Legality and Efficacy of Bowhunting in the UK

[25 Sharps]

Good Afternoon all,

I've scrubbed over the past forums however given the rise in popularity over the last couple of years both with our cousins across the pond and on the continent I was curious as to where the community stands on this issue now.

I myself have participated in the sport in the states and found that the effectiveness with which a bow puts down game is comparable to a rifle in terms of ethics (providing your placement is good and range within your capabilities). However understand the legislative issues that could be brought into play. For those who haven't yet been exposed to bowhunting I recommend watching this film. It truly shows in my opinion what bowhunting is all about.



My position is as follows:

Bowhunting should be legalised in the UK in the same way that rifle hunting is. It should require a slot on the FAC specifying that a bow can be used for game. It is then down to land owners whether or not a bow can be used for their deer. Legislation should then be put into place requiring minimum draw weight, grain weight and type of broadhead used. It is then down to individuals and hunting outfitters to ensure that they (or their clients) are competent with the equipment.

I'd appreciate opinions and any good/bad experiences that people have had with this method of taking game.

I do request we keep it civil as I know this is a marmite subject for many!

I look forward to having my mind changed or my position affirmed!

How can you licence bows when so many have them for non hunting purposes?

 

[HallyButt]

I see absolutely no issue whatsoever, less dangerous than cars that any muppet can jump in and drive, too many rules in life as it is

 

[slider]

Maybe people do wander where they have no permission but how is using a bow in that situation any worse than a rifle?

Worse in what way?

No worse for the member of the public but I would imagine it will certainly make the actual hunting more difficult.
Turn up with a rifle, spot a deer up to 200m away. Ensure backstop and no one present. Bang flop

Turn up with a bow, spot deer 200m away. Spend hours trying to get within 25m. Far more chance of the quarry being disturbed by roving people/dogs in that timeframe.

So, no worse safety wise but so impractical in a country with the population density of the UK that it's all but pointless.

 

[25 Sharps]

my vote is no. as i live in the south east of england . a very over populated area, where a bow would appear to be far more dangerous that a fire arm using a safe back stop and safe practices .an arrow can pass through a game animal and not expand like a cup and core lead bullet does and can be deflected and head in a different direction etc ,perhaps in the north of the country it would be safer but down here a no it is.

You’ve never shot a bow have you?

the vast majority you shoot with a bow will pretty much be below horizontal. The arrow will hit the ground very quickly after the intended target. They just don’t have the BC, velocity or energy of a bullet. Once in the ground it will bury itself in the vegetation very quickly, even if it slides along the ground.

Arrows don’t ricochet and they don’t carry energy very far, they are far, far safer than a rifle, even than an FAC air rifle shooting slugs

 

[Morkai]

Worse in what way?

No worse for the member of the public but I would imagine it will certainly make the actual hunting more difficult.

Maybe I read your initial comment about the public being present in the wrong way. I took it as a safety concern, not the fact they would distrub the deer.

My mistake.

Turn up with a rifle, spot a deer up to 200m away. Ensure backstop and no one present. Bang flop

Turn up with a bow, spot deer 200m away. Spend hours trying to get within 25m. Far more chance of the quarry being disturbed by roving people/dogs in that timeframe.

So, no worse safety wise but so impractical in a country with the population density of the UK that it's all but pointless.

To be fair, where I shoot I dont see anyone unless I'm out with a friend. Depends where you live.

Maybe some people would welcome the challenge of that kind of stalk too.

I know some have mentioned that it's not an efficient method of controlling deer, but who says everyone who stalks is in it to control the population, some just like the hunt and the meat.

 

[OllieRiordanDeer]

How can you licence bows when so many have them for non hunting purposes?

It would be a licence to use them for hunting not a licence to own. Same as applying for other licences for types of game.

Not the perfect solution but maybe the only way it would get accepted.

 

[OllieRiordanDeer]

would be interesting to know how many in this thread have shot a modern compound bow?

they dont need to licence the bows they just need to issue a deer tag like over in the states alongside a simple shooting test.

This would be a great solution for the recreational stalker for sure! Would even increase participation as it would reduce price and hoops to jump through to start stalking. really good idea.

 

[VSS]

How can you licence bows when so many have them for non hunting purposes?

Some people have rifles for non hunting purposes, but there doesn't seem to be any difficulty licensing those.

 

[25 Sharps]

It would be a licence to use them for hunting not a licence to own. Same as applying for other licences for types of game.

Not the perfect solution but maybe the only way it would get accepted.

So what is to stop someone just going and using a bow for hunting. As they would now?

 

[Morkai]

No point in a license and tags for bows, its like making someone have tags for rabbit shooting with a sub 12 air rifle if they decide they're bored of shooting targets....

We know how good Scotland's AR licensing is.

You need no qualifications or tags for deer shooting, no need even for an FAC if using an estate rifle.

 

[slider]

Maybe I read your initial comment about the public being present in the wrong way. I took it as a safety concern, not the fact they would distrub the deer.

My mistake.



To be fair, where I shoot I dont see anyone unless I'm out with a friend. Depends where you live.

Maybe some people would welcome the challenge of that kind of stalk too.

I know some have mentioned that it's not an efficient method of controlling deer, but who says everyone who stalks is in it to control the population, some just like the hunt and the meat.

Don't disagree with anything you say, but the way the general population think I can see (so of) them accepting deer control for a number of valid reasons but hunting for pleasure will be increasingly under pressure. The ONLY reason I can see to allow bow hunting in the UK to provide a recreational experience, therefore I see absolutely no milage in perusing the dream.

Don't get me wrong, I am not against recreational stalking but I am a realist not a dreamer

 

[Morkai]

Don't disagree with anything you say, but the way the general population think I can see (so of) them accepting deer control for a number of valid reasons but hunting for pleasure will be increasingly under pressure. The ONLY reason I can see to allow bow hunting in the UK to provide a recreational experience, therefore I see absolutely no milage in perusing the dream.

Don't get me wrong, I am not against recreational stalking but I am a realist not a dreamer

I agree 100%, pal.

It'll never happen.

 

[slider]

This would be a great solution for the recreational stalker for sure! Would even increase participation as it would reduce price and hoops to jump through to start stalking. really good idea.

and the authorities want to increase participation and reduce hoops????

 

[RCS Deer Management]

Worse in what way?

No worse for the member of the public but I would imagine it will certainly make the actual hunting more difficult.
Turn up with a rifle, spot a deer up to 200m away. Ensure backstop and no one present. Bang flop

Turn up with a bow, spot deer 200m away. Spend hours trying to get within 25m. Far more chance of the quarry being disturbed by roving people/dogs in that timeframe.

So, no worse safety wise but so impractical in a country with the population density of the UK that it's all but pointless.

just because you have large amounts of public access doesn’t mean that everyone does. On a lot of my ground I have never seen a member of the public.

 

[Danny25790]

I'd be all for it having personally hunted with a bow there is nothing like it.
Not having it on a FAC though but having a separate licensing scheme in place like a fishing license. An adequate training course to prove your competency annually would be ideal as well and i believe it should that way for firearms as well, when i was in the army we had to qualify every year to use our personal weapons so why dont civilians? ( skill fade is real) it would create more jobs in training/advisory roles for the stalking community which is a bonus.

Bow hunting is an art form, it is a dying art and one that takes true skill to be able to do effectively, so simply picking up a bow from your local country retailer and trying to bag a buck would be near on impossible without proper training and practice.

There would have to be specified weights for certain game to be more humane, ie a minimum draw weight of 45lb with a broad head of no less than 125gr for fallow, things like expanding broad heads with chisle points are a thing and the wound channel from such a broad head is so massive that it puts a .308 to shame.

I've come across people that can put 5 arrows in a tennis ball sized target at 40-50 yards, and also come across people that can't put 5 rounds of .338 lapua magnum in a fig11 target at 100 meters, so arrow vs bullet it's just down to training, practice and knowledge, it has very little to do with what's safe and what's not safe because both have the ability to unsafe in incompetent hands.


We can legally own bows in today's society so if poachers wanted to or had the skill to then they would already be hunting with one so it changes nothing in that respect.

I own bows and have shot bows since I was a kid, but I've shot rifles almost as long and if it were a choice between a rifle and a bow then the rifle would be the winner everytime, but I'd still like the ability to change things up, enjoy traditional methods of hunting and teach my son the old ways of putting food on the table.

 

[nun_hunter]

Again what is you back up shot ollie? As the thread is about bow hunting not a single shot rifle

What's your backup shot when in thick woodland and in half a second the muntjac is gone behind some trees or bramble? Whats your backup shot at last light when you can see the deer in your scope but not the naked eye? Both scenarios are very common (especially with the amount of hot air spoken about the top end Euro glass giving them an extra 20 minutes) and even if you had a semi auto CF rifle you'd not get a follow up.

Problems for the sake of problems

 

[OllieRiordanDeer]

I'd be all for it having personally hunted with a bow there is nothing like it.
Not having it on a FAC though but having a separate licensing scheme in place like a fishing license.

Bow hunting is an art form, it is a dying art and one that takes true skill to be able to do effectively, so simply picking up a bow from your local country retailer and trying to bag a buck would be near on impossible without proper training and practice.

There would have to be specified weights for certain game to be more humane, ie a minimum draw weight of 45lb with a broad head of no less than 125gr for fallow, things like expanding broad heads with chisle points are a thing and the wound channel from such a broad head is so massive that it puts a .308 to shame.

I've come across people that can put 5 arrows in a tennis ball sized target at 40-50 yards, and also come across people that can't put 5 rounds of .338 lapua magnum in a fig11 target at 100 meters, so arrow vs bullet it's just down to training, practice and knowledge, it has very little to do with what's safe and what's not safe because both have the ability to unsafe in incompetent hands.


We can legally own bows in today's society so if poachers wanted to or had the skill to then they would already be hunting with one so it changes nothing in that respect.

I own bows and have shot bows since I was a kid, but I've shot rifles almost as long and if it were a choice between a rifle and a bow then the rifle would be the winner everytime, but I'd still like the ability to change things up, enjoy traditional methods of hunting and teach my son the old ways of putting food on the table.

Couldn't have put it better myself

 

[nun_hunter]

We can legally own bows in today's society so if poachers wanted to or had the skill to then they would already be hunting with one so it changes nothing in that respect.

Exactly this. It's not happening now (at least not on any scale) so why would it suddenly increase? You still need permission to be on the land so it would be no different to anyone poaching now. I would pretty much guarantee more poaching goes on now with legally held rifles than with bows by people who are supposedly law abiding, and yet you mention bowhunting and all of a sudden its only council estate chavs who will be out firing arrows off everywhere.

 

[Tim.243]

What's your backup shot when in thick woodland and in half a second the muntjac is gone behind some trees or bramble? Whats your backup shot at last light when you can see the deer in your scope but not the naked eye? Both scenarios are very common (especially with the amount of hot air spoken about the top end Euro glass giving them an extra 20 minutes) and even if you had a semi auto CF rifle you'd not get a follow up.

Problems for the sake of problems

I use the drone 10 so have more than 20 mins...

 

[OllieRiordanDeer]

So what is to stop someone just going and using a bow for hunting. As they would now?

Wildlife and countryside act prohibits it