Suspended Gralloch….

[RM100]

Not sure what you mean by a knife covered in green. If you tie off the food pipe when the deer is on the ground there shouldn't be any green. Drag it by the front end and don't raise the back end before you cut into the food pipe otherwise gravity will push all of the green back up towards the head.

It’s an old conversation, but I think this was comment about some video, earlier in this thread.

I agree with your comment, entirely.

 

[bogtrotter]

Started doing suspended grallochs in the field on a regular basis this year. I use a single pulley from Monarch attached to a convenient tree by a bit of rope. My process is to put the gamble through the hocks while it's still on the ground - this keeps it chest up and fairly stable while I saw. I then do the throat and clear the sternum with the knife and open the abdomen and then saw back.
Then comes the fun bit - given that an ungralloched (fallow) deer weighs the same as I do, I tie a timber hitch around one raised foot with the tail of the pulley rope and then by a combination of standing on the rope and pulling up the gambrel I can get most fallow off the ground...you need to be sure that the pulley is firmly secured and I have stopped anchoring it with S hooks after an unexpected ping.
I can now do the back end standing up with no guts pressing the bladder back at me. If I still need to open the the abdomen the guts are all down around the diaphragm. Once the back end is out, I have a clear view of both sides of the diaphragm, and a little knife work releases everything down to the larynx, and gravity takes it clear of the carcase.
I can then leave it there cooling while I get the carcass tray for extraction.
Nothing wrong with a gralloch on the ground but it's just a little easier suspended - if you have a tree or a truck. As all the kit goes on my belt, why not.

Why not?no pheking trees that's why not!

 

[bogtrotter]

I tend to do that too otherwise you can get green coming out the mouth. Not an issue with roe does where the head goes with the gralloch but on roe bucks, I tend to bring most heads home to remove the antlers.

I think some of the ways described are very good and informative however the game dealer here will not take animals with a split brisket or aitch bone. I can understand this if being lardered.

Exactly the opposite in this part of the country
Gamedealers want brisket and aitch bone split especially the aitch bone.

 

[Shootgun]

Not sure what you mean by a knife covered in green. If you tie off the food pipe when the deer is on the ground there shouldn't be any green. Drag it by the front end and don't raise the back end before you cut into the food pipe otherwise gravity will push all of the green back up towards the head.

Why cut into the food pipe?
When I’m done gralloching, the head is off and attached to the food pipe all the way to the rear end and everything in between.

 

[Pete6.5]

When shooting alot and wanting a perfect carcass I shoot it in the head then recover with the quad then back to the larder. Lift with a electric winch preform a suspended gralloch. Tunnel the back end and cut the rib cage.
If going the next step I skin from the front legs to the back legs. I find it gives a slightly tidier and quicker job.
In not saying a deer done on the ground isn't edible but it's never as good as one done suspended.

 

[jthyttin]

You all talk about tying and cutting esophagus. Are UK deer funny in a way, that you cannot just cut esophagus in front of "Adam's apple" (don't know the right word) that will keep shut and all the green inside the esophagus?

I do understand (double) tying the rectum and esophagus (at diaphragm) if you need to drag and keep the exterior cuts at minimum. But if you're opening the throat and getting esophagus out, only practice I've encountered is cutting above Adam's apple. Have to try keeping esophagus attached to head with roe, though.

 

[Overlay]

Why cut into the food pipe?
When I’m done gralloching, the head is off and attached to the food pipe all the way to the rear end and everything in between.

Yep my preferred method, straight in a clean box cool off straight in the larder, whole gralloch intact hang up and inspect, no mess no problem

I know gralloch procedures differ due to location from ground to suspended and its probably been beaten to near death on previous threads, but suspended and removed intact throughout is probably the best way if you can, my preferred method - tidy job

 

[Tim.243]

You all talk about tying and cutting esophagus. Are UK deer funny in a way, that you cannot just cut esophagus in front of "Adam's apple" (don't know the right word) that will keep shut and all the green inside the esophagus?

I do understand (double) tying the rectum and esophagus (at diaphragm) if you need to drag and keep the exterior cuts at minimum. But if you're opening the throat and getting esophagus out, only practice I've encountered is cutting above Adam's apple. Have to try keeping esophagus attached to head with roe, though.

I split the sternum (breast bone) and run the tripe knife all the way to the chin, be it a Red or Muntjac, tie off the poop tube then quite simply once the diaphragm is cut around the whole lot rolls down with a little teasing with a knife down to the chin then cut it off. A very similar method is used in the food industry millions of times a week, it is only the deer gang who insist in dragging a open carcass on the ground and proclaim to be hygienic
.

 

[Overlay]

got a bad back and out of puff just watching that filum, where’s me seat quick, they made it look easy gotta say

 

[kieran222]

Why cut into the food pipe?
When I’m done gralloching, the head is off and attached to the food pipe all the way to the rear end and everything in between.

I don't cut through the breast bone.

 

[VSS]

.

 

[VSS]

You all talk about tying and cutting esophagus. Are UK deer funny in a way, that you cannot just cut esophagus in front of "Adam's apple" (don't know the right word) that will keep shut and all the green inside the esophagus?

I do understand (double) tying the rectum and esophagus (at diaphragm) if you need to drag and keep the exterior cuts at minimum. But if you're opening the throat and getting esophagus out, only practice I've encountered is cutting above Adam's apple. Have to try keeping esophagus attached to head with roe, though.

The "Adam's Apple" is the larynx, part of the trachea (windpipe), not part of the oesophagus (food pipe), so I don't see what difference that could possibly make to the regurgitation of green?

 

[Klenchblaize]

There will be occasions when shot placement that was thought to be spot-on nonetheless results in digestive track leakage, so don’t be so harsh on the member who was honest enough to admit his knife has been known to hint at the colour all knife scales should be.

K

 

[jthyttin]

The "Adam's Apple" is the larynx, part of the trachea (windpipe), not part of the oesophagus (food pipe), so I don't see what difference that could possibly make to the regurgitation of green?

If I cut below it (body side) the contens of esophagus will spill. If above, they will not. Haven't done any more investigation, it's just the way it's done here.

Of course the windpipe is much more prevalent there, but you're keeping them both together and easing up the tissue with knife so they're free. Especially if you do gralloch on the ground w/o splitting the sternum.

 

[muddy42]

I gralloch on the ground, then suspend by the rear legs from a tree with a rope, then carry on stalking and come back later.

If I'll have to carry or drag the deer, I leave the contents of the chest in place and make some punctures to allow bleeding. If I'll be able to get the quad in close, I do a full gralloch.

If there is no tree within 100m, I leave the deer on a slope.

Hanging in this way results in a cleaner and lighter carcass and keeps your clothes cleaner when you have to handle it later.

I've done this for years.

 

[Tim.243]

If I cut below it (body side) the contens of esophagus will spill. If above, they will not. Haven't done any more investigation, it's just the way it's done here.

Of course the windpipe is much more prevalent there, but you're keeping them both together and easing up the tissue with knife so they're free. Especially if you do gralloch on the ground w/o splitting the sternum.

You never commented on the video of the open carcass being dragged across a moor which is one method used.

 

[jthyttin]

You never commented on the video of the open carcass being dragged across a moor which is one method used.

OK, I will try my best... still haven't watched the video. Here in Finland, traditional method is to gralloch at the shot site. I think this is because most of the hunting has been either small game or moose. With small game it makes sense to do the deed before putting it in you backpack, and with moose it's a sensible choice even when you have dozen or more men joining the hunt. Also the concept of first class cooking and involved hygiene has been missing to great extent (meat is meat and it's put to pot and heated until ruined).

I don't have extensive experience from several countries, but I've understood that moose is the only game that's gralloched on-site in countries that have long traditions of effective drive hunting (and more game than Finland). Maybe big reds also. Reason for this is, the hunt is concentrated effort, you don't want to waste time (there's several dozen attendants) and there's manpower etc. to transfer the whole carcasses to larder. There also might be some division of duties, like pegs, beaters, transport and larder. The beasts that are gralloched will be either kept as intact as possible, (zip) tying esophagus and rectum. Or split the neck (not sternum) to get whole esophagus and windpipe out, and also tunneling the rectum. Feet usually cut, or sled used. Carcasses to be gralloched might be first transported closer to road, e.g. if sufficient "motor power" is available or extraction involves crossing or using a river.

In Southern Finland, where whitetail deer, roe and to some extent wild boar have sustainable stock, the approach is mixed. In areas where whitetail hunting has been established over several decades, usual approach is to (suspended) gralloch at larder. It's least work intensive and produces cleanest carcasses. Basically all meat is going to personal consumption, so the beast is first skinned and then gralloched. Some hunters, especially from farther north, prefer to gralloch at site. I don't find this very constructive, in addition to above reasons you probly have temperature below zero (Celsius), and it's just messy with very limited upsides.

I think most UK stalkers have optimized their process for food chain i.e. not skinning the beast. Btw I found interesting concept from Donington Deer Supplies where you mechanically skin from front of the carcass towards back. Experienced hunters do it like that anyway, but by hand and it's kind of awkward. Starting from back towards the front will tear meat and fat along with the skin. Boar are a different story, you have to fight for each inch of the skin with your knife...

 

[Tim.243]

OK, I will try my best... still haven't watched the video. Here in Finland, traditional method is to gralloch at the shot site. I think this is because most of the hunting has been either small game or moose. With small game it makes sense to do the deed before putting it in you backpack, and with moose it's a sensible choice even when you have dozen or more men joining the hunt. Also the concept of first class cooking and involved hygiene has been missing to great extent (meat is meat and it's put to pot and heated until ruined).

I don't have extensive experience from several countries, but I've understood that moose is the only game that's gralloched on-site in countries that have long traditions of effective drive hunting (and more game than Finland). Maybe big reds also. Reason for this is, the hunt is concentrated effort, you don't want to waste time (there's several dozen attendants) and there's manpower etc. to transfer the whole carcasses to larder. There also might be some division of duties, like pegs, beaters, transport and larder. The beasts that are gralloched will be either kept as intact as possible, (zip) tying esophagus and rectum. Or split the neck (not sternum) to get whole esophagus and windpipe out, and also tunneling the rectum. Feet usually cut, or sled used. Carcasses to be gralloched might be first transported closer to road, e.g. if sufficient "motor power" is available or extraction involves crossing or using a river.

In Southern Finland, where whitetail deer, roe and to some extent wild boar have sustainable stock, the approach is mixed. In areas where whitetail hunting has been established over several decades, usual approach is to (suspended) gralloch at larder. It's least work intensive and produces cleanest carcasses. Basically all meat is going to personal consumption, so the beast is first skinned and then gralloched. Some hunters, especially from farther north, prefer to gralloch at site. I don't find this very constructive, in addition to above reasons you probly have temperature below zero (Celsius), and it's just messy with very limited upsides.

I think most UK stalkers have optimized their process for food chain i.e. not skinning the beast. Btw I found interesting concept from Donington Deer Supplies where you mechanically skin from front of the carcass towards back. Experienced hunters do it like that anyway, but by hand and it's kind of awkward. Starting from back towards the front will tear meat and fat along with the skin. Boar are a different story, you have to fight for each inch of the skin with your knife...

I think you should have watched the video as it is only a short clip of the end of the video which ties in with your post re hygiene. As you have replied in detail with out addressing the point of the opposite of a suspended clean out. !!

 

[jthyttin]

I don't want to condemn others' practices, sometimes you have to do what you have to do. I now watched the clip and will only comment that having rollable polyethylene sled in their kit would've made the drag easier even without gralloch. And then if you don't have to cross open water and have average motorical skills, you could've done the gralloch and drag would've been easier still. In case of trophy animal, protects the trophy also.

In Northern Finland (Lapland) there's a tradition of butchering the moose on-site also, and carry the meat out. Sometimes it was several days' job so you had to protect the remaining meat from bears etc. I guess ATVs etc. have made this practice all but non-existent. We've done this (Southern Finland) with few moose even when transport (along with supplies) was available. Actually quite nice especially if you have snow on the ground but only few degrees minus.

I've understood that in some locations with warmer temperature (similar carry-out situation), even tenderloins are left in the carcass in order to save as much other meat as possible. So you basically skip gralloch and start butchering by splitting the skin at the back. Doesn't have much use in places like US where it's illegal to leave edible meat behind (in most places?) but some seem to do it anyway. Might limit the direct contamination in case gut is pierced?

 

[Overlay]

I don't want to condemn others' practices, sometimes you have to do what you have to do. I now watched the clip and will only comment that having rollable polyethylene sled in their kit would've made the drag easier even without gralloch. And then if you don't have to cross open water and have average motorical skills, you could've done the gralloch and drag would've been easier still. In case of trophy animal, protects the trophy also.

In Northern Finland (Lapland) there's a tradition of butchering the moose on-site also, and carry the meat out. Sometimes it was several days' job so you had to protect the remaining meat from bears etc. I guess ATVs etc. have made this practice all but non-existent. We've done this (Southern Finland) with few moose even when transport (along with supplies) was available. Actually quite nice especially if you have snow on the ground but only few degrees minus.

I've understood that in some locations with warmer temperature (similar carry-out situation), even tenderloins are left in the carcass in order to save as much other meat as possible. So you basically skip gralloch and start butchering by splitting the skin at the back. Doesn't have much use in places like US where it's illegal to leave edible meat behind (in most places?) but some seem to do it anyway. Might limit the direct contamination in case gut is pierced?

interesting read the way other countries manage carcasses, we appear pretty conservative here in the uk