Neilson Sonic lead free bullets

[Jagdmatch]

I have changed over to copper in 375, 300WM and 260 rem exclusively in Barnes bullets. Not such good results with 6.5 x55 which I think is due to the barrel twist. I have been very impressed with the commercial Sako Barnes round which I use at work. I like the look of the 416 option.
The issue for me is not actually the stalking but practice and competition shooting. Whilst I do not expect any compromise I see no evidence to suggest that recoverable lead is a danger to health when fired into a backstop and sieved out. I also think there need to be a better description of how frangible the product is.

 

[Magnificent 7]

yeah thats fine if you take everything for your own larder but on my current trip it would likely cost perhaps £500 and upwards in ammo

If it hurst cost wise then stop doing it if contracting and you can’t make it pay then stop.

£5 per bullet may be a consideration for those who like to practice bit though.

But if your wanting to practice why use copper cheap enough practice ammo can be purchased still legally anyhow it’s not meant as an argument and something I don’t want this topic like others ended up as one.On another note if the game dealers are demanding it then they need to allow a little price increase to ease the pain reloading my own in 243 and 308 in lead free it certainly doesn’t cost anywhere near £5 per round mind haven’t really added up the cost as tbh it doesn’t really bother me but out of interest in just about to do so watch this space lol

 

[Magnificent 7]

Cost for my reloads 243 is £2.43 that’s using new brass and yewtree
308 is £2.32 using new brass and yewtree obviously once your reloading spent brass cost drops that doesn’t take into account cost of equipment time just raw equipment that cost could be reduced by roughly 70 pence if using say Sierra lead alternative.factory loaded Geco £40 a box for 308 for example

 

[Magnificent 7]

A

 

[sauer]

price per round mounts up when factoring in load development and tweaking


i agree to original posters take on it that a fragmenting round goes against the " ethos" of non lead but ...as pointe d out already .... its a small figure of parts..and when compare to the microscopic findings with lead and how much it covers the carcass its not the same really

same as anything else in life......take in the available info, try it for yourslef...it either works for you or it does'nt, either physically coz it does'nt group or because your not comfortable with the fragmenting thing...... or for others purely cost ....

some will like , some won't ...
we are all different, all grown up and all make our own minds up

Paul

 

[JH83]

We really should not overplay copper as toxic , even water is toxic if the dose is high enough ! Copper is a very, very safe metal . It naturally kills bacteria and is the material we used to replace the old lead pipes because of this and its ductility , pretty much the ideal bullet material tbf . Besides it makes for some awesome bullets, albeit at a higher cost due to the required processes and metal cost over lead

I do agree with what you are saying, my point is really that using non-fragmenting type bullets are safeguarding ourselves against the natural progression of the objection to lead which may..MAY…end up being directed at copper by the anti shooting fraternity (whom I suspect are the driving force behind much of the ‘change’ shooting sports are currently subject to).

I have only ever recovered one Barnes from a deer as they usually pass through, it was from a front on neck shot on a large sika stag. I didn’t weigh it but I’d reckon it was close to its original weight, a few grains less perhaps. Ideal in my book.

 

[Bowland blades]

If it hurst cost wise then stop doing it if contracting and you can’t make it pay then stop.
But if your wanting to practice why use copper cheap enough practice ammo can be purchased still legally anyhow it’s not meant as an argument and something I don’t want this topic like others ended up as one.On another note if the game dealers are demanding it then they need to allow a little price increase to ease the pain reloading my own in 243 and 308 in lead free it certainly doesn’t cost anywhere near £5 per round mind haven’t really added up the cost as tbh it doesn’t really bother me but out of interest in just about to do so watch this space lol

it costs about £1:50 max building my own ! I can also keep components unlimited , to ride over shortages

 

[Bowland blades]

I do agree with what you are saying, my point is really that using non-fragmenting type bullets are safeguarding ourselves against the natural progression of the objection to lead which may..MAY…end up being directed at copper by the anti shooting fraternity (whom I suspect are the driving force behind much of the ‘change’ shooting sports are currently subject to).

the anti will point their finger at anything so . its not the anti unfortunately , its food standards that has got us on the venison . our biggest customers are in Europe where they have said we wont buy meat contaminated with lead - how do you argue with that ?

 

[25 Sharps]

Whats a biometal bullet?

I am not convinced that the fragmenting bullets such as Geco Zero are the way to go. Yes they replace lead with less harmful Zinc, but you are still leaving a lot of fragments in the carcass / meat.

I think the Monolithic type bullets where the bullet expands into a spinning flower type shape, but stays together and retains 99% of its weight is the way to go. Most have a hollow point, often covered with either a plastic or brass / bronze / copper tip that helps initiate expansion.

Plenty of good options now available : Barnes TTSX, Sako Blade, Fox, Peregrine, yew Tree, Virtus Precision etc.

I have been using Fox and Peregrines for a while and friends using others. They all seem to work well and not make a mess of the carcass. I have yet to find any fragments left behind in the carcass.

But If they do leave a fragment it is easily large enough to be seen by the naked eye and before processing.

With the fragmenting designs, the fragments are often too small to be visible by naked eye, and thus can easily eaten in say a burger.

You are aware yew tree and virtus are fragmenting and some bullets leave the brass or copper tip in the carcass aren’t you?

 

[Bowland blades]

The irony, just like lead

No Lead is very well known as a serious Toxin

 

[25 Sharps]

it costs about £1:50 max building my own ! I can also keep components unlimited , to ride over shortages

No you can’t, both powder and primers are limited, as you can only hold a limited amount of explosive and shooters powder on an FAC.

 

[Magnificent 7]

No you can’t, both powder and primers are limited, as you can only hold a limited amount of explosive and shooters powder on an FAC.

Only FAC needed to purchase primers not needed for powder or any other component and I hadn’t heard of any limit on powder either ??? And is there a limit on primers also ? I thought just loaded ammo limit

 

[hendrix's rifle]

A

No Lead is very well known as a serious Toxin

Along with copper and water... It's all about moderation

 

[webley701]

No you can’t, both powder and primers are limited, as you can only hold a limited amount of explosive and shooters powder on an FAC.

This is a misleading statement. There are certain regulations relating to ‘shooters powders’ but they have nothing to do with an FAC (ditto primers).

 

[25 Sharps]

Only FAC needed to purchase primers not needed for powder or any other component and I hadn’t heard of any limit on powder either ??? And is there a limit on primers also ? I thought just loaded ammo limit

Explosive regulations allow an FAC or SGC holder to hold 10 kg + 5 kg of shooters powder and priming compound, to include loaded ammunition.

If you want to hold more you need an explosives licence.

Here you go

Storing explosives - HSE

Storing explosives

www.hse.gov.uk

 

[25 Sharps]

This is a misleading statement. There are certain regulations relating to ‘shooters powders’ but they have nothing to do with an FAC (ditto primers).

No it isn’t!

You cannot purchase metallic primers without an FAC.

If you do not have an explosive licence you cannot acquire powders without an FAC or SGC (or RFD) and there is a limit to what you can hold on an FAC.

And here you go

Storing explosives - HSE

Storing explosives

www.hse.gov.uk

Also see section 22 page 5

https://nares.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Explosives-REV2.pdf

 

[Leec6.5]

it costs about £1:50 max building my own ! I can also keep components unlimited , to ride over shortages

I am loading Barnes TTSX for my 7x57 for a gnats cock more @ £1.85 a bang and considering i was at £1.47 a bang back in 2010 the cost really is nothing, no more than a premium lead bullet!

 

[Leec6.5]

Its nice to see others taking the path of non lead bullets for their stalking and i see they are now voicing against the same arguments i have many times in the past.

There some who have completely converted and some who wont until the dying days, but i hope those who are hanging on have a non lead load in the cupboard ready do go, if the worst comes and lead is banned, if not there are some going to in a proper buggers muddle.

 

[Magnificent 7]

No it isn’t!

You cannot purchase an metallic primers without an FAC.

If you do not have an explosive licence you cannot acquire powders without an FAC or SGC (or RFD) and there is a limit to what you can hold on an FAC.

And here you go

Storing explosives - HSE

Storing explosives

www.hse.gov.uk

Also see section 22 page 5

https://nares.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Explosives-REV2.pdf

Well every bit of powder I have bought I’ve not once produced my ticket just for primers

 

[25 Sharps]

Well every bit of powder I have bought I’ve not once produced my ticket just for primers

Same.

But the law states you need one to acquire it and places limits on what you can store…

See the second link in the post above.

This is due to Explosive Regulations, nothing to do with the Firearms Act or the Violent Crime Reduction Act.