To be honest, I don't think they'd have issued your FAC with that piece of ground listed on it if they didn't deem it suitable. Therefore, in my opinion, you can safely assume that it is cleared for your calibre.
Am I presuming too much? A 'closed ticket' Question...
- Thread starter Qwertyzmate
- Start date
Qwertyzmate
Well-Known Member
MAH
Well-Known Member
I'll try and explain my thoughts a different way.
Two things
1. The process the FLO followed to grant you a certificate.
2. The output from that process. The certificate.
If the latter states you can use rifle x on land y. Your authorised.
You seam to be considering going back to them to check that they followed the correct process before giving you a certificate.
To me, asking is the land cleared is akin to asking
-Did you check that I didn’t had a criminal record? or
- Did you have a chat with my doctor?
I am curious now. I'd be interested to see a photo of your condition.
M
Qwertyzmate
Well-Known Member
Maybe I'm not making myself clear...
"If the latter states you can use rifle x on land y. Your authorised"
Y = "land deemed suitable by the chief officer or police for the are where the land is situated and over which the holder has lawful authority to shoot"
There is no specific land detailed on my FAC
This leads me to the question of if its a given that by providing only one 'permission' details means they actually check that that land is 'deemed suitable'
Ultimately, i need to abide by the terms of my license. And as there is doubt I will be checking to make sure.
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MAH
Well-Known Member
It seams we've had our wires crossed.
Your earlier comments gave me the impression specific land was listed on your certificate.
My earlier comments were based on that misunderstanding.
Feel free to disregard them.
M.
There are only conditions on your licence which you agree to when you sign it as you must sign it.
with an open ticket be it a postage stamp garden or a new farm to you then the ownes is you make the decision to deem it safe... A closed fac is land which has be checked by a FEO.
I used to ring Essex FAD and ask if it was cleared for a C/F. Many farms were only .22lr cleared.
You know the speed limit as the signs tell you...Want to know if land is cleared (as it could be) for a .22lr then ask the people who clear it...it is as simple as that...
WHERE things go wrong is Fred with a .243 with an open ticket on an uncleared bit of ground he shoots then invites Jack with a .243 with a closed ticket... As Fred's conditions are different to Jacks..
Simple.
gonzo
Well-Known Member
If land must be cleared by the Chief Constable, then the police (for that area) should have the records.
If not, ask them to clear it. That's their job.
If the can't clear the land in a reasonable time, then they should remove the closed condition from your FAC. As it is not acceptable for them to put restrictive conditions on an FAC that make it effectivly unuseable.
If not, ask them to clear it. That's their job.
If the can't clear the land in a reasonable time, then they should remove the closed condition from your FAC. As it is not acceptable for them to put restrictive conditions on an FAC that make it effectivly unuseable.
Barely credible in this day and age that the Police who are licensing firearm users, don't know what they are doing to protect public safety - because this is what it amounts to.
I have never before heard of a closed condition without it specifying the land deemed suitable or the calibre. The land is obviously tied to the calibre (when closed) as the one is suitable for the other. I'd ring them up /e-mail and say you have been told you should ask for an open certificate so you can be responsible for shooting safely on ALL your permissions with all of your firearms.
Once you have an open cert you can shoot in your back garden with a .308 if you deem it safe, so the idea of approving land for an open certificate is ludicrous - just my view.
I have never before heard of a closed condition without it specifying the land deemed suitable or the calibre. The land is obviously tied to the calibre (when closed) as the one is suitable for the other. I'd ring them up /e-mail and say you have been told you should ask for an open certificate so you can be responsible for shooting safely on ALL your permissions with all of your firearms.
Once you have an open cert you can shoot in your back garden with a .308 if you deem it safe, so the idea of approving land for an open certificate is ludicrous - just my view.
Qwertyzmate
Well-Known Member
Agreed
But if If Fred with his open ticket owns the farm and agreed to let me shoot his land as my first and only vermin and deer permission, did Mr FEO ensure the ground is 'suitable' as part of the process or have I just proved 'good reason'' leaving me to ensure the land is 'deemed suitable '?
Logic says plod would have checked. Not got anyway to prove it though.
I will be confirming for myself with the FEO
You are not going to get very far arguing the toss with people on here as IF means FA as it is NOT in the home office guidance note which I and many others have read over and over through years to get a fair understanding.
Have you read through the guidance note on condition changes??...my money says NO otherwise you would not be using or changing wording to suit your question.
As an apprentice toolmaker it took a lot of getting things wrong to finally realise the people around me knew what they were talking about...also you never said what you did for a living.
ThisSorry, I can’t make it all the way through the above
Do you have a closed or open FAC. If unsure what is the exact wording of your condition? Land deemed suitable by police?
If closed drop your FLD and email to ask if land is passed for the calibre your intend to use
It doesn’t need to be any more complicated than that
You are overthinking it and looking for problems that don't exist.
As part of your application process you will have needed to demonstrate your good reason to possess firearms to shoot over land. As part of this demonstration you were required to submit the details of one parcel of land to substantiate your good reason. This you have done. The police, having completed their checks with due diligence, have issued your certificate.
Why on earth do you now think they made a grave mistake and issued you with a certificate authorizing you to use your firearms on unsuitable land.
As part of your application process you will have needed to demonstrate your good reason to possess firearms to shoot over land. As part of this demonstration you were required to submit the details of one parcel of land to substantiate your good reason. This you have done. The police, having completed their checks with due diligence, have issued your certificate.
Why on earth do you now think they made a grave mistake and issued you with a certificate authorizing you to use your firearms on unsuitable land.
I agree. It’s best to go by what your stipulation says on your own ticket. I had a closed tickets when I first applied and I just sent land permission forms into Firearms for any new permissions. I would then get a form back saying that the land was cleared up to what ever cal they cleared. Sometimes these would take 6 months.
Glad my ticket is open now.
Glad my ticket is open now.
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