Shortening barrel a good idea?

[Rutland lad]

Alles klar Mein Herr -

2.46 Section 5 of the 1968 Act prohibits any firearm which either has a barrel less than 30cm in length or is less than 60cm in length overall, other than an air weapon, a muzzle-loading gun or a firearm designed as signalling apparatus.

So barrels on a Mauser/Blaser/Sauer/Schultz&Larsen are NOT under 30cm in length AND the TOTAL length of the rifle is not less than 60cm.

That’s cleared that up.

 

[kenbro]

Only thing to be aware of other than less velocity (but increased muzzle blast) is that a barrel under twelve inches or an overall length of below twenty-four inches will be s5. Which unless your 6.5 is in a bullpup configuration (or has a folding or detachable butt) shouldn't be an issue. There were, now an again, bullpup stalking rifles believe it or not. Pfeiffer SR2. There even0 was one back in the 1980s using a BSA action? And a Mauser 98 Crapahute.

I had a Pfeiffer in 6PPC and it was very accurate.
Barrel was 26 inches and OA length was 26 3/4 inches.
Ken

 

[Rutland lad]

My 60cm 300 Winmag barrel is definitely more cumbersome than my 51cm 308 and 6.5x55 barrels.

But then I don’t use the WM for woodland stalking - so highseat access with a long barrel + mod isn’t an issue.

 

[25 Sharps]

Really ? That’s new to me. Surely Blaser barrels come in takes than that length and are held on a normal FAC ?
I need to be educated here !

No that’s the rules, barrel minimum of 12” and overall of 24”, which is why LBPs and LBRs have 12” barrels and an OA of 24” as they are then section 1.
Edit. Saw your second post after writing

 

[muddy42]

I've never understood this.

A; why people stalk in such thick foliage the rifle is so long as to be a hindrance.

Just lose the can and use ear protection.

B: why people must have a high powered cartridge then hamstring it down to medium powered cartridge performance by shortening the barrel.

Do stare at performance figures, you probably won't need all of it.

C: buy a heavy barreled model to shoot at short range.

Just buy a light weight rifle from the get go.

Answers below:
A: I like being able to hear. However good you are at putting on earmuffs there is always "that one time." Ive also never had a pair of electronic ear defenders last more than a few years.
B: it depends on your perspective and what you are trying to achieve. A deer legal "medium powered" moderated setup is ideal for me.
C: Agreed. a heavy steel mod is normally bomb proof and can restore the balance of a short barrel to a certain extent.

 

[Smellydog]

Answers below:
A: I like being able to hear. However good you are at putting on earmuffs there is always "that one time." Ive also never had a pair of electronic ear defenders last more than a few years.
B: it depends on your perspective and what you are trying to achieve. A deer legal "medium powered" moderated setup is ideal for me.
C: Agreed. a heavy steel mod is normally bomb proof and can restore the balance of a short barrel to a certain extent.

Pardon....

 

[Mike1979]

I've never understood this.

A; why people stalk in such thick foliage the rifle is so long as to be a hindrance.

Just lose the can and use ear protection.

B: why people must have a high powered cartridge then hamstring it down to medium powered cartridge performance by shortening the barrel.

Do stare at performance figures, you probably won't need all of it.

C: buy a heavy barreled model to shoot at short range.

Just buy a light weight rifle from the get go.

How about :

A - suck it up and dont deafen everyone in proximity...if you do may as well buy a .270 as theres more expectation that you will be "special" and have no mod
B- Buy right and buy once - then theres no need to chop bits off
C - Suck it up and carry the heavy lump

I own a Creed so what do I know

 

[JMikeyH]

I chopped my 6mm creedmoor from 24 to 16.5, best thing i ever did compact, pointable and made it much better to use.

I just make deer legal with 100gn pro-hunters and should do with 80gn lead free

Had my rifle cut down to 16.5 inch barrel as well, never had a deer complain!

 

[Smellydog]

Had my rifle cut down to 16.5 inch barrel as well, never had a deer complain!

Bet they did but were dead when you got to them!

 

[Scipio]

I had a custom rifle built in 7x57 and 18” barrel for thick bush. It’s awesome and despite what some people will tell you it makes no difference to accuracy and very little difference to velocity. It has one hell of a muzzle blast but if you use a moderator you won’t notice it. Personally I won’t go less than 18”.

i also have a 20" barreled 7x57, and i am experiencing the same. It's a stutzen, so not modded.

I am however still shooting factory ammo in it, which i assume is likely manufactured with longer barrels in mind, so i am hoping that reloading with powders adapt for the shorter barrel will help at least the muzzleblast.

Is that a correct assumption?

 

[tackb]

i also have a 20" barreled 7x57, and i am experiencing the same. It's a stutzen, so not modded.

I am however still shooting factory ammo in it, which i assume is likely manufactured with longer barrels in mind, so i am hoping that reloading with powders adapt for the shorter barrel will help at least the muzzleblast.

Is that a correct assumption?

handloading means you can tailor the load to a degree in your case perhaps slightly less of a faster powder

 

[Scipio]

As for cutting down barrels and which cartridges might be more naturally suited to it, is it not largely a matter of ratio between barrel length/Bullet diamater and Cartridge capacity?

Basically a case capacity ala the creed/308 and maybe the x57s can with a quick enough powder and a large enough bullet diameter for the gas to act upon, manage to get close'ish to it its best out of a shorter barrel like an 18 or maybe even 16-17 inch one.
The smaller the case capacity (308 family is smaller than the x57 for example) and the bigger the diamater (so 30 or 35 cal in the 308 family, or 8 or 9,3 mm in the 57 family) should, as i understand it, make the best pairing for the very short barrels of the caliber options available in those cartridge families.

But as already mentioned by other posters in this thread, how good does the cartridge to barrel length pairing need to be, to make it a sensible move for the hunter?
I mean as long as the legal energy levels are upheld, one can live with the increased noise and muzzleblast, and the rifle shoots precisely, handles and points better with the shorter barrel, then bob is still your uncle, isnt he?

 

[Scipio]

handloading means you can tailor the load to a degree in your case perhaps slightly less of a faster powder

hello mate. yes, this was also my thinking! - but in my case you meant going for a slightly less fast powder than someone loading for a 16-18 Inch barrel? right?
Which i agree with. .-)
I do assume that it will likely be faster than whatever powder they've put in my current factory loads though.

 

[tackb]

hello mate. yes, this was also my thinking! - but in my case you meant going for a slightly less fast powder than someone loading for a 16-18 Inch barrel? right?
Which i agree with. .-)
I do assume that it will likely be faster than whatever powder they've put in my current factory loads though.

to be honest i wouldn't see much difference in powders between 16-18'' to 20'' highly unlikely to be worth bothering with , just use a powder from the faster end of the selection and you'll be good to go

 

[Mungo]

I have been thinking about shortening my 6.5 creed from a 22inch down to a 17inch to make it easier to carry around woodlands etc. I know I will lose a bit of velocity but that doesn't concern me really. Is there anything else i should be aware of?

I only use the rifle in open fields and also in woodland. Sometimes take foxes over 300yds with it but if I'm shooting deer its always under 200yds.

You need to be realistic about what this will do to velocity.

Factory ammo in 6.5CM can be very slow - I get 2550 fps shooting 143gr from a 20” barrel. The usual velocity loss when you shorten is around 30fps per inch - so that would go down to 2460 in a 17” barrel.

I already see limitations at 2550fps - I won’t now shoot anything big past 150m, and won’t shoot roe past 250m. I’d be really reluctant to go slower, especially if there were things like fallow around.

I have home loaded it, and got it up to 2750. That changes things, a lot. So I can see getting 2660 using home loads through a 17” barrel. That would be fine for most woodland stalking.

Though I think if I really had to use such a short barrel, I’d go to a much lighter bullet.

Finally: I do use mine a lot in very dense woodland. It has a moderator. I don’t find 20” cumbersome at all.

 

[kenbro]

to be honest i wouldn't see much difference in powders between 16-18'' to 20'' highly unlikely to be worth bothering with , just use a powder from the faster end of the selection and you'll be good to go

I think, sometimes a slower powder produces faster speeds.
KB.
Ps. I know that’s not as simple as it sounds.

 

[kenbro]

Had my rifle cut down to 16.5 inch barrel as well, never had a deer complain!

Factory rifles can be bought with 16.5” barrels.
KB.

 

[tarponhead]

You need to be realistic about what this will do to velocity.

Factory ammo in 6.5CM can be very slow - I get 2550 fps shooting 143gr from a 20” barrel. The usual velocity loss when you shorten is around 30fps per inch - so that would go down to 2460 in a 17” barrel.

I already see limitations at 2550fps - I won’t now shoot anything big past 150m, and won’t shoot roe past 250m. I’d be really reluctant to go slower, especially if there were things like fallow around.

I have home loaded it, and got it up to 2750. That changes things, a lot. So I can see getting 2660 using home loads through a 17” barrel. That would be fine for most woodland stalking.

Though I think if I really had to use such a short barrel, I’d go to a much lighter bullet.

Finally: I do use mine a lot in very dense woodland. It has a moderator. I don’t find 20” cumbersome at all.

The choices you make to be self-limiting are what I do - I prefer to hunt and get as close as possible. However, that went out the window when I had a rare session in a Highseat recently, but even then I range particular trees and don’t shoot anything outside of those trees. In this case it was 120m - a nice muntjac buck. Given the choice I would love to have a short lever action or a single shot - like a Bergara B13 for dense woodland, but I assume the licensing system precludes lots of specialist rifles, unless you have your own land. I’m happy with a well-balanced 18” .308 plus mod. I specifically wanted a .30 for its knock down and .308 for versatility in shorter barrels. To SD’s point, ear protection without a mod is a must - I’m profoundly deaf, so know how precious hearing is. One shot over c.100db is all it takes…

 

[JockStalk]

The choices you make to be self-limiting are what I do - I prefer to hunt and get as close as possible. However, that went out the window when I had a rare session in a Highseat recently, but even then I range particular trees and don’t shoot anything outside of those trees. In this case it was 120m - a nice muntjac buck. Given the choice I would love to have a short lever action or a single shot - like a Bergara B13 for dense woodland, but I assume the licensing system precludes lots of specialist rifles, unless you have your own land. I’m happy with a well-balanced 18” .308 plus mod. I specifically wanted a .30 for its knock down and .308 for versatility in shorter barrels. To SD’s point, ear protection without a mod is a must - I’m profoundly deaf, so know how precious hearing is. One shot over c.100db is all it takes…

The licensing system permits a rifle if good reason is demonstrated - one to think about, don’t assume?

 

[tarponhead]

The licensing system permits a rifle if good reason is demonstrated - one to think about, don’t assume?

In theory, but the FEO’s don’t always see it that way - or maybe I’m being uncharitable as lots on here do have a fair few rifles. I’d love to be wrong, so you make a good point and I should think again.