Magpie dropped from 2024 Welsh general licences

[Bo Diddley]

Can everyone film them pulling Grey Partridge nests apart,or Long Tailed Tits etc....

I'm sure "Spring Watch" has such footage already... of course they choose not to show it...
It's like the section they did on Goshawks only bringing grey squirrels to the nest to feed chicks... the nest was in a fir plantation and pretty much the only prey those hawks had to catch was the Grey Menace

 

[Beretta V]

You drive around the housing estates around Bury St Edmunds and all you see is bloody magpie’s. With people feeding birds all the time now (which is great) it has resulted in an explosion of the buggers over the last few years. They IMO should be culled heavily not protected - can’t imagine it any different in any other part of the country.

I use to work in Bury st Edmunds and the place was riddled with them.
I live beside a nature reserve and all we see is grey tree rats, magpies and bloody badgers.
Why do they protect vermin?
The country needs a big wake up call if they want to actually keep the place beautiful!

I take my son to minsmere and I have actually got some wardens to admit that they cull vermin!!
Would they admit that on camera??

 

[Bo Diddley]

One man's meat is another man's poison.
My neighbors on one side are avid fans of Chris Packham, they feed the birds a lot, including a mob of rooks every day, it's like an Alfred Hitchcock film.
Grey squirrels also feast on the offerings, a few feast on a lead pellet when they stray into my garden for the Walnuts in the autumn.
But the furry critters that give them the most joy are a pair of Muntjac that come to a feeder a few meters from their kitchen window, Kylie suffers from Bipolar, and it gives her a little joy each day to watch the Munties.

 

[old keeper]

Protecting predators of any sort in a small country like ours is sheer lunacy and shows a total lack of knowledge of how nature works. Left unchecked predators will eventually remove the vulnerable species below them.
Magpies are a scourge in the countryside and along with other corvids in my area are in greater numbers than I've ever seen over the last seventy years. By the same token small songbird species are in severe decline.
I won't even start on the damage that ravens, magpies, and crows are doing at lambing time.

Sheer stupidity on the part of the Welsh set up

 

[8x57]

Does the Welsh government seek any advice/consultation on these subjects??

Form your own opinion, this is a quote from them-

"Who are we seeking feedback from?

This is not a public consultation, We are inviting feedback only from organisations which are members of our informal stakeholder group.

If your organisation has not received the link to this page directly from NRW, please do not submit a response, as your comments will not be taken into account."



In my opinion from previou dealings with them the answer would be a big fat No. In fact both the NGO and BASC have previously commented that WAG have refused to engage with them. They only speak to their small group of associates.

 

[Roebuck9]

Form your own opinion, this is a quote from them-

"Who are we seeking feedback from?

This is not a public consultation, We are inviting feedback only from organisations which are members of our informal stakeholder group.

If your organisation has not received the link to this page directly from NRW, please do not submit a response, as your comments will not be taken into account."



In my opinion from previou dealings with them the answer would be a big fat No. In fact both the NGO and BASC have previously commented that WAG have refused to engage with them. They only speak to their small group of associates.

Just like the Scottish N.P. they do their own thing without knowing or considering the full story but how the mighty fall! It only takes time.

 

[AGR]

Can everyone film them pulling Grey Partridge nests ap Long Tailed Tits etc....

I'm sure "Spring Watch" has such footage already... of course they choose not to show it...
It's like the section they did on Goshawks only bringing grey squirrels to the nest to feed chicks... the nest was in a fir plantation and pretty much the only prey those hawks had to catch was the Grey Menace

From my experience, squirrels are/were the chief culprit for destroying long tailed tit nests.

 

[Daisymay]

My thoughts are ,and I may be totally wrong so let me apologise in advance, is that many of the people in power have been born and raised in the cities and have no clue on what real life is like in the countryside, it really surprises me that of all the politicians that represent our rural communities do not intervien in these decisions, or are they also city born and raised, there's an election coming soon so let's see what happens.

 

[Dunwaters]

Calm down, it’s not the end of the world, maggers and jays have a reputation for damage that far exceeds their actual abilities.
I used to control them here, gun, traps and nest poking, but I’ve stopped.
All the indicators are that the only real difference is that there are a few more magpies about nowadays.
The blackbird here can kick off nesting in February, which is crazy early, and those nests are regularly plundered, but they go again, one pair raised 3 broods last year, plus the February false start.
I would target them if there was a particularly vulnerable species nesting in the area, but generally speaking they make very little difference.

 

[old keeper]

Calm down, it’s not the end of the world, maggers and jays have a reputation for damage that far exceeds their actual abilities.
I used to control them here, gun, traps and nest poking, but I’ve stopped.
All the indicators are that the only real difference is that there are a few more magpies about nowadays.
The blackbird here can kick off nesting in February, which is crazy early, and those nests are regularly plundered, but they go again, one pair raised 3 broods last year, plus the February false start.
I would target them if there was a particularly vulnerable species nesting in the area, but generally speaking they make very little difference.

You live in a different world to me! Jays are pretty scarce hereabouts but there are now literally hordes of magpies around together with all the other corvids, the damage they cause to other forms of wildlife is substantial. Blackbirds, thrushes, and other songbirds have little chance of bringing broods to maturity. They are egg-stealing, nestling-killing, eye-pecking bastards!

 

[Pete1774]

Given their rampant lunacy, crows is my bet.

Magpies were the first because they are cute I suppose

 

[Bo Diddley]

Most of us know how destructive Magpies and Carrion crows are, they are superb predators of any young birds and nests all through the spring and early summer.
I remember years ago before Larsen traps were available, sitting on the floor of a fairly dense woodland under the Holly bushes rifling with a shotgun magpies as they landed on the floor to hunt for the early pheasant nests, the best afternoon accounted for 23 Magpies.
I shot 17 jays a couple of years ago in one small block of woodland, springtime again, they were coming to a squirrel feeder with peanuts, I surprised myself with the quantity as I usually only spotted a pair and thought it was always the same pair... how wrong I was. All legal under the general license scheme at the time before anyone asks.

 

[Dunwaters]

You live in a different world to me! Jays are pretty scarce hereabouts but there are now literally hordes of magpies around together with all the other corvids, the damage they cause to other forms of wildlife is substantial. Blackbirds, thrushes, and other songbirds have little chance of bringing broods to maturity. They are egg-stealing, nestling-killing, eye-pecking bastards!

Agreed, that’s what they do, but how much effect does it really have on population levels?
I’m in the same situation as you, but bird population's and nesting success seems largely unaffected whether I hammer the maggers or let them be.
Given the population of magpies living unmolested lives in the suburbs at artificially high numbers boosted by supplementary feeding, you’d expect that there wouldn’t be a single bird left, but there is, and lots of them.

 

[jall55]

I'm sure "Spring Watch" has such footage already... of course they choose not to show it...
It's like the section they did on Goshawks only bringing grey squirrels to the nest to feed chicks... the nest was in a fir plantation and pretty much the only prey those hawks had to catch was the Grey Menace

In fairness to them - they do show it
They showed Jays tasking many broods last year - then just added - oh its a shame but its nature
No its not - too many generalist predators because of too many people leaving their litter - food rubbish about

 

[jall55]

I use to work in Bury st Edmunds and the place was riddled with them.
I live beside a nature reserve and all we see is grey tree rats, magpies and bloody badgers.
Why do they protect vermin?
The country needs a big wake up call if they want to actually keep the place beautiful!

I take my son to minsmere and I have actually got some wardens to admit that they cull vermin!!
Would they admit that on camera??

How true is this !
I live close to our council - award winning nature reserve - rats are out in the day !
I said to our MP when i met him go look in the spring and you will see so few duckling - but large number of corvids - i then had to explain what a corvid was

 

[jall55]

Calm down, it’s not the end of the world, maggers and jays have a reputation for damage that far exceeds their actual abilities.
I used to control them here, gun, traps and nest poking, but I’ve stopped.
All the indicators are that the only real difference is that there are a few more magpies about nowadays.
The blackbird here can kick off nesting in February, which is crazy early, and those nests are regularly plundered, but they go again, one pair raised 3 broods last year, plus the February false start.
I would target them if there was a particularly vulnerable species nesting in the area, but generally speaking they make very little difference.

Hi Dunwater
I think maybe you have not looked very closely - the nests i find plundered is enough to make a difference
They have zero tolerance on our estate and i already have the traps ready for the first sign of them becoming territorial
And please dont forget - magpies this year - crows next ?

 

[timbrayford]

General licensing needs to be got rid of altogether and go back to the previous legislation, this is still unfinished business from the dictatorial EU. i.e. repeael the EU based legislation and return to the Protection of Birds Act 1954. Over to you Conor, lets stop the antis dictating the agenda and extend discussions beyond current GLs to whether they serve any useful purpose at all.

 

[Dunwaters]

Hi Dunwater
I think maybe you have not looked very closely - the nests i find plundered is enough to make a difference
They have zero tolerance on our estate and i already have the traps ready for the first sign of them becoming territorial
And please dont forget - magpies this year - crows next ?

Maybe I phrased it badly.
You guys have been shooting and trapping magpies on sight for close on 200 years.
During that time the population of small birds has fallen, mostly due to habitat loss and pesticides.
Over the last 40 years or so, magpies have invaded the cities and suburbs where they are largely left unmolested.
Has the small bird population in cities declined proportionally in association with the increased magpie population?
If not, why not?
The more I look at what we do, the more convinced I am that we actually make very little difference most of the time and we would be far better off targeting our efforts where they’ll do most good.
For example, where a high population of common predators exists close to a colony of vulnerable species, it makes sense to reduce the odds in favour of the species you are trying to protect because each individual nest represents a sizeable proportion of that years potential population recruitment.
So trap and shoot the predators around the site.
But trying to kill them all you’re just ****inginthewind. There’s simply too many of them in too many places that you can’t touch to have much effect.

When it comes to crows you have allies, sheep and free range poultry farmers, plus cattlemen with feedlots, they’ll see to it that crows stay where they are.

 

[Ronin]

You drive around the housing estates around Bury St Edmunds and all you see is bloody magpie’s. With people feeding birds all the time now (which is great) it has resulted in an explosion of the buggers over the last few years. They IMO should be culled heavily not protected - can’t imagine it any different in any other part of the country.

Cull people on council estates ?


Not sure that would catch on ,,,

 

[Tazz]

From 1 January 2024 you will need to apply for a specific licence to take or kill a magpie in Wales for any purpose. That includes the use of magpie as a call bird in cage traps (Larsen, Ladder etc.).

Magpie had been dropped from the 2023 general licence for the purpose of conserving wild birds and will not be on the 2024 general licence for that purpose. Magpie was on the 2023 general licence for the purpose of preventing serious damage or spread of disease to livestock, foodstuffs for livestock, crops, vegetables or fruit but will be dropped from the 2024 general licence for that purpose. This means that from 1 January 2024 magpie will not be covered by any general licence in Wales, which is a precedent in the UK for this species since general licences first came into being in the 1990s - under a UK-specific derogation from EU directives for the protection of birds.

The reasoning that Natural Resources Wales (NRW) gave for the removal of magpie is in relation to species population data and that is outlined here:

Review of 2023 General Licences for wild bird control - Natural Resources Wales Citizen Space - Citizen Space

Find and participate in consultations run by Natural Resources Wales

ymgynghori.cyfoethnaturiol.cymru

The 2024 Welsh general licences for species such as Canada goose, carrion crow, feral pigeon, jackdaw and woodpigeon have been published and are here:

Natural Resources Wales / General licences for birds 2024

naturalresources.wales

Good idea dropping Magpies as they are very rare these days some days you can walk for yards before seeing 12