguided communication, call it what you want, and the lack of knowledge or immediate access to experienced hunters that resulted in the shot been fired. If the laws are complex then we should have been briefed on them before we even got to Finland, not at the morning briefing given that we where a group of foreign hunters with absolutely no Mosse experience.
book a trip to South Africa and its always clear as to what you can shoot(mle or female) and in what numbers and this is at the time of booking not on the morning of the shoot. Clear and factual information always helps but what does not help anyone on a trip or the agent is unclear guidance from start to end.

 

[CWMMAN3738]

+1 spot on stephen

Paul, don't forget that one of the moose was shot by one of the club members. The young bull should not have been shot but was, why was that our fault and what happened to the club member? Had you been in the shooters position when the adult female appeared are you saying you would not have pulled the trigger? How would you have known the female was in milk having shot as many moose as I have ie 0. I would have pulled the trigger under those circumstances and based on what we where advised to do by Christian.Before blaming others about their actions please put yourself in the exact same scenario and then tell me you would have done any different. If I recall correctly I believe everyone in the group, including you,agreed that night over a few beers that we would have all pulled the trigger. It was down to miscommunication/poor or misguided communication, call it what you want, and the lack of knowledge or immediate access to experienced hunters that resulted in the shot been fired. If the laws are complex then we should have been briefed on them before we even got to Finland, not at the morning briefing given that we where a group of foreign hunters with absolutely no Mosse experience.
book a trip to South Africa and its always clear as to what you can shoot(mle or female) and in what numbers and this is at the time of booking not on the morning of the shoot. Clear and factual information always helps but what does not help anyone on a trip or the agent is unclear guidance from start to end.

 

[CWMMAN3738]

Same with our trip & at least 1 from the second trip last year we are all going away together this year again after meeting on that trip also one person from the second trip but with a different operator & again next may. & have shot many deer & boar on each others ground since that trip which if nothing else was the best thing to come out of that abortion that was supposed to be at least 3 days driven moose hunting LMFAO!

So there are clearly historic and current issues with Hunt n Seek and not just on YRS hunt and Paul's because there were some lads out shooting birds from Dorset the week before we arrived and guess what !!! I was informed by a lad that was with them for a day they were unfekin happy also..

Talk it up anyway you like, theres clearly issues with the packages and professionalism offered by Hunt n Seek.

Some people that went on our trip are not members of SD, some are but wont post. But one thing I can say for a fact is that all were extremely disappointed and upset with the disgusting experience received in Finland

 

[CWMMAN3738]

Yes jumbo 30-06 the best thing to come out of our trip was the friendships forged by making th best of a bad Lott

I am so glad it was all booked up when i spotted the thread otherwise i would have been ripped off to. Sorry you lads had a bad time and your hard earned cash spent for nothing.

Jimbo

 

[Cut+Squirt]

Paul, amazed and slightly disappointed You are continuing to defend this guy, Everything written thus far is fact!! It matters not which part of Finland what type of hunt he is offering. The guy clearly hasn't got a clue what he is doing. We got ripped off end of!! There is simply no excuse, any good ponts such as the "craic" was generated by like minded sportsmen whom on the whole got on very well considering the circumstances. The guy and his "tin pot" out-fit should be exposed. I noted with interest in the thread the same ***** he spun a few of the lads on our trip, myself included, late avialability due to cancellations, dropping his price etc. You yourself now also a trade member paul, likewise although not on here i'm a member of a number of trade organisations, My golden rule for what it is worth is to disassociate myself from anything or anyone that is surrounded with very poor and negative feedback,otherwise you may well soon find your own integrity will get called into question. The guys a conman, the more exposure the better, theres no to be "Fair", we certainly wasnt afforded the same, he took the hard earned money and ran, and we got a very poor return.

And here was me beating myself up over our little buck incident... Compared with
this shxxt storm Paul we had nothing to worry about...
Those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones as the old saying goes.

 

[6pointer]

Cadex your a bad man

 

[CWMMAN3738]

I wouldn't hold their breath unfortunately we didnt

Not in my nature Davie, but I've spent days listening to them all bleating
on about ethics .. it seams the shoe is on the other foot now .. I hope the lads
involved get some cash back.

 

[csl]

Really sorry your trip didn't go as well as hoped guys but I'm not sure what to do with all these threads/posts. We've got three different threads talking about two different trips, a year apart!

I think I'll merge them all into the thread in Writeups tomorrow and just leave the initial referencing posts from Terry here, unless anyone has any particularly strong objections?

In the mean time thank you for keeping it civil.

Alex

 

[pheasant sniper 1]

Morning Alex,

With such a poor display of attention to detail and professionalism would you not agree Hunt n Seek advertising and offers of hunting on here should be suspended safe guarding our members ?

Atb

Terry

 

[6pointer]

Terry in my opinion that should not be done what should be done is Hunt n Seek should in some way make things right for you chaps but give them a chance mate before they get blocked.In my opinion its not about getting it wrong and saying sorry. Its what you do to make the sorry right .

 

[Paul at Fechan]

And here was me beating myself up over our little buck incident... Compared with
this shxxt storm Paul we had nothing to worry about...
Those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones as the old saying goes.

mate, my end was 100%.... your buck was more like 50% after the meat damage I'm not the one living in the glass house

 

[pheasant sniper 1]

Terry in my opinion that should not be done what should be done is Hunt n Seek should in some way make things right for you chaps but give them a chance mate before they get blocked.In my opinion its not about getting it wrong and saying sorry. Its what you do to make the sorry right .

Sorry mate I think that hasnt come across as meant...

What im asking for is their Trade Status be disabled not their membership until they atleast make an attempt if its not to much trouble to make some form of good will gesture to all the hunters.

In my case I am not looking for any sort of discount on future hunts as I am horrified by what has come to light from previous fiasco's.

I think a monetary refund to all hunters is in order due to the hunt being so poor

 

[EMcC]

I feel sorry for you guys and hope it all comes good in the end.
Having read all the posts, I reckon the ' Monetary Refund ' mentioned by Terry should include a bit extra as compensation for wasted time and discomfort during the trip.
I was reprimanded for being impatient and asking too many questions when I saw a trip I fancied going on being advertised by an Agent I hadn't used before, but if being a fully paid up member of the ' Spanish Inquisition ' prevents me going on a trip similar to yours then I'll keep paying my membership.
Let's hope Christian reads a few of these posts and suffers a pricked concience enough to make good financially.

 

[lambsey]

I feel sorry for you guys and hope it all comes good in the end.
Having read all the posts, I reckon the ' Monetary Refund ' mentioned by Terry should include a bit extra as compensation for wasted time and discomfort during the trip.
I was reprimanded for being impatient and asking too many questions when I saw a trip I fancied going on being advertised by an Agent I hadn't used before, but if being a fully paid up member of the ' Spanish Inquisition ' prevents me going on a trip similar to yours then I'll keep paying my membership.
Let's hope Christian reads a few of these posts and suffers a pricked concience enough to make good financially.

Please forward me the contact details of the "Spanish Inquisition" club as I feel like all of the guys who went on the trip have been well and truly shafted and now would like to become a member......

I look forward to Christians response........

 

[JAYB]

Dear all, I have read through this and clearly there are unhappy hunters for what appears to be very legitimate reasons, and somehow a hunt from last year has got into the equation. The only common denominator is the organiser, a member on here who, it has been intimated by Paul will be aking a response to this post and the allegations contained in it. We are very keen that the trade members, indeed all members, on SD are honest and trustworthy if they are not then there is no room for them on here.

Therefore the future of the organiser of this hunt on SD rests with him, if the matter is dealt with in an honourable and satisfactory manner then the status quo will be maintained, if not then the site will be one trade member less. However in the interest of fairness both sides must be heard before any such decision is made.

John

 

[Roedinator]

Dear all, I have read through this and clearly there are unhappy hunters for what appears to be very legitimate reasons, and somehow a hunt from last year has got into the equation. The only common denominator is the organiser, a member on here who, it has been intimated by Paul will be aking a response to this post and the allegations contained in it. We are very keen that the trade members, indeed all members, on SD are honest and trustworthy if they are not then there is no room for them on here.

Therefore the future of the organiser of this hunt on SD rests with him, if the matter is dealt with in an honourable and satisfactory manner then the status quo will be maintained, if not then the site will be one trade member less. However in the interest of fairness both sides must be heard before any such decision is made.

John

You can't be much fairer than that john
​regards pete

 

[EMcC]

I have had experience of this sort of thing once and heard of a few more but in some cases it isn't the fault of the agent.
Sometimes the agent has taken the word of the 'Hunt Organiser' on the ground so maybe Christian is embarrassed too but what action he takes will tell.

 

[pheasant sniper 1]

Dear all, I have read through this and clearly there are unhappy hunters for what appears to be very legitimate reasons, and somehow a hunt from last year has got into the equation. The only common denominator is the organiser, a member on here who, it has been intimated by Paul will be aking a response to this post and the allegations contained in it. We are very keen that the trade members, indeed all members, on SD are honest and trustworthy if they are not then there is no room for them on here.

Therefore the future of the organiser of this hunt on SD rests with him, if the matter is dealt with in an honourable and satisfactory manner then the status quo will be maintained, if not then the site will be one trade member less. However in the interest of fairness both sides must be heard before any such decision is made.

John

Fair Do's John..

I assure you what has been said is factual and correct mate.

Atb

Terry

 

[EMcC]

Fair Do's John..I assure you what has been said is factual and correct mate.

Atb Terry

Hi Terry, What, even the bit about you speaking to Christian in a level voice, calm and collected

 

[Hunt n Seek]

Dear hunters, This is a reply to who went on Lapland trip.
Firstly I want to write that we are very sorry that you fell the way you do about the trip. I have just got home so could not see all the posts early to write back. The area we hunted has big moose and many for areas in Lapland. Next to us and near us on the opening day many moose were shot and within 5 km of our first drive 4 moose were shot by the same group. We had four dogs, 2 trained professional dogs and 2 were young. Our 2 trained dogs found moose in all drives over the 3 day but it is true a young dog chased a reindeer and the other was distracted in the hunt with sausages. This was fed to it by a hunter rather than letting it find moose so I was told the last night?!

I have listened to hunters at the hunt and read all comments and there are things said which are true but some things are not true said by people who did not hunt this time in Lapland. This hunt is our first with so little moose shoot as organisers but a moose was shot and another shot at. A shot was also not taken. We shot moose but many short of our tag target.

Remember the big bull moose that was seen and talked about on threads was picked up by one of the dogs and it chased it for 11 km before running out of the grounds. Before leavening grounds the hunter had been out to try and shoot this moose, but without luck. And was told at this point we cannot shoot the moose anymore the ground stops here. BUT we still have to get our dog back so you go on to find the dog. At the point where the dog was found the bull moose was also seen. But remember the dog have barked the moose for 11 km before the hunter and the dog handler see the moose. SO the dog did a great job following the bull moose from the drive we did and to the point where the dog was picked up.

The hunting have been done the same was as any Finnish moose hunting are done. Again shooting moose is team work. As any Finnish hunter would say. WE SHOT A MOOSE, NOT I SHOT A MOOSE. Team work. As people was told time after time be quiet the moose hears so much and will not go to a line of guns if it has heard people. The dogs found moose in every drive and for some reason they did not go to the line. About land the first day we hunted all the way up to the Russian border with 2 big drives. Day 2 we hunted about 40 km away from 1 day!!! And then we went back to the border ground for the 3 day. The last drive on day 3 we had done partly on day one, but only because we got information for 2 bull mooses had gone in the drive. And as explained earlier one of the dogs picked it up and barked it for 11 km so a good chose to do this drive again day 3. Else we have not done anything 2 times!!!!

Numbers on hunters: If you look at 2 page on the add Terry ask how many hunters there will be and the answer is 12-16 hunters!!! Yes we were 17 and 1 student with the dog handler. The dog handlers MUST have guns just in case. We then got people to go with the dog handler 2 people every day and they could have shoot moose if the dog had put them to a stop. So it has been inform how many hunters there were on the hunt.

I read cabin arrangements and food were not liked. The lunch was to be a traditional hunt lunch with fire and sausages. This is our tradition how we do it in Finland and we have beer. Some say you want different and something quick to hunt more so we try this with apples and crisps which hunters asked for. Then you say it was our fault but we try what you ask for not our tradition and what we buy to eat on hunts. Then people wanted soup, and we tried to get you soup. We had sausages and all Fins eat them while you have what you wanted. And then we had people on the last day saying they would have liked to have the traditional experience not soup, SO understand it is hard to satisfy everyone. For dinner we went out for dinner in a restaurant 2 nights and got a moose and bear stew one night. Everyone liked this and still complaining about paying 35 euros a day for food. We gave you 2 options on food:

1: We take the group to the store to buy food and drinks. The group make their own meals.

2: All meals are done. Breakfast, lunch ( in the woods ), and dinner. Drinks to the food is in the price, ( there will be a beer for lunch and a beer for dinner and soft drinks ) This is 35 euro pr person pr day. A total of 105 euros pr person for the trip paid on arrival. For this to be done all in the group have to want this option. Else we are going with number 1.

People wanted beer and therefore the price was 20 euros pr person and beer was provided.

EVERYONE have agreed to option 2!!!

In the cabin we have some beds but also space for other hunters. Our tradition is to hunt, eat, drink and sleep, before an early start with old hunters get a bed. The bed is not important to young hunters just so long as we have somewhere to rest, it is our tradition but we see this is not your way. An extra cabin is more than 1 hunter cost per cabin so if you all have beds that is 4 cabins more to pay for. We try to keep costs low. Again you don't like this. And there was mattresses for everyone. The people that slept on the sofa chose to sleep there.

People say we steal money from you and it is a con and we make lots. This is not true and you don't understand how costs are bad for us. We pay 24% tax on everything we get paid as on the invoice it says. This is 4 hunters out of this group. The dogs and handlers cost 3 hunters for 2 good dogs for 3 days. The minibuses and full costs 2,5 hunters for this trip. Cabins for hunters costs 3 hunters.

This is 12,5 hunters price paid out before we pay our transport and flights to Lapland, your licenses to hunt moose, insurances and the rights to hunt the ground. Radios cost over 200 Euro each x20 and then there is vests and hats at 30 Euros. That is 4,600 Euro that must be spent. There are not enough hunters to pay this on your trip. You don't understand how many hunters want to hunt in Lapland for big moose but pay the real price.

We made this hunt at a low price and lose money because we are trying a new exciting ground this hunt. We do not con you and only after next trip we can make money back. This is hard to do if you tell all hunters not to hunt with us now because of one bad hunt. You ask for money back and try to destroy our business at the same time. Is it fair you do both? This is not fair. Other hunters have been fair and waited for us to respond. We will offer hunters on this trip a 1/3 discount on any hunt booked with us which for some trips is more than £500 discount. This is a private agreement we want to make it right for hunters if they give us a chance.

We can agree the hunt did not go as well as it could have with moose getting shot and the traditional food and cabin provision was not what you like but the hunting produced moose and chances to shoot moose. AS the add said

"'The hunting can guarantee beautiful countryside, great company and a genuine chance to see and shoot for Moose. This is not to mention the lasting memories and other wildlife and excitement of the hunt. It should not be expected that every hunter will see a Moose but on a normal hunt there will be several chances for Moose to be shot. ."

Christian and Tuomas