First shotgun advice

[Stimo444]

The most important thing when buying a gun is the fit, be it a o/u or auto. Try as many as possible and then buy what suits. I would say buy a o/u as a first gun as it can be used on any type of shoot , as you may only be using it in a hide but may get an invite to a more formal shoot. Even a beaters day it will not be popular with an auto.
However I do love an auto and they are no more dangerous than any other type of gun and less recoil .

 

[Beretta V]

The most important thing when buying a gun is the fit, be it a o/u or auto. Try as many as possible and then buy what suits. I would say buy a o/u as a first gun as it can be used on any type of shoot , as you may only be using it in a hide but may get an invite to a more formal shoot. Even a beaters day it will not be popular with an auto.
However I do love an auto and they are no more dangerous than any other type of gun and less recoil .

Agreed any gun is dangerous but when an o/u or sxs is open you can see they are safe. Not so with an auto!
Autos have a place as suggested

 

[Dave_424]

Lanber 12 bore O/U was my first real shotgun (bolt action webley & scott .410 was my first). £425 for an ex-demo gun. Not the lightest around, but it fits me well enough for me to hit stuff when I do my part.

 

[NullMac]

Buy one with an adjustable stock.

 

[gunmandanieltex]

My suggestion of a semi auto as a first gun seems to have raised some great and very valid comments - however I stand by mine because of the original question - First gun on the cheap. Sorry this is a long one.

Autos definitely are cheaper to buy new. They are more versatile and are far more sutited to more types of shooting than O/U's. The question of what type of shooting wasn't really addressed and my comments were trying to be as general as possible.
In the US, semis are generally the first choice for these reasons.
O/U is king in the UK on clays because of the form factor - potentially 2 different barrel chokes for shooting doubles - one close, the other as it gets further away. In practice this is not always worthwhile. There is also a faster second shot without the cycle time of a semi (this is non existant for most shooter below top competetive level and semis are getting faster). Which is important for certain shots and competetive requirements. They are simpler to operate and should last longer (you hope - and for the record I still have autos that are 20yr old+!!) and most shops have loads of them at various price points and specs so you have a wide choice. Thats really the only advantages double shotguns have.

Semi autos are cheaper - they just are. You can buy a cheap semi with a 3 yr warranty for under £500 new and probable much cheaper - i got one for £300! Buy a common make with a warranty from a reputable shop.
Semi autos are generally lighter and easier to carry all day and as they can have slings fitted more easily. They can be easier to hold for juniors, women and anyone who might have strength issues.

They often are chambered for larger cartridges as std - for wildfowl and turkey shooting (USA!). O/U generally stop at 3" carts in 12g as std. 3.5" magnum are commonly available in semi auto platforms.

They can have 1 extra shot in them - for the person that said "if you need 3 shots go home" thats just silly - I say 3 pigeons shot, not just 2 when they fly over. Having one extra shot is sometimes what you need and is never a bad thing.

I don't know what to say about having to unload a third shell?? the notion of it being a problem is nonexistant. And you don't have to load 3 - most clay ranges require only 2 shells be load in semi's at any one time so its a moot point.

As for people looking at you funny at a clay range thats daft - semi autos are used for clays all the time these days, let the snobs be damned - and while you won't be taking it to a grouse shoot, a beginner should be on his 2nd and 3rd gun by the time they are up for any of that! I know shoots that used to frown upon O/U's turning up and where a SxS is still the usually required gun (in pairs for assisted loading where possible).

A first gun for a beginner will also benefit from reduced recoil (despite needing perhaps 24gm+ to operate)which gas semi autos provide. An O/U can be punishing especially if mounted incorrectly as beginners do. Flinching is a problem with new shooters and a bruised shoulder is a put off. Gas Semis can help lessen this to begin with without clothing padding or lesser cartridges.
Yes you can shoot 21gm loads out of a O/U but you are not getting full use out of a cartridge.

Also a simplified single barrel aiming point aids in learning to shoot a shotgun on a moving target. Also if you are using it for say turkey hunting an optical sight can be utilised more effectively and semis can come with mounting points now where double shotguns do not.

If you cannot pickup your shells after then you I don't know what to say. I do have a telescopic magnetic stick which saves me bending over - works a treat and stays in my cartridge bag. This is for O/U and semis as my O/U spits them 6ft over my shoulder if I don't catch them!

The comment of buying an adjustable stock it a good one but they are rarely cheap and quite often offers surprising little of the adjustment needed to fit you. A rising cheek piece is all well and good but no good if the gun is too long or has too much drop in the first place. This is very common where the highest setting on an adjustable cheekpiece is no higher than a std comb on the same model non adj gun.
Most semis these days come with shims to adjust the stock somewhat and spacers to adjust length of pull and these you can do at home yourself. Most O/U are what they are and thats it. The cardbord and tape adjustments still work for both.

And as for the safety aspect - all guns are to be treated as loaded ALL THE TIME. This is where shotgunners most often fail (on the first law of gun handling no less) and rifle and pistol shooters are shocked when they 1st visit clay ranges.
The mishandling and mispointing I observe on any given day at a clay range as a rifle and ex pistol shooter is astounding. But on a clay range its normal.
Broken O/U = safe. I do get it, but proper gun handling, showing and checking clear and back in the slip when not being used isn't that difficult and should be drummed into you as a beginner, day one.

I sound like an advert for semis but I do love my O/U's too. Its horses for courses - but my advice to any beginner is the still the same really whether semi or O/U - get a gun that fits you. You will shoot it 100x better than one that doesn't.
Buy a common cheap gun and spend your money on a few lessons at a clay ground and lots of cartridges rather than a fancier gun.

 

[Tim.243]

My suggestion of a semi auto as a first gun seems to have raised some great and very valid comments - however I stand by mine because of the original question - First gun on the cheap. Sorry this is a long one.

Autos definitely are cheaper to buy new. They are more versatile and are far more sutited to more types of shooting than O/U's. The question of what type of shooting wasn't really addressed and my comments were trying to be as general as possible.
In the US, semis are generally the first choice for these reasons.
O/U is king in the UK on clays because of the form factor - potentially 2 different barrel chokes for shooting doubles - one close, the other as it gets further away. In practice this is not always worthwhile. There is also a faster second shot without the cycle time of a semi (this is non existant for most shooter below top competetive level and semis are getting faster). Which is important for certain shots and competetive requirements. They are simpler to operate and should last longer (you hope - and for the record I still have autos that are 20yr old+!!) and most shops have loads of them at various price points and specs so you have a wide choice. Thats really the only advantages double shotguns have.

Semi autos are cheaper - they just are. You can buy a cheap semi with a 3 yr warranty for under £500 new and probable much cheaper - i got one for £300! Buy a common make with a warranty from a reputable shop.
Semi autos are generally lighter and easier to carry all day and as they can have slings fitted more easily. They can be easier to hold for juniors, women and anyone who might have strength issues.

They often are chambered for larger cartridges as std - for wildfowl and turkey shooting (USA!). O/U generally stop at 3" carts in 12g as std. 3.5" magnum are commonly available in semi auto platforms.

They can have 1 extra shot in them - for the person that said "if you need 3 shots go home" thats just silly - I say 3 pigeons shot, not just 2 when they fly over. Having one extra shot is sometimes what you need and is never a bad thing.

I don't know what to say about having to unload a third shell?? the notion of it being a problem is nonexistant. And you don't have to load 3 - most clay ranges require only 2 shells be load in semi's at any one time so its a moot point.

As for people looking at you funny at a clay range thats daft - semi autos are used for clays all the time these days, let the snobs be damned - and while you won't be taking it to a grouse shoot, a beginner should be on his 2nd and 3rd gun by the time they are up for any of that! I know shoots that used to frown upon O/U's turning up and where a SxS is still the usually required gun (in pairs for assisted loading where possible).

A first gun for a beginner will also benefit from reduced recoil (despite needing perhaps 24gm+ to operate)which gas semi autos provide. An O/U can be punishing especially if mounted incorrectly as beginners do. Flinching is a problem with new shooters and a bruised shoulder is a put off. Gas Semis can help lessen this to begin with without clothing padding or lesser cartridges.
Yes you can shoot 21gm loads out of a O/U but you are not getting full use out of a cartridge.

Also a simplified single barrel aiming point aids in learning to shoot a shotgun on a moving target. Also if you are using it for say turkey hunting an optical sight can be utilised more effectively and semis can come with mounting points now where double shotguns do not.

If you cannot pickup your shells after then you I don't know what to say. I do have a telescopic magnetic stick which saves me bending over - works a treat and stays in my cartridge bag. This is for O/U and semis as my O/U spits them 6ft over my shoulder if I don't catch them!

The comment of buying an adjustable stock it a good one but they are rarely cheap and quite often offers surprising little of the adjustment needed to fit you. A rising cheek piece is all well and good but no good if the gun is too long or has too much drop in the first place. This is very common where the highest setting on an adjustable cheekpiece is no higher than a std comb on the same model non adj gun.
Most semis these days come with shims to adjust the stock somewhat and spacers to adjust length of pull and these you can do at home yourself. Most O/U are what they are and thats it. The cardbord and tape adjustments still work for both.

And as for the safety aspect - all guns are to be treated as loaded ALL THE TIME. This is where shotgunners most often fail (on the first law of gun handling no less) and rifle and pistol shooters are shocked when they 1st visit clay ranges.
The mishandling and mispointing I observe on any given day at a clay range as a rifle and ex pistol shooter is astounding. But on a clay range its normal.
Broken O/U = safe. I do get it, but proper gun handling, showing and checking clear and back in the slip when not being used isn't that difficult and should be drummed into you as a beginner, day one.

I sound like an advert for semis but I do love my O/U's too. Its horses for courses - but my advice to any beginner is the still the same really whether semi or O/U - get a gun that fits you. You will shoot it 100x better than one that doesn't.
Buy a common cheap gun and spend your money on a few lessons at a clay ground and lots of cartridges rather than a fancier gun.

I often stand at the bottom of a creek on an incoming tide in my waders then move back with the tide so cup my hand over the chambers where an auto will be spitting out the spent shells to see then floating away!

Regards taking 3 shots the reality of shooting 3 pigeons is the last bird will be on the cusp of distance flying away so the vitals will not be showing and you will chip it, for me 2 on the deck is enough at a time.

With an auto you have only one option of choke where I use my marsh gun then the 1/4 - 1/2 option works very well
as I will have often have a 32gm 4 in the 1/4 and 36gm 3 in the 1/2 choke so the option to switch if a high straight line bird is belting down the creek. (not with an auto)

Also same with my pigeon/game/rough shooting 12b but cyl 1/4
Regarding rough shooting I was taught to walk with it broken then close and shoot as it is technically
safe being broken where an auto is not as is shows loaded.

Back to pigeon shooting or in a clay stand , you never see the likes of Andy Crow Gerwyn Jones G Digweed Richard Faulds in the hide with one, Geoff Garrod yes but on clays he use an ou (as I have scored on the charity events he comes to) also on driven days he uses an OU.

You cant bend an Auto stock like a piece of wood (cross over stock ) is a good example also they don't handle or balance as well as a OU/sbs.

Waiting out the high tide with no spent rounds floating off..

 

[HandB]

I own six shotguns. Four Browning semi-autos (original A5s), a Webley & Scott 700 side by side and most recently a Browning B25 O/U (the no frills A1 version). They are all accurate and all have particular disciplines that I use them for. But if I was able to go back in time and advise my younger self which one to get as a beginner it would be the Browning B25. It is sound mechanically but quite battered cosmetically so has lots of personality, dates from the early 1960s and I bought it for £300 unseen off Guntrader. It's soft to shoot, beautifully balanced and is an allrounder in that it can do everything from game to clays and for £300 what's not to like. So I reckon have a look around for a no frills economically priced B25 from the late 1950s or early 1960s (the Browning glory years).

 

[jim37]

Thanks guys for the advice as for semi auto guns I do really fancy one but I feel more comfortable with O/U as I’ve fired semi autos a hand full of times plus being a lefty I didn’t like the cartridges flying out Infront of my face although a left handed semi is on the cards ! As for price of a gun if I can spend under £500 then grate but can’t see that happening as I keep adding an extra £50-100 before I know it I’m looking at £1500 guns but I would rather put more money in to my stalking (shot my first buck the other weekend and a couple of doe last year) so that’s why my shotgun budget is low but I do appreciate everyone’s advice being a new guy to the sport!

 

[MAH]

more likely be second

Second hand is a good option.
Unlike centre fire rifles the barrel is less likely to be a problem.
With a shotgun, personal fit is everything .
M

 

[gunmandanieltex]

I often stand at the bottom of a creek on an incoming tide in my waders then move back with the tide so cup my hand over the chambers where an auto will be spitting out the spent shells to see then floating away!

Regards taking 3 shots the reality of shooting 3 pigeons is the last bird will be on the cusp of distance flying away so the vitals will not be showing and you will chip it, for me 2 on the deck is enough at a time.

With an auto you have only one option of choke where I use my marsh gun then the 1/4 - 1/2 option works very well
as I will have often have a 32gm 4 in the 1/4 and 36gm 3 in the 1/2 choke so the option to switch if a high straight line bird is belting down the creek. (not with an auto)

Also same with my pigeon/game/rough shooting 12b but cyl 1/4
Regarding rough shooting I was taught to walk with it broken then close and shoot as it is technically
safe being broken where an auto is not as is shows loaded.

Back to pigeon shooting or in a clay stand , you never see the likes of Andy Crow Gerwyn Jones G Digweed Richard Faulds in the hide with one, Geoff Garrod yes but on clays he use an ou (as I have scored on the charity events he comes to) also on driven days he uses an OU.

You cant bend an Auto stock like a piece of wood (cross over stock ) is a good example also they don't handle or balance as well as a OU/sbs.

Waiting out the high tide with no spent rounds floating off..

I always try to shoot the pigeons as they come towards you (hopefully into your decoy pattern, not away) and I would not take a shot that did not stand a chance of a clean kill. Many a time I wished I had 4,5 and even six shots on hand. When they are coming in, they come in en masse an seem to ignore everything once commited to landing. And Mssers Digweed and the like get there guns free (sponsored and winning them) and are very experienced shooters who have many guns each for a specific purpose, Not a first gun on the cheap scenario there.
I would disagree on handling and balance. Its a matter of choice and preference. And you can't make a heavy gun lighter but you can add weight to a light gun.
The best of both worlds that I have held is the titanium barrelled Longthorne O/U. THE best handling shotgun I have held. If I win the lottery or when I retire its on the list!

 

[gunmandanieltex]

Thanks guys for the advice as for semi auto guns I do really fancy one but I feel more comfortable with O/U as I’ve fired semi autos a hand full of times plus being a lefty I didn’t like the cartridges flying out Infront of my face although a left handed semi is on the cards ! As for price of a gun if I can spend under £500 then grate but can’t see that happening as I keep adding an extra £50-100 before I know it I’m looking at £1500 guns but I would rather put more money in to my stalking (shot my first buck the other weekend and a couple of doe last year) so that’s why my shotgun budget is low but I do appreciate everyone’s advice being a new guy to the sport!

Make sure you get a neutral cast stock or see if you can find a left handed cast O/U stock. this will help fit.

 

[Tim.243]

I always try to shoot the pigeons as they come towards you (hopefully into your decoy pattern, not away) and I would not take a shot that did not stand a chance of a clean kill. Many a time I wished I had 4,5 and even six shots on hand. When they are coming in, they come in en masse an seem to ignore everything once commited to landing. And Mssers Digweed and the like get there guns free (sponsored and winning them) and are very experienced shooters who have many guns each for a specific purpose, Not a first gun on the cheap scenario there.
I would disagree on handling and balance. Its a matter of choice and preference. And you can't make a heavy gun lighter but you can add weight to a light gun.
The best of both worlds that I have held is the titanium barrelled Longthorne O/U. THE best handling shotgun I have held. If I win the lottery or when I retire its on the list!

You missed out the other points!
Lack of second barrel choke/cartridge options with an auto.
On a rough shooting day always looks loaded so you have to rack out what is in there to make it safe.

Anyhow the OP has the table laid out with nearly every option going.
Re pigeons this lot were coming in 2&3's so a pair of OU's covered each other.

 

[jim37]

Hi guys quick question I have been around a few shops over the weekend and I’ve decided to go for a brand new ata sp so I just need to phone back on Monday to my local shop and confirm what make model and size I would like and they will order it from sportsman gun centre. I was looking to order a ata sp left handed 28inch but can’t seem to find them on there site when I’m positive I have before anyway quick search on guntrader and I found one ! Question is the guns I have been looking at over the weekend all new but 30inch barrels all come with 2 years warranty but I have been in contact with the one on gun trader and they have also confirmed it is a new gun and comes with 5 years warranty?
I’m confused how if it’s the same new gun (ata sp sporter left handed) but there is a difference in the warranty! Hopefully I’m not being stupid and missing something

 

[gunmandanieltex]

Sportsmans is the official ATA importers. Quick ring to find out and also to find out if the dealer is getting it from them or a grey import. might be why you are getting different warranty info.01392 354854.

 

[Greenmist]

Forget the make, go for the one that fits you best