Planning Permission required for deer larders on agricultural land?

[western woodsman]

I write asking if anyone out there has had to get planning permission for erecting a deer larder on agriculturally designated land? I would have thought it would be permitted development? This is in England. I am not planning on a huge facility, just a small larder with entrance carcass preparation: small cold prep room for one carcass or so and larder for 4 to 5 large animals. The building will be made to suit vernacular looking country buildings in timber black stained and trad materials.

Please advise.

 

[CarlW]

How big is the holding? For forestry, it doesn't matter, but for agricultural the minimum size is 5 hectares.

 

[Apthorpe]

In practical terms, unless stubborn, patient and loaded, you're rather at the mercy of what the local planning department insists on. Worth being on good terms with the chairman of the parish council and sounding him/her out first.

It may help if it's presented as a binary choice between a crappy old refrigerated lorry trailer - not requiring planning, and your beautiful larder building....

I don't know if it would count as agricultural on its own.

 

[VSS]

Can it be done within the curtilage of an existing agricultural building? For example, as a lean-to, built on existing yard space or hardstanding? If so, I reckon you're good to go, provided it doesn't exceed the size or height of the building it butts up against.

 

[slider]

permitted development rights

 

[western woodsman]

All good to know. No it is a site of about 2 ha. I am looking to bid on in an auction. I will invariably need planning permission. I am not too concerned about doing this myself and going for it and more than likely getting it, but if I could avoid that altogether, then it would be nice. Yes, any existing buildings could make it easy, you are just redefining a different usage internally. Regarding a binary choice, that is purpose made or crappy trailer with facility, another variant looms- the container building version. Can a container larder that is dropped on site count as a temporary building? That's maybe a blur? Being an Architect, I am prone to this kind of thinking. Maybe I just need to damn well design it as I wish on wheels of some form?

 

[CarlW]

All good to know. No it is a site of about 2 ha. I am looking to bid on in an auction. I will invariably need planning permission. I am not too concerned about doing this myself and going for it and more than likely getting it, but if I could avoid that altogether, then it would be nice. Yes, any existing buildings could make it easy, you are just redefining a different usage internally. Regarding a binary choice, that is purpose made or crappy trailer with facility, another variant looms- the container building version. Can a container larder that is dropped on site count as a temporary building? That's maybe a blur? Being an Architect, I am prone to this kind of thinking. Maybe I just need to damn well design it as I wish on wheels of some form?

2ha too small to use Ag permitted-development exception.

 

[Olaf]

All good to know. No it is a site of about 2 ha. I am looking to bid on in an auction. I will invariably need planning permission. I am not too concerned about doing this myself and going for it and more than likely getting it, but if I could avoid that altogether, then it would be nice. Yes, any existing buildings could make it easy, you are just redefining a different usage internally. Regarding a binary choice, that is purpose made or crappy trailer with facility, another variant looms- the container building version. Can a container larder that is dropped on site count as a temporary building? That's maybe a blur? Being an Architect, I am prone to this kind of thinking. Maybe I just need to damn well design it as I wish on wheels of some form?

That’s what I’d do, if you’re planning on potentially building the larder in timber frame then it’s not very difficult ( arguably more desirable in fact) to build it as a portable unit. Either sat on a raised platform like a portacabin or on wheels .
Personally I’d avoid it being on wheels owing to many negatives associated with such a rig but why not make it a ‘temporary ‘ and ‘portable’ structure like a port out starboard home portacabin ?
kindest regards, Olaf

 

[Davee]

We had a similar problem with stables. Easy cure built on two 100mm galvanised square tube, slope the ends, include hefty eye bolts/ attachment points, include metal cross members and build wooden structure on top. Easily moved by a 4x4 just attach ropes and slide it around. When in position jack it up and place paving stones under skids to stop it sinking into the ground. Disadvantage, that it cannot be permanently connected to water and power, but that's what extension leads and hoses are for! Google 'portable field shelters' to get ideas.

 

[User00014]

Can it be done within the curtilage of an existing agricultural building? For example, as a lean-to, built on existing yard space or hardstanding? If so, I reckon you're good to go, provided it doesn't exceed the size or height of the building it butts up against.

That’s how I’ve got mine

 

[western woodsman]

Okay looks as tricky as first thought. I may just need to go for planning permission. One question would be if the larder were made in a transportable container, if that would qualify as a temporary structure? I somehow doubt it.

If I do go for planning permission, it would be a legitimate use of agricultural land, so the risk is likely small. But you can never really know!!!

 

[User00014]

Okay looks as tricky as first thought. I may just need to go for planning permission. One question would be if the larder were made in a transportable container, if that would qualify as a temporary structure? I somehow doubt it.

If I do go for planning permission, it would be a legitimate use of agricultural land, so the risk is likely small. But you can never really know!!!

From what I understand if it’s on wheels and can move it then it’s not a permanent structure then not planning needed.

Same rules as a static caravan.

 

[VSS]

From what I understand if it’s on wheels and can move it then it’s not a permanent structure then not planning needed.

Same rules as a static caravan.

It's not quite as simple as that, I don't think. Depends on what the usage is, and how long it remains static I believe. However, if the use can be broadly classified as agricultural then it should be OK, but minimum holding size may still apply.

 

[pendle]

Could it be mounted on skids and moved like a horse shelter . If so how far would you have to move it away from where it was standing .
Holes drilled in the sledge runners and push a scaffolding pole through . Put on a hard standing
A lot easier to move than on grass or mud

 

[8x57]

I don't know how it is with planning permission but I do know that for certain other associated legislation a building is only considered temporary if it is in location for up to six months after that it is regarded as a permanent structure. For example site offices on a building site.

 

[User00014]

Could it be mounted on skids and moved like a horse shelter . If so how far would you have to move it away from where it was standing .
Holes drilled in the sledge runners and push a scaffolding pole through . Put on a hard standing
A lot easier to move than on grass or mud

With mine although mines static, I built it on a steel pallet, so then I want or need to move it, I just trundle over with the forklift and move it.

but I do understand not everyone had a forklift at their disposal

 

[western woodsman]

"It's not quite as simple as that, I don't think. Depends on what the usage is, and how long it remains static I believe. However, if the use can be broadly classified as agricultural then it should be OK, but minimum holding size may still apply."

Yes, I think if the holding is 5 ha. or so it can be seen as permitted development. And I would call a deer larder an agricultural or forestry usage. But my site is smaller than that. Perhaps the moveable option is the way to go. Power and water can be still accommodated, but this needs a bit of thinking. Or just get planning permission!

 

[VSS]

Yes, I think if the holding is 5 ha. or so it can be seen as permitted development. And I would call a deer larder an agricultural or forestry usage. But my site is smaller than that. Perhaps the moveable option is the way to go. Power and water can be still accommodated, but this needs a bit of thinking. Or just get planning permission!

Did you get my PM?

 

[Andy RV]

Just apply for planning. There seems to be a culture of avoiding it for the sake of some form filling and ending up with a compromised solution.