Selling Venison?

[karlbird]

I see it is EU Food Hygiene Regulations - so it may all be subject to change soon!

 

[karlbird]

Thinking things a little further, once registered as a good business can I declare the odd carcass on my self assessment tax return and then also claim back tax on ammo costs and fuel? Whilst it's only likely to be the odd carcass here and there now the freezer is full, a bit of fuel costs would be good.

 

[2130martin]

Thinking things a little further, once registered as a good business can I declare the odd carcass on my self assessment tax return and then also claim back tax on ammo costs and fuel? Whilst it's only likely to be the odd carcass here and there now the freezer is full, a bit of fuel costs would be good.

Why not,you could even become VAT registered and claim that back......

 

[Cris]

You might need see a few more than the odd one to get to a level for vat reg.

 

[baguio]

Thinking things a little further, once registered as a good business can I declare the odd carcass on my self assessment tax return and then also claim back tax on ammo costs and fuel? Whilst it's only likely to be the odd carcass here and there now the freezer is full, a bit of fuel costs would be good.

Karl, speak to Rob. He's all over it!

 

[karlbird]

Cheers Mark, will do when he is back from the States.

 

[2130martin]

You might need see a few more than the odd one to get to a level for vat reg.

You can register for VAT at any level,lot of smallholdings do it and never sell anything..

 

[Monkey Spanker]

I do have DSC 1.

Baguio - surely I can sell at least sell in the fur to a AGHE?

No, it's the other way around!
You can only sell to a AGHE if you have a large game handling cert (dsc 1 provides this) but you MUST be a registered food business.
However, you can sell to the final consumer, or retailer providing the final consumer (ie, your local pub!) but only if it is still in its fur.
This then opens a can of worms for your local pub unless he has a separate chilled area to deal with deer in its fur which is most unlikely!
Selling a skinned haunch as you suggest would require you to be registered with the council and have a chiller and approved area to skin and cut the carcass.
MS

 

[karlbird]

Thanks Mick, I've got it now thanks to the links provided earlier. I've just filled in the forms to register, see what the council say and take it from there. The AGHE bit seems the easiest - shoot, fridge, transport to game dealer. The next step (haunches to pub) seems a bit too much like hard work with HACCP etc. See what is said.

 

[Grand Slam]

So who has managed to get registered as a food business if you haven't got a larder and use the family bus for transport as most recreational stalkers do? Surely a LA will just laugh at it.

I have a friend who is registered as a food business. He has a small walk in chiller and does all his carcass prep on a standard glass table (cleaned before and after every carcass) council seemed happy enough due to all his practices being hygienic and not losing a problem.

 

[Tim.243]

No, it's the other way around!
You can only sell to a AGHE if you have a large game handling cert (dsc 1 provides this) but you MUST be a registered food business.
However, you can sell to the final consumer, or retailer providing the final consumer (ie, your local pub!) but only if it is still in its fur.
This then opens a can of worms for your local pub unless he has a separate chilled area to deal with deer in its fur which is most unlikely!
Selling a skinned haunch as you suggest would require you to be registered with the council and have a chiller and approved area to skin and cut the carcass.
MS

Is there anything preventing the pub buying the carcass in fur (which makes it theirs) then paying to have it skinned while they wait. (that cost would include the disposal of the fur as the shooter has all ready disposed of the gralloch)

Not saying it would work on a large scale but for a local pub who might take a Muntjac or Roe!

Tim.243

 

[Monkey Spanker]

Is there anything preventing the pub buying the carcass in fur (which makes it theirs) then paying to have it skinned while they wait. (that cost would include the disposal of the fur as the shooter has all ready disposed of the gralloch)

Not saying it would work on a large scale but for a local pub who might take a Muntjac or Roe!

Tim.243

That would imply that they are collecting it from you? Hardly in the spirit of the wording:
If you are a hunter, estate or shoot that supplies all of your in-fur/in-feather wild game carcases directly to the final consumer or to local retailers that directly supply the final consumer

You are effectively then selling skinned meat from your premises which would require you to be a food business. I don't think the point of ownership would save you. Even if you skinned it at their premises, they would still need a suitable area to deal with it in compliance with food standards.
Best to do it properly or not at all. It is bad practice such as this that reduces consumer confidence that keeps the price of wild game at a low level.
MS

 

[2130martin]

That would imply that they are collecting it from you? Hardly in the spirit of the wording:
If you are a hunter, estate or shoot that supplies all of your in-fur/in-feather wild game carcases directly to the final consumer or to local retailers that directly supply the final consumer

You are effectively then selling skinned meat from your premises which would require you to be a food business. I don't think the point of ownership would save you. Even if you skinned it at their premises, they would still need a suitable area to deal with it in compliance with food standards.
Best to do it properly or not at all. It is bad practice such as this that reduces consumer confidence that keeps the price of wild game at a low level.
MS

i would agree with your opinion but motorway service stations do sell cold food and provide a microwave to heat it yourself to prevent VAT being chargeable....not sure if that is the same legal definition as this??

 

[sauer]

There is cold food then there is raw meat bit of a difference

Paul

 

[Monkey Spanker]

i would agree with your opinion but motorway service stations do sell cold food and provide a microwave to heat it yourself to prevent VAT being chargeable....not sure if that is the same legal definition as this??

I'm not sure how there can be any legal correlation?
One is about complying with Wild Game Handling Regulations.
The other is about dodging VAT by selling pies cold instead of hot?

 

[karlbird]

So... I filled in the food business registration paperwork on their website last night and today have an email saying I am now registered. I just put in the reason as wanting to sell in-fur game to an AGHE as I thought that's the easiest solution for now - I can only assume they saw that and decided I did not need inspecting etc.

 

[2130martin]

I'm not sure how there can be any legal correlation?
One is about complying with Wild Game Handling Regulations.
The other is about dodging VAT by selling pies cold instead of hot?

Defining pont of sale/ownership?

 

[palmer_mike]

So... I filled in the food business registration paperwork on their website last night and today have an email saying I am now registered. I just put in the reason as wanting to sell in-fur game to an AGHE as I thought that's the easiest solution for now - I can only assume they saw that and decided I did not need inspecting etc.

Had the same response from my LA when I registered

 

[Grand Slam]

So... I filled in the food business registration paperwork on their website last night and today have an email saying I am now registered. I just put in the reason as wanting to sell in-fur game to an AGHE as I thought that's the easiest solution for now - I can only assume they saw that and decided I did not need inspecting etc.

Can they carry out random inspections of your facilities???

 

[karlbird]

The email I had today suggested they can.