Importing expanding missiles from abroad - BASC clarify position

[jon2]

Matt Perring is absolutely correct. The confusion seems to arise from the fact that component parts are not classed as ammunition until fully assembled into the complete cartridge. However this is not the case where expanding missiles (bullets) are concerned. The S5 prohibition on expanding ammunition specifically includes expanding missiles themselves. It follows that expanding missiles (bullets) are themselves prohibited ammunition. They do not require to be assembled into a cartridge to become 'ammunition'.
Timbrayford is also correct. It has been ACPO's view, for many years, that the prohibition of expanding ammunition serves no useful purpose.
The prohibition has it's origins with the dreadful murders in Dunblane, when Hamilton used expanding ammunition in his pistols to kill the children and their teacher.
Our military members will know, far better that I, how deadly fully jacketed ammunition is. The prohibition makes no sense however much of the firearms legislation is in need of revision.

Uncle Norm I think everyone has already got that. The information you have posted as per quote above is correct and everybody already understands the position ref expanding bullets and we are not debating that point here.

I agree ref the ACPO position and it seemed that BASC were working towards having expanding bullets exempt from any control. Perhaps Matt Perring can comment on whether or not this is likely to happen in the future?

What this thread has highlighted is the rediculous situation we find ourselves in regarding expanding bullets and yes I have read the studies which Laurie Holland made reference to in another one of his excellent articles stating that FMJ bullets cause greater wounding etc etc (simplified view of the research carried out).

 

[timbrayford]

If there is a consensus that the S5 controls on expanding ammunition are serving no useful purpose could they be removed by a Statutory Instrument from the HO? atb Tim

 

[jon2]

If there is a consensus that the S5 controls on expanding ammunition are serving no useful purpose could they be removed by a Statutory Instrument from the HO? atb Tim

Tim I agree entirely.

Perhaps we could start a new thread regarding this.

It seemed not so long ago that BASC were forging ahead in an attempt to have them removed from S5 classification and according to what Matt Perring has been posting of late in these exchanges it appears that BASC are no longer persuing this. Perhaps Matt can clarify?

Regards

JB

 

[Paul at Fechan]

Correct unlike Paul. The law is the law with firearms despite what waiver we have on import licenses.

it IS an offence for a non authorised person to receive the ammo or missiles thereof and it is reckless to suggest otherwise.

Uou can't seriously be suggesting that the category of the item is waived until the certificate holder takes possession!! The only thing that has been waived is the buck import license.

So you confirming that I as a certificate holder can receive package and that's fine whether or not RM carry it or any other carrier?. I'm not suggesting that a person recieving such item without authority 'should' be made the receiver but it is not an offence for a person to accept or receive mis-delivered post when they certainly don't know what it is.

A really smart guy once told me that people that are good at there jobs provide solutions and not problems to issues in focus and everyone else is a waste of space. Perhaps you could provide solutions to this import business regarding expanding bullets so that we could work round the 'loophole' with a clean set of rules so that WE the certificate holders could have our bullets delivered.

Why don't you give us the set of circumstances where the delivery guy knocks on our door and places a package in our hand where we take advantage of the loophole and win.

 

[Tom D]

I have to say, having read this I feel none the wiser.

One point that hasn't really been raised and is, to me at least, at the heart of the issue is not the cost or savings to be made its the availability. There are precious few RFD's round here, most don't stock much. I would love to be able to go on line and order from a vast range of bullet weights and designs from different manufacturers, click the ones I want and have them arrive in the post soon after.

So it would seem that I may or may not need an export liscence from the US but would in theory be able to have them delivered to my home.

What if I ask my sister in Minnesota to buy some at the local wall mart and post them out???

 

[bruce w]

from fully jacketed to expanding is a matter of seconds on a belt sander,so the plan to keep them out of the hands of nutters falls apart, the end.

 

[mperring]

from fully jacketed to expanding is a matter of seconds on a belt sander,so the plan to keep them out of the hands of nutters falls apart, the end.

Which the law doesn't allow but the law can never truly prevent those intent on breaking the law

 

[mperring]

BASC and ACPO submitted a draft regulatory reform order list including repeal of the ban on expanding ammo. This is with the home office but Cumbria and Durham shootings put this on the back burner.

We met the new minister earlier this month and the ACPO lead Mr Marsh had asked home office to look at resurrecting the RRO

 

[mereside]

so Matt is this legal to bring in expanding to a home address from cliffs as small packages keeping to allocated allowance on fac i have gotton lost with all this now,atb wayne

 

[mperring]

so Matt is this legal to bring in expanding to a home address from cliffs as small packages keeping to allocated allowance on fac i have gotton lost with all this now,atb wayne

If you have an FAC for the calibre and qty of missiles you wish to import and the company abroad can ship to the uk then it is lawful to buy and cause the relevant missiles to be imported. The dept for bis and the executive agency border force will permit missiles to travel on should they detect hem in the first place and when the recipients details are checked on the national firearms database.

 

[mereside]

thanks thats great, atb wayne

 

[Paul at Fechan]

If you have an FAC for the calibre and qty of missiles you wish to import and the company abroad can ship to the uk then it is lawful to buy and cause the relevant missiles to be imported. The dept for bis and the executive agency border force will permit missiles to travel on should they detect hem in the first place and when the recipients details are checked on the national firearms database.

SCORE! Thanks

 

[waterford103]

It certainly wouldn't save me much money though as i am only aloud to buy 300 of each call at any one time. By the time shipping + VAT + Handling fee it would likelly be more expensive.

Ads

I import from a firm in Luxembourg ,I listed the link on this thread.I order on line at my max quantiy and they arrive ,postage is very reasonable ,last on wwas 15 euros .The courier hands me the box and I check the contents and write them onto my FAC -- no problem .Grampian firearms are happy for me to do it. The cost savings over buying at my local RFD are typically 30% including postage -- no vat (europe) no hidden charges --- simples.

 

[finnbear270]

I import from a firm in Luxembourg ,I listed the link on this thread.I order on line at my max quantiy and they arrive ,postage is very reasonable ,last on wwas 15 euros .The courier hands me the box and I check the contents and write them onto my FAC -- no problem .Grampian firearms are happy for me to do it. The cost savings over buying at my local RFD are typically 30% including postage -- no vat (europe) no hidden charges --- simples.

So what about sharing the details?

 

[waterford103]

http://www.shooting-supplies.eu/en/home.html

 

[finnbear270]

http://www.shooting-supplies.eu/en/home.html

A bit limited on manufacturers bullet wise, but better than now't, thanks for the link, Steve.