Scottish Independence Take 2

[Malxwal]

It'll be more of the same, crying victim, diverting funds from desperately under resources public services towards more freedom campaigning. If we had a credible Labour party in Scotland (indeed in the UK), there might be enough of a voting shift to get rid of the vile scourge that is SNP.

 

[Sakoodin1]

Hoorah!!! Hopefully that shuts the krankie up for a while!!!

 

[Camdig]

Just a waste of resources North and South bigger priorities than division of UK, I will admit as young daft laddie I was sucked into the independence shite and am grateful now for the no voters.
This nonsense is the only thing she has to distract from her and her governments failures, Education, Health, illegal drugs and the poor public services have all declined rapidly under her government.

 

[Utectok]

Honestly although I have no love for the snp the idea that we have a willing union where we can’t have a say wether we are in our out unless Westminster let’s us is not acceptable. Surely the smart move would be let scotland have a referendum (on the grounds that one would be granted if there was a “material change” ie Brexit) then my guess is the snp would lose and that would be the end of that pretty much forever. This “no you can’t till we say so” actually drags the whole thing along and plays into the snp hands? I’m sure others will disagree but hey ho my thoughts

 

[gixer1]

Honestly although I have no love for the snp the idea that we have a willing union where we can’t have a say wether we are in our out unless Westminster let’s us is not acceptable. Surely the smart move would be let scotland have a referendum (on the grounds that one would be granted if there was a “material change” ie Brexit) then my guess is the snp would lose and that would be the end of that pretty much forever. This “no you can’t till we say so” actually drags the whole thing along and plays into the snp hands? I’m sure others will disagree but hey ho my thoughts

That’s akin to letting a child burn themselves on hot coals to teach them a lesson….it’s too late once it’s done! And in the case of the SNP, they are a petulant child who would sink the ship if given free reign.

 

[Apthorpe]

Hoorah!!! Hopefully that shuts the krankie up for a while!!!

Until 11:30 this morning, at latest. Nothing shuts that woman up. And hardly surprising given the unthinking enthusiasm with which most Scots greet her.
There seems to have been little public demand for the news media to do their job up there. If a single party is bagging the sort of dominance consistently seen in Scotland, then obviously something has gone very wrong with the exercise of democratic politics. This is presumably largely a result of the excessive prominence given to the independence campaign. From outside, there does not seem to be any proper critical examination of the central assertion that independence would make anything any better. It's possible that it would, but it's certainly very difficult to see any rational basis for that claim from the debate to date. What has gone wrong is that this central fallacy is left in place and permitted to override every other consideration, resulting in very poor governance. The gut, or perhaps the sphincter continues to rule the head in Scotland.

 

[Utectok]

That’s akin to letting a child burn themselves on hot coals to teach them a lesson….

Seems a response approach to child rearing?
Experience the world don’t just do what I say!
Anyway if there was a referendum it’s not up to the SNP it’s up to the voters?

 

[Klenchblaize]

That’s akin to letting a child burn themselves on hot coals to teach them a lesson….it’s too late once it’s done! And in the case of the SNP, they are a petulant child who would sink the ship if given free reign.

And for how many years would they subject the Scottish peoples to the challenges of trying to rejoin the EU, as an independent Nation, rather than focus on addressing the immediate ills that were outlined in the above interview?

K

 

[Utectok]

And for how many years would they subject the Scottish peoples to the challenges of trying to rejoin the EU, as an independent Nation, rather than focus on addressing the immediate ills that were outlined in the above interview?

K

Yes but they would probably loose is my guess

 

[Apthorpe]

Honestly although I have no love for the snp the idea that we have a willing union where we can’t have a say wether we are in our out unless Westminster let’s us is not acceptable. Surely the smart move would be let scotland have a referendum (on the grounds that one would be granted if there was a “material change” ie Brexit) then my guess is the snp would lose and that would be the end of that pretty much forever. This “no you can’t till we say so” actually drags the whole thing along and plays into the snp hands? I’m sure others will disagree but hey ho my thoughts

To what extent is Brexit actually a "material" change and one that could not be reasonably foreseen at the time of the 2014 referendum? Outside extremist hysteria and a small minority of people and businesses, it is of very little material consequence and certainly a matter of controversy over whether it has been of overall benefit or harm thus far. Was Brexit unforeseable in 2014? Well, given that UKIP had just wiped the floor with all the other parties in the European Parliament election that spring, it is impossible to claim that Brexit was not a prominent policy topic.
The 2014 referendum was held on the universal agreement that it resolved the issue permanently, or at the very least for a generation. What basis would a second referendum have for claiming to settle the matter?

 

[Foxyboy43]

Oohhh well. Back to the (with)drawing boord, hen but not a shipyard err, ferry yin, eh?

 

[GThomson]

I don't think any legal ruling will deter the SNP. They live in a world of dreams and leaps of faith. If anything a ruling against them will just steel their resolve and push Scotland further down the Socialist Utopia path.

Sadly I agree with you.

 

[User00035]

Do the SNP actually want a referendum? At the moment they have the luxury of power without responsibility. They can take the credit for every success (though off the top of my head I can't think of any) while blaming every problem and failure on Westminster and the Tories.

Indie would bring a lot of chickens home to roost with no one else to take the blame. Or cover the cost. Eternal protest suits the SNP better. Stoke resentment between Scotland and England, and ride the wave of nationalist fervour to stay chief of their fiefdom forever. If they actually had Indie 2 and won it, they sh*t themselves.

 

[Klenchblaize]

She will take comfort from the wording of the judgment as it makes clear the Scottish Parliament is not given of the powers (“legal authority”) to take such decisions that impact the “Union”. My point being they will seek to argue it is that very lack of power of self-determination, in any number of matters, that is why Scotland is in such a pickle.

We know truth/reality never got in the way of the preferred spin on anything where politics is concerned.
K

 

[Apthorpe]

Do the SNP actually want a referendum? At the moment they have the luxury of power without responsibility. They can take the credit for every success (though off the top of my head I can't think of any) while blaming every problem and failure on Westminster and the Tories.

Indie would bring a lot of chickens home to roost with no one else to take the blame. Or cover the cost. Eternal protest suits the SNP better. Stoke resentment between Scotland and England, and ride the wave of nationalist fervour to stay chief of their fiefdom forever. If they actually had Indie 2 and won it, they sh*t themselves.

I think that in the case of independence, the SNP will pretty quickly dismantle the restraining structures implicit in a democracy and morph into a totalitarian one party state.
Where will the scrutiny come from? Academia and media are already far too complicit. There is a large party mob already prepared to engage in anti-democratic direct action. Where else has a nationalist socialist party gained power on a wave of manufactured grievance?

 

[finnbear270]

Well that’s shut her up

You can hope!

 

[rem284]

I think it will be a case of "be careful what you wish for"

 

[Malxwal]

I'd love something to shut up that pig Blackford.

 

[Ratten]

And Scotland would never be allowed to join the EU..Spain would veto it and you need a unanimous vote. Scotland is a bit too much like Catalonia for their liking...

 

[Stevie/P]

I'd love something to shut up that pig Blackford.

I’d doubt anyone could shut old blackhead up still I doo rather enjoy his speeches in the House of Commons he is very passionate on bad mouthing the Tory government.