Over culled?
- Thread starter mudman
- Start date
Yes, it's quite amazing what's happened there.
Much to their displeasure they now have wolves in the reserve, wolves which they think were possibly deliberately allowed access through a cut wire perimeter fence. And yes they want them removing / culling, I believe there has been a sea change in attitudes about how the place should be managed.
To some extent ‘gardening’ but with less management intervention than the traditional conservation management needed on nature reserves (which is why most nature reserves aren’t in good condition because the management plans need far more labour, equipment and time than the conservations bodies can afford).
Re-wilding is just a catchy buzz word that can mean so many different things to different people. I work with a lot of those people hence me getting triggered to comment here.
The ones I’ve seen in the south have all been zero vermin control or management culling . Maybe the owners decision I guess
sikamalc
Administrator
The trouble with all these re wilding schemes is that they are not big enough areas for many species to survive in a natural way. No doubt the insect and plant life will I assume, establish itself, and to a certain extent the bird life. Knep having their storks now nesting and managing quite well.
However when it comes to large mammals its a different story.
I used to manage several estates in the Scottish highlands, way up past Inverness. One I had for 10 years until it was sold was about 13,000 acres, the other adjoined it and was about 9000 acres and had about 1000 acres of pure Old Caledonian forest growing on it. I had this lease for over 15 years. Its the farthest north that there is a piece left in the UK. I gave this up about 6 years back as they started to fence the whole area off.
Most of my areas now are in and around Brora and Rosehall.
Adjoining both of these areas I used to lease, is the famous estate that spoke of releasing Wolves and Bears into the Scottish Highlands a number of years ago. The owner had to drive through my lease to get to his house. It was supposed to be re wilded, if you can call it that. There has never been a wolf released or a Bear, or to my knowledge a Lynx. It is now, as I understand it completely fenced off. Some 23,000 acres if I remember. Attempts in the past to purchase further areas adjoining have failed. Its a small fortune to stay on there, and although I have on the odd occassion stalked the estate in the past , when the past deer stalker was living there, and also shot Ptarmigan on there, with him and friends, it is an outstandingly beautiful place that as far as I know has not achieved a great deal with the re wilding scheme. But then the whole place is now so secure no one really knows whats going on. Bit like a Scottish version of Area 51
Re wilding has its place, but you need a lot of ground to make it really successful in my opinion. Even Knep has had issues with the threat of a massive building project nearby of thousands of new houses. I believe some of this has now been shelved..............................there is simply not enough water to supply the expected demand.
However when it comes to large mammals its a different story.
I used to manage several estates in the Scottish highlands, way up past Inverness. One I had for 10 years until it was sold was about 13,000 acres, the other adjoined it and was about 9000 acres and had about 1000 acres of pure Old Caledonian forest growing on it. I had this lease for over 15 years. Its the farthest north that there is a piece left in the UK. I gave this up about 6 years back as they started to fence the whole area off.
Most of my areas now are in and around Brora and Rosehall.
Adjoining both of these areas I used to lease, is the famous estate that spoke of releasing Wolves and Bears into the Scottish Highlands a number of years ago. The owner had to drive through my lease to get to his house. It was supposed to be re wilded, if you can call it that. There has never been a wolf released or a Bear, or to my knowledge a Lynx. It is now, as I understand it completely fenced off. Some 23,000 acres if I remember. Attempts in the past to purchase further areas adjoining have failed. Its a small fortune to stay on there, and although I have on the odd occassion stalked the estate in the past , when the past deer stalker was living there, and also shot Ptarmigan on there, with him and friends, it is an outstandingly beautiful place that as far as I know has not achieved a great deal with the re wilding scheme. But then the whole place is now so secure no one really knows whats going on. Bit like a Scottish version of Area 51
Re wilding has its place, but you need a lot of ground to make it really successful in my opinion. Even Knep has had issues with the threat of a massive building project nearby of thousands of new houses. I believe some of this has now been shelved..............................there is simply not enough water to supply the expected demand.
how do the get away with public access. I thought that the Right to Roam laws in Scotland were widespead than other parts of the UK, or is it one rule for sporting estates and another for SNP’istsThe trouble with all these re wilding schemes is that they are not big enough areas for many species to survive in a natural way. No doubt the insect and plant life will I assume, establish itself, and to a certain extent the bird life. Knep having their storks now nesting and managing quite well.
However when it comes to large mammals its a different story.
I used to manage several estates in the Scottish highlands, way up past Inverness. One I had for 10 years until it was sold was about 13,000 acres, the other adjoined it and was about 9000 acres and had about 1000 acres of pure Old Caledonian forest growing on it. I had this lease for over 15 years. Its the farthest north that there is a piece left in the UK. I gave this up about 6 years back as they started to fence the whole area off.
Most of my areas now are in and around Brora and Rosehall.
Adjoining both of these areas I used to lease, is the famous estate that spoke of releasing Wolves and Bears into the Scottish Highlands a number of years ago. The owner had to drive through my lease to get to his house. It was supposed to be re wilded, if you can call it that. There has never been a wolf released or a Bear, or to my knowledge a Lynx. It is now, as I understand it completely fenced off. Some 23,000 acres if I remember. Attempts in the past to purchase further areas adjoining have failed. Its a small fortune to stay on there, and although I have on the odd occassion stalked the estate in the past , when the past deer stalker was living there, and also shot Ptarmigan on there, with him and friends, it is an outstandingly beautiful place that as far as I know has not achieved a great deal with the re wilding scheme. But then the whole place is now so secure no one really knows whats going on. Bit like a Scottish version of Area 51
Re wilding has its place, but you need a lot of ground to make it really successful in my opinion. Even Knep has had issues with the threat of a massive building project nearby of thousands of new houses. I believe some of this has now been shelved..............................there is simply not enough water to supply the expected demand.
Returning to the original post I think its pie in the sky saying they are going to get it down to 400. Suggest you read my post Thermal walk in the Fod. The place was heaving with boar and we were on the edge of the forest and scanned a tiny bit of the area we walked through. we saw at least double figures in an hour or so, 4000 would be closer estimate. Also the damage and and paths had to be seen to be believed.
D
D
Night òwl
Well-Known Member
Come back and do it in the autumn when the cover is off .
I live ,walk ,drive, work and stalk in the dean daily.
Your estimate is ludicrous, yes there are small sounders of boar in certain safe location, but 4000 , really
You have no idea of the true numbers in the dean with a quick scan with a thermal and unfortunately your comments really are pie in the sky
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I remember a documentary on TV a few years back, it wasn't about the Dane's place, might have been Alladale.The trouble with all these re wilding schemes is that they are not big enough areas for many species to survive in a natural way. No doubt the insect and plant life will I assume, establish itself, and to a certain extent the bird life. Knep having their storks now nesting and managing quite well.
However when it comes to large mammals its a different story.
I used to manage several estates in the Scottish highlands, way up past Inverness. One I had for 10 years until it was sold was about 13,000 acres, the other adjoined it and was about 9000 acres and had about 1000 acres of pure Old Caledonian forest growing on it. I had this lease for over 15 years. Its the farthest north that there is a piece left in the UK. I gave this up about 6 years back as they started to fence the whole area off.
Most of my areas now are in and around Brora and Rosehall.
Adjoining both of these areas I used to lease, is the famous estate that spoke of releasing Wolves and Bears into the Scottish Highlands a number of years ago. The owner had to drive through my lease to get to his house. It was supposed to be re wilded, if you can call it that. There has never been a wolf released or a Bear, or to my knowledge a Lynx. It is now, as I understand it completely fenced off. Some 23,000 acres if I remember. Attempts in the past to purchase further areas adjoining have failed. Its a small fortune to stay on there, and although I have on the odd occassion stalked the estate in the past , when the past deer stalker was living there, and also shot Ptarmigan on there, with him and friends, it is an outstandingly beautiful place that as far as I know has not achieved a great deal with the re wilding scheme. But then the whole place is now so secure no one really knows whats going on. Bit like a Scottish version of Area 51
Re wilding has its place, but you need a lot of ground to make it really successful in my opinion. Even Knep has had issues with the threat of a massive building project nearby of thousands of new houses. I believe some of this has now been shelved..............................there is simply not enough water to supply the expected demand.
My recollection is that the owner, (Paul Lister?), was on about rewilding, stuck up mile after mile of fencing, cleared out deer and wanted Wolves, Moose, Lynx, Bear and God knows what else.
He was told if he wanted to do this he would have to apply for a Zoo license as he had created an enclosure, OK he says, was then told that he couldn't have predators and possible prey species in the same enclosure so he would have to create individual enclosures within the main enclosure to keep them apart.
Think his plan fell apart at that point, but I think he is still pursuing his dream?
A relatively small number can chew up a lot of ground in a fairly short space of time.
A friend of the family put 8 boar sows and 2 boars into a 6.5 acre wood, stocking density was recommended to be maximum of 4-5 boar per acre. 3 months later some of the areas that they favoured looked like the Somme.
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I think that they have a couple of Scandinavian moose there now.
edit. Yes they have Have I got moose for you: birth is first in Scotland for 1,000 years
edit. Yes they have Have I got moose for you: birth is first in Scotland for 1,000 years
Night òwl
Well-Known Member
Yes .
A 3/4 strong sounder can wonder the road verges for miles at night rooting while looking for food
Reports soon fill social media the next day it must of been huge sounders of boar to cause so much damage, when in reality if people actually studied them and their capabilities they would see it was just a few animals
So he has got 2 adult moose and 1 calf, bit different from his grandiose scheme, and what has it cost?
I am guessing that the neighbouring estates now have fewer deer passing through moving from Summer, Autumn, Winter and Spring grounds, and there will be caper, grouse, raptor, curlew, woodcock, etc, corpses along the lines of fence.
The guy should concentrate on building cheap kitchens, the ways of the hill are clearly way beyon his ken.
Much like the other billionaire/millionaire landowners that know what's best for the Highlands.
Jon P
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