Why has this happened, (bullet drop)

[Smellydog]

not massively keen on pushing things to the limit,

Who told you you are near the limit?

There is always knitting if it's all too too much.

I don't understand these reloading fears, must make for a miserable time of it.
Lots of them even have a tank of air in the house with a container or more of air sqoze into it

 

[hendrix's rifle]

You need to stick a load more powder in your cartridges! Those 243 velocities are real slow. As an example - your 243 with 90g tgk at 2655fps. My load in said 243 with same bullet and powder is 3200fps with a 20 inch barrel.

As has already been mentioned, are your scales calibrated? Also worth noting there aren't issues hitting pressure signs presuming its done safely. Pick a suitable bullet and powder combination that gives desired velocity, load it up and shoot one at a charge weight until you hit pressure then back off. You will more than likely find a node around that charge anyway.

For targets - I find a diamond shape gives a far better target for shooting groups. You've induced a potential inch error straight away in your groups whereas the tip of a diamond gives you a tiny aim point and your groups will probably look better for it.

 

[Tikkat1x]

more powder it is then

Who told you you are near the limit?

There is always knitting if it's all too too much.

I don't understand these reloading fears, must make for a miserable time of it.
Lots of them even have a tank of air in the house with a container or more of air sqoze into it

just going on vhit app, i know there all conservative

 

[Smellydog]

more powder it is then

just going on vhit app, i know there all conservative

On the vhit data I don't even look at the starting nonsense, a waste a very expensive powder and bullets and primers!

 

[Tikkat1x]

until recently id never even thought to chase MV, i just found a group that worked and tinkered with the seating depths, then went with that, having had a magneto in the past i just used it to tell me my speeds, ES & SD, i now have another magneto so id best get my speeds up, i guess i should work out if to use the 75gr or the 90gr, saying that i did also try the 87gr V max and that was ok too, im also thinking N160 woud be best over the 140, i only chose that as i wanted to stick with 1 powder,

 

[Tikkat1x]

I just want to go back to these, "get more powder in it" comments, and i know that some sites are conservative,
iv not really been over book recommendations before so it new to me, i know what pressure signs to look for,
so for instance i was loading 23,5 gr of n140 in my 223 using sierra 69gr bullets, it was half MOA MV was around 2600.
i tried some more charges and got that to 2800 at 25,5gr, that being book limit, i did also try 26gr with n o pressure signs that ran at 2850,
some way off the suggested speeds i should be at, picture shows 26,5gr
now im no expert on GRT but (if iv set everything right) that 26.5gr is dangerous at 95,8% load ratio and a burn rate of 100%
so what sort of burn rate and load ratio should i be looking for,
25.5gr is load ratio 92% and burn rate of 99.9%.
25gr is,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,90%,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97%

 

[MilesW]

I just want to go back to these, "get more powder in it" comments, and i know that some sites are conservative,
iv not really been over book recommendations before so it new to me, i know what pressure signs to look for,
so for instance i was loading 23,5 gr of n140 in my 223 using sierra 69gr bullets, it was half MOA MV was around 2600.
i tried some more charges and got that to 2800 at 25,5gr, that being book limit, i did also try 26gr with n o pressure signs that ran at 2850,
some way off the suggested speeds i should be at, picture shows 26,5gr
now im no expert on GRT but (if iv set everything right) that 26.5gr is dangerous at 95,8% load ratio and a burn rate of 100%
so what sort of burn rate and load ratio should i be looking for,
25.5gr is load ratio 92% and burn rate of 99.9%.
25gr is,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,90%,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97%

Are you absolutely sure your scales are calibrated? And your GRT numbers look off too. I suggest you get someone to look at your inputs, or even better, have an experienced and knowledgeable reloader come over and review your gear and process.

 

[Smellydog]

I just want to go back to these, "get more powder in it" comments, and i know that some sites are conservative,
iv not really been over book recommendations before so it new to me, i know what pressure signs to look for,
so for instance i was loading 23,5 gr of n140 in my 223 using sierra 69gr bullets, it was half MOA MV was around 2600.
i tried some more charges and got that to 2800 at 25,5gr, that being book limit, i did also try 26gr with n o pressure signs that ran at 2850,
some way off the suggested speeds i should be at, picture shows 26,5gr
now im no expert on GRT but (if iv set everything right) that 26.5gr is dangerous at 95,8% load ratio and a burn rate of 100%
so what sort of burn rate and load ratio should i be looking for,
25.5gr is load ratio 92% and burn rate of 99.9%.
25gr is,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,90%,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97%

I've never heard of all that mumbo jumbo nor desire to understand it.
Complete overthinking balderdash.

There is nothing dangerous about n140 in 223.

 

[Stalker-of-the-deer]

On the vhit data I don't even look at the starting nonsense, a waste a very expensive powder and bullets and primers!

Agreed.

When I first started I was rigid, then as I became more experienced and understood it more I found iut how important good case fill is - 90% plus.

For that reason I look at powders that give a good fill at max charge and when load developing I take 10% off the max charge and use that as my start.

10% doesn't sound much but when dealing with somthing thats light anyway it makes a huge variance and is well below safe max change.

Vhit is also very conservative with their load data so top 10% puts you in a safe bracket to get good velocity without wasting powder.

 

[Stalker-of-the-deer]

I just want to go back to these, "get more powder in it" comments, and i know that some sites are conservative,
iv not really been over book recommendations before so it new to me, i know what pressure signs to look for,
so for instance i was loading 23,5 gr of n140 in my 223 using sierra 69gr bullets, it was half MOA MV was around 2600.
i tried some more charges and got that to 2800 at 25,5gr, that being book limit, i did also try 26gr with n o pressure signs that ran at 2850,
some way off the suggested speeds i should be at, picture shows 26,5gr
now im no expert on GRT but (if iv set everything right) that 26.5gr is dangerous at 95,8% load ratio and a burn rate of 100%
so what sort of burn rate and load ratio should i be looking for,
25.5gr is load ratio 92% and burn rate of 99.9%.
25gr is,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,90%,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97%

If you want some help/advice more than happy to help if you send me a PM.

Probably the reason your getting a strange es/sd is because the powder charge isnt sufficient so your getting diffrent powder burns when the primer is igniting the chage as that makes a difference- hence the case fill being important

 

[Smellydog]

Agreed.

When I first started I was rigid, then as I became more experienced and understood it more I found iut how important good case fill is - 90% plus.

For that reason I look at powders that give a good fill at max charge and when load developing I take 10% off the max charge and use that as my start.

10% doesn't sound much but when dealing with somthing thats light anyway it makes a huge variance and is well below safe max change.

Vhit is also very conservative with their load data so top 10% puts you in a safe bracket to get good velocity without wasting powder.

I hardly drop back that much, maybe in my 3030 but not the standard cases based around 223/222 or 3006/308/243 cases in strong bolt actions.

 

[farrieral]

Agree with the last couple of posts here, especially regarding Vhits conservative load data.

My 308 load with N140 gives a lovely crunch when seating the bullet no pressure signs, I'd put more in if there was space! (Obviously I worked up to this etc etc...)

Attached is garmin results from the 308 compressed load, look at the SD & ES

What are you weighing out your charges on?

 

[Tikkat1x]

Are you absolutely sure your scales are calibrated? And your GRT numbers look off too. I suggest you get someone to look at your inputs, or even better, have an experienced and knowledgeable reloader come over and review your gear and process.

I calibrate my scales every time i use them, im probably not going to bother with GRT as im not sure everything is right, its easier to lookout for pressure signs

 

[Tikkat1x]

If you want some help/advice more than happy to help if you send me a PM.

Probably the reason your getting a strange es/sd is because the powder charge isnt sufficient so your getting diffrent powder burns when the primer is igniting the chage as that makes a difference- hence the case fill being important

my last testing halved my ED & SD when going up in powder, so thats the plan, keep going till i see pressure signs

 

[Tikkat1x]

I've never heard of all that mumbo jumbo nor desire to understand it.
Complete overthinking balderdash.

There is nothing dangerous about n140 in 223.

like your style SD

 

[Tikkat1x]

Agree with the last couple of posts here, especially regarding Vhits conservative load data.

My 308 load with N140 gives a lovely crunch when seating the bullet no pressure signs, I'd put more in if there was space! (Obviously I worked up to this etc etc...)

Attached is garmin results from the 308 compressed load, look at the SD & ES

What are you weighing out your charges on?

i use a chargemaster lite, and them figures are outrageous

 

[MilesW]

I calibrate my scales every time i use them, im probably not going to bother with GRT as im not sure everything is right, its easier to lookout for pressure signs

How are you calibrating them?

 

[Tikkat1x]

just by the book with the 2 50g weights, and check now and again on some other scales i have.

 

[Stalker-of-the-deer]

I hardly drop back that much, maybe in my 3030 but not the standard cases based around 223/222 or 3006/308/243 cases in strong bolt actions.

Tbf I also ladder test over a chrono
Just load a round of each asnd dhoot a string over a chrono.

Once I find a node I play around that area to find stability

 

[Tikkat1x]

todays test, as iv started some new brass, 3 of my old loads and one at 44gr which is .4gr over hornadys max, and .4 less than Viht, already made these a couple of days ago,
no pressure sighs so far so all good to go further, hopefully something above 44gr groups ok, i know iv got seating depths to play with, currently 20 thou off the lands,