Stalking and Age

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Hazlett think we all agree we need to bring on a lot more youngsters to shooting and to preserve shooting for many years.
At my club a young girl of seven shoots her own air rifle her dad is the safety coach.
She is such a joy to watch and see how safe she is.
SO NO offense was taken 👍
 
Hazlett said:
If this is in response to my comments, then I apologize if I caused widespread offence.

I was trying to make two points that got mixed up and possibly misinterpreted. But I was suggesting both were reasons why we should be looking out for younger people to encourage and mentor, rather than leave it to them to try and work out how to get into deer management.

The first was not a general point but refers specifically to my area, where fallow are out of control and where there are a number of 70+ stalkers who aren't doing a good enough job, either because they won't take enough does or because they create safe zones on wet/steep ground because of the difficulty of extraction (or both). So this is not a general criticism of 70+ stalkers. The point is that if stalkers in this particular situation were to mentor/foster a younger enthusiast, then they could carry on enjoying what they do (and possibly more so) and also do a better deer management job.

The other point is a little less palatable. We know that that the age demography of deer stalkers is skewed to older people and for all the reasons you and others have said, in terms of time, experience, knowledge, good practice, respect etc, this is all good. But in 10-20 years time, it's likely that there's going to be a fair number no longer going after deer. So, as experienced, knowledgeable established stalkers, there should be a general presumption of trying to get more of the next generation of enthusiastic deer managers mentored and in a good position to carry on the work. It worries me that without it, there will be a massive skills gap, that the environment and deer populations can't afford to suffer.

Many of you have described what you do towards this aim and that's brilliant - not that you need my acknowledgement or validation. But you do need to know that I am not criticizing you, I am trying to encourage more people to do the same.

Nevertheless, I am sure I'll have offended someone again - it's not been my intention!
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There’s nothing wrong with your observations, you’re actually pretty spot on.
Activity in all outdoor pursuits falls off dramatically once you cross the 70+ threshold, but a lot of us are reluctant to admit it and throw in the towel completely ( me for instance). I fully intend to carry on as long as I can or enjoy what I’m doing.
Call me a blocker if you want, I’m not moving just yet.

The main factor preventing youngsters from taking up stalking isn’t just access to ground, its lack of money.
We don’t do public hunting here, it’s strictly pay to play and the higher the demand the higher the price, we’ve priced all but a very lucky few people in their 20’s out of the game. That’s why we see lots of people in middle age taking up stalking, they’re financially established and they can afford it.

You also have the massive societal shift away from tolerance for killing anything, that’s a becoming a very big influence.
I lost a permission earlier this year because the landowners Mrs didn’t like me (or anyone else for that matter) shooting.
She complained to hubby and hubby did what she asked like the sensible man he is, anything for a quiet life.

The attitude towards issuing FAC’s by various constabulary’s doesn’t help matters, broadly the policy seems to be grant if you have to but refuse if at all possible. Before anyone comes back and tells me that this is not the case I would respectfully refer them to the legal section on this forum, there are damn few threads complaining that getting or keeping an FAC is too easy.

So it’s not just us septuagenarians hogging all the permissions.
If it was just us the problem would fix itself over the next few years, but I don’t think that’s going to happen.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Hazlett said:
If this is in response to my comments, then I apologize if I caused widespread offence.

I was trying to make two points that got mixed up and possibly misinterpreted. But I was suggesting both were reasons why we should be looking out for younger people to encourage and mentor, rather than leave it to them to try and work out how to get into deer management.

The first was not a general point but refers specifically to my area, where fallow are out of control and where there are a number of 70+ stalkers who aren't doing a good enough job, either because they won't take enough does or because they create safe zones on wet/steep ground because of the difficulty of extraction (or both). So this is not a general criticism of 70+ stalkers. The point is that if stalkers in this particular situation were to mentor/foster a younger enthusiast, then they could carry on enjoying what they do (and possibly more so) and also do a better deer management job.

The other point is a little less palatable. We know that that the age demography of deer stalkers is skewed to older people and for all the reasons you and others have said, in terms of time, experience, knowledge, good practice, respect etc, this is all good. But in 10-20 years time, it's likely that there's going to be a fair number no longer going after deer. So, as experienced, knowledgeable established stalkers, there should be a general presumption of trying to get more of the next generation of enthusiastic deer managers mentored and in a good position to carry on the work. It worries me that without it, there will be a massive skills gap, that the environment and deer populations can't afford to suffer.

Many of you have described what you do towards this aim and that's brilliant - not that you need my acknowledgement or validation. But you do need to know that I am not criticizing you, I am trying to encourage more people to do the same.

Nevertheless, I am sure I'll have offended someone again - it's not been my intention!
Click to expand...
I don't think you would have offended as many as you think.
There is plenty of opportunity's out there for people to learn but as for myself when I started I had to prove I was worth bothering with.
I here to may stories about shooting deer at long range,shooting does carrying fawns ,its easier at night.
A lot of the problems in stalking are the wrong people mentoring (a few I hope)that offer youngsters opportunity's to stalk deer and then take the out (late on in the day ).
As for my statements .
Long range I shoot targets to a thousand regularly and I wouldn't shoot a deer past 300 it cannot be hit constantly to be human
Does carrying fawns means you can't stalk well enough to get enough earlier in season.
90 percent of my deer are shot with in 100 yards and some as close as 10 yards .That's not sitting in highseats it on foot for me that's what stalking is all about.
 
MGD said:
Does carrying fawns means you can't stalk well enough to get enough earlier in season.
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Eh? Fallow does are carrying fawns throughout the period that you can legally shoot them, so unless you are shooting out of season, or only shoot youngsters, pretty much every doe you shoot will be pregnant. That's normal.
 
bottletopbill said:
BEEN doing school runs for over forty five years now and the kids keep me going grand daughter lives with us age 10 yrs with AUTISUM and a 6ft 14yr old with AUTISUM who we fostered from birth . Then local Authority wanted to place her in a home when she reached two years old. So we took them to crown court to adopt her plus our own four kids and over 46 foster children
Christ i should feel like a teenager if they keep you young. :rofl:
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Good grief you dont do things by half !
 
Forget age - just a number. If you want to go then do it - your body will tell you when to stop.
My good stalker pal took a client and his mate out on a Perthshire glen - part of the recently retired client’s bucket list. An hour in to the stalk the client dropped dead! There followed 45 minutes of CPR and talking the helicopter in through the low cloud - awful experience for my pal and the client’s friend but what better way to go? Not wishing in any way to sound crass but the poor man could have just as easily dropped dead on a shopping trip to Sainsbury’s rather than when out fulfilling his dreams. I only hope I am that fortunate.
I am now at the age where you feel you have to tell strangers your age within moments of meeting - soooo 72 last month, heart attack 25 years ago and two strokes 2 years ago but I am already getting very excited about my Perthshire trip next month and there are not enough nights in the week to shoot all those foxes - long may that excitement (and me) continue. But if not……
🦊🦊
 
I think money is the real issue within the young . Few of my younger clients purchase the higher priced knives but things like the Victorinox boner in kydex is very popular when i run that with them . Its not so much the cost of stalking and kit though its the deposit for a home , paying off student loans etc .
Yet they are keener on things me and my wife had to skip when we where in into our 20s , we bought our first house young 21-22 year old a little poor state of repair cottage being an understatement , today most at that age aint even looking for homes busy paying off loans like student debt and a course in platting fog quite often
Paying for stalking, kit and having the time is of course an issue while paying off student debt and making payments on New cars , credit carding holidays abroad etc seems to be the way .
Money to take up stalking is rare among the young is frankly rare , interest in is rarer still out of having parents involved
I honestly believe all the anti has to do is wait another 20 years or so while people of my age ( mid fifties) are thin on the ground and its all over for live quarry shooting of all kinds without massive change
 
Foxyboy43 said:
Forget age - just a number. If you want to go then do it - your body will tell you when to stop.
My good stalker pal took a client and his mate out on a Perthshire glen - part of the recently retired client’s bucket list. An hour in to the stalk the client dropped dead! There followed 45 minutes of CPR and talking the helicopter in through the low cloud - awful experience for my pal and the client’s friend but what better way to go? Not wishing in any way to sound crass but the poor man could have just as easily dropped dead on a shopping trip to Sainsbury’s rather than when out fulfilling his dreams. I only hope I am that fortunate.
I am now at the age where you feel you have to tell strangers your age within moments of meeting - soooo 72 last month, heart attack 25 years ago and two strokes 2 years ago but I am already getting very excited about my Perthshire trip next month and there are not enough nights in the week to shoot all those foxes - long may that excitement (and me) continue. But if not……
🦊🦊
Click to expand...
Brilliant FB43
My thoughts exactly, keep going until your told to stop well done matey enjoy 👍
 
sikamalc said:
My own boss, kids all grown up, left long time ago. Unlike some of the younger members on here, I am still stalking in my 60's. I can go when I like, where I like, and with whom I like. I have had some permissions in the highlands of over 40,000 acres, and some I have personally leased of 13,000 acres, with penalty clauses.

Iv'e learnt over the years to keep away from liars, bull sh.ters, back stabbers and generally dangerous individuals with firearms, of which there are far to many in this game. Those that know me well, will tell you I don't suffer fools gladly. There are a lot of older far more experienced stalkers on here, than some give it credit for. No doubt about that, many on here have guided and shot more deer than many on here will ever do, or dream of.
Click to expand...

Told as it is... a spades a spade, excellent 👍

Willowbank
 
Foxyboy43 said:
Not wishing in any way to sound crass but the poor man could have just as easily dropped dead on a shopping trip to Sainsbury’s rather than when out fulfilling his dreams. I only hope I am that fortunate.
Click to expand...
Amen to that.

Foxyboy43 said:
... heart attack 25 years ago and two strokes 2 years ago but I am already getting very excited about my Perthshire trip next month and there are not enough nights in the week to shoot all those foxes - long may that excitement (and me) continue. But if not...
Click to expand...
Unknown-1.jpeg




@Foxyboy43

Keep on keeping on old son...
 
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