Lead ammunition - BASC statement in response to RSPB and WWT open letter

[Dunwaters]

The very sad realisation i now have is shooting simply has no future in the UK, wouldn't matter if we shot birds with magic fairy dust, the job is completely f@@ked.

I bet various anti groups are already doing lab tests on all the alternative 'non toxic' shot, just waiting till lead is finally banned and rolling out the next lot of psuedo science.
As usual basc will be caught with it pants down as its far to busy patting itself on the back for wot a jolly good job its doing

Or the picture in some tabloid of some 3rd world kid mining said non toxic shot so a rich 'toff' can have his sport ( the fact that kids the exact same age are being exploited in the same way to mine stuff for electric battery cars will be completely lost on them thou!!)

Before social media was invented i actually thought shooting was winning the propaganda war for once and things were looking quite healthy, now with all these click bait petitons and government/civil service and even conservation agencies/bodies are all so urban minded they just haven't a clue about rual life in uk.

I'd say enjoy as much as u can now as i won't be around all that much longer.

Ps
The amount and type of shooting i do nowadays (as mostly working my mutts) i could very easily switch to steel/copper and notice very little difference apart from getting rid of my S/S and buying my 1st O/U, which is not a big deal they are just cheap S/S anyway. Yes i would miss my 22 but not that many rabbits about here nowadays anyway the amount of vermin ( mostly protected)
So really not a massive deal
But that does not mean it is right or we should of been sold down the river the way we have.

And the saddest part of it by giving up lead the way we have, we don't earn any browny points or a bit of leeway on something else, the normal sane people that would think that way either haven't got a clue in the 1st place or don't actually care, or both.
All it does is show the antis we're there to be shafted and our orgs couldn't fight out of a wet paper bag.
And there already working on the next issue they can weaponise to shaft us some more

Sad fact is that there’s a pretty large minority out there that will be very very happy to see a reduction in privately held firearms regardless of how it’s done and another overlaying layer of people who’ll dance in the street for any reduction of hunting and stalking.
We’re just not popular .

 

[JTO]

15 years ago i was paying £48 for a box of 130gn barnes TTSX the price now is £55 the price has hardly moved, plus with the factory offerings from Edinbrough rifles, non lead is completely affordable

How many rounds do you fire each year?

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

How many rounds do you fire each year?

Back then 300-400 Or thereabouts, nowadays 100-150 but that’s on deer , the only paper i shoot is for checking zero etc

My ammunition bill nowadays is around £300 to £400 a year, Easily covered by the carcasses

I’ve been paying £1.50 a round minimum for ammunition for 15 years or more, I personally have never worried about it!

 

[JTO]

Back then 300-400 Or thereabouts, nowadays 100-150 but that’s on deer , the only paper i shoot is for checking zero etc

My ammunition bill nowadays is around £300 to £400 a year, Easily covered by the carcasses

I’ve been paying £1.50 a round minimum for ammunition for 15 years or more, I personally have never worried about it!

In other words:- "**** you jack, I'm fireproof".
There will be many on here who fire 150 rounds a month at paper and foxes.

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

In other words:- "**** you jack, I'm fireproof".

Yep

I am in no way against lead, i shoot copper through personal choice and now the choice i made many many years ago is going to pay dividends!

Like i have been saying for a very very long time on this forum,

Find a solution, Adapt and crack on!

There is no point about in flapping now, you have just got to get on with it!

 

[JTO]

Yep

I've got no children, so why should I worry about climate change, World over-population, the spread of Islam in Europe......... In other words "**** your kids, I won't be here to worry about it." I'll carry on burning trees, using diesel vehicles, using stuff wrapped in plastic.......

 

[Robs]

NDS

"Apapt and crack on". I'll leave it to you to find me any replacement for .22 prone. Go on crack on. All those youngsters shooting NSRA disciplines, they must be all idiots as they aren't using NT. The idiots are those who see this as a straightforward replacement exercise.

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

NDS

"Apapt and crack on". I'll leave it to you to find me any replacement for .22 prone. Go on crack on. All those youngsters shooting NSRA disciplines, they must be all idiots as they aren't using NT. The idiots are those who see this as a straightforward replacement exercise.

This is a DEER STALKING FORUM not a bunny bashing and game shooting or target forum.

Not shot .22 for over 20 years and will never again.

Your disciplines are not my issue or problem!

I kill deer end of

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

I've got no children, so why should I worry about climate change, World over-population, the spread of Islam in Europe......... In other words "**** your kids, I won't be here to worry about it." I'll carry on burning trees, using diesel vehicles, using stuff wrapped in plastic.......

Thats lovely, I’ll pass the sentiment on to my daughter who is inelegant enough at the age of 10 to work out that your a prick

 

[palmer_mike]

Your disciplines are not my issue or problem!

Nice

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

Nice

I am getting sick to the back teeth of over peoples problems!

I have now come to the selfish opinion of BOLLOKS to all those who cant find a solution!

You lot can fanny about and flap as much as you like

Mean while I’ll crack on killing deer!

If anyone want help with non lead CF, I will be more than happy to help!

 

[Reloader708]

Only just now come to a selfish opinion!?

 

[Mike L]

Thats lovely, I’ll pass the sentiment on to my daughter who is inelegant enough at the age of 10 to work out that your a #####

No need for that whatsoever

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

No need for that whatsoever

Why his comment was personally aimed at me!

If your that concerned about it complain to admin and get me banned!

All because i am not phased by this lead ban!

I am finding all the flapping and paddy throwing rather hilarious to he honest

 

[palmer_mike]

I have now come to the selfish opinion of BOLLOKS to all those who cant find a solution!

Nice

 

[Dunwaters]

A couple of contributors could possibly benefit from reading the REACH proposals.
It is proposing to ban lead for virtually all outdoor shooting with very few exceptions for both target and quarry.
It doesn’t matter that you only shoot a few birds or beasts for personal consumption, no avoidable lead in food is the official position.
There’s no proposal to exempt vermin, which makes sense, rabbits and pigeons for the table non lead and for crop protection only, lead shot/bullets acceptable is unenforceable. Foxes and crows are quarry too so no lead there either.
The higher the volume of lead released by whatever you’re doing and the more widespread the use, the less likely you’ll get an exemption.
If you believe otherwise you’re deluding yourself.
You can also bet that there’s going to be severe penalties for non compliance, both use and possession of lead after the transition period will cost you, otherwise the ban will take decades to become effective.
There will be compliance checks too all along the chain, from producer, to dealer, to shooter and consumer. Ammunition sales are already regulated and recorded, regulating use is going to be the next step.

 

[Rewulf]

The higher the volume of lead released by whatever you’re doing and the more widespread the use, the less likely you’ll get an exemption.
If you believe otherwise you’re deluding yourself.
You can also bet that there’s going to be severe penalties for non compliance, both use and possession of lead after the transition period will cost you, otherwise the ban will take decades to become effective.
There will be compliance checks too all along the chain, from producer, to dealer, to shooter and consumer. Ammunition sales are already regulated and recorded, regulating use is going to be the next step.

Sounds like you cant wait ?
The way you make it sound like this is something good for shooting is quite incomprehensible .

The science is flawed, the strategy is plain bonkers and utterly unrealistic, are we really saying target shooting is having an adverse effect of animal or human health ?
By what measurable evidential stats are we going to find out if the 'ban' is working , when there is none now ?

 

[MW73]

I am finding all the flapping and paddy throwing rather hilarious to he honest

Probably because it doesn't affect you, when the shoes on the other foot, it's a different story, that goes for pretty much most things in life not just this matter.

 

[Dunwaters]

Sounds like you cant wait ?
The way you make it sound like this is something good for shooting is quite incomprehensible .

The science is flawed, the strategy is plain bonkers and utterly unrealistic, are we really saying target shooting is having an adverse effect of animal or human health ?
By what measurable evidential stats are we going to find out if the 'ban' is working , when there is none now ?

Read the proposals, REACH has spelled it out in clear terms. There’s no hidden agenda, they’re following a WHO recommendation and banning lead projectiles in sporting ammunition, both shot and bullets.
I never said anything about the effects on shooting, I laid out in simple terms what is now official UK government policy.
They’re going to ban lead, your opinions don’t count because they’ve already made up their mind and they’re doing it regardless of the effects on shooting because the science tells them that lead is bad for people and animals.
Your dismissal of the validity of the evidence won’t stop it, the experts with big brains and pointy heads and letters after their names have said that it’s correct and they’re the ones that Boris and his cabinet listens to.
Get your head around it, it’s going to happen soon and you will be affected.
You need to lose the mindset of continual pointless denial, get behind your national bodies efforts to salvage what they can or you’re going to do more harm to shooting sports than Chris Packham ever dreamed of.
You criticise me, yet its your selfish refusal to even consider how we can minimise our impact on the environment or concede that some change is necessary that’s going to see us treated as a bunch of science denying Neanderthals indulging in practices that the planet would be better off without and on the fast track to extinction.

 

[Liveonce]

I am getting sick to the back teeth of over peoples problems!

I have now come to the selfish opinion of BOLLOKS to all those who cant find a solution!

You lot can fanny about and flap as much as you like

Mean while I’ll crack on killing deer!

If anyone want help with non lead CF, I will be more than happy to help!

it is very short sighted to think this does not have the potential to impact on you, may be not in the short term but long term, we all need each other.
Think of the consequences of a significant collapse in the numbers of people shooting or what they are shooting.
Will the powders and primers you need to load your ammunition still be available or the ammunition, given the not insignificant cost of importing such dangerous goods, will the volume sold justify importing them if so what price will they be? Then how many gun shops will survive, just how local will be your nearest supplier be. Possibly the importers and gun shops will consider their is an easier way to make a living and diversify away from such products or just close down due to lack of business.

Look at the prices and supply issues now.