An SD register of open larders?

[kieran222]

I think that you would have to be selective about who could access it. Not everyone has the same views on hygiene and carcase quality. You could end up arranging for collection of carcasses that end up being condemned which is going to reflect on you. The likelihood is that it would be amateur stalkers without facilities just shooting the odd deer so might not have that much experience. I only have a small chiller but if I had a larger one I would have to know someone well before allowing them to use it.

 

[David Barker]

It my believe that a communal larder would work in areas of high deer densities like the central belt. It would need to be run by a part time butcher or similar and a % of the cost go to him. The deer then could be butcher for personnel use for restaurants and hotels and if there were any left they could go to a recognised game dealer. I believe it would only need to be open 3 days a week so would suit a retired person or some one looking for part time work.

 

[User00040]

I find it amazing people are able to offer the use of the chiller yet get let down so badly by those that use them

Yup, FLS would be doing well to take deposits off contractors before they are signed on.

Stop the contract and get a company in to deep clean each time a larder is left in a state, standards would soon be up to spec!

But that's before you start looking what ends up flushed down the drains!

 

[NoIDeer]

I've used a few shared larders and always left it cleaner than I found it. A lot of people don't work like that and wreck it for others. It needs a strong leader with a good team to keep things in good order.
Unfortunately this wouldn't work.

 

[Overlay]

Yup, FLS would be doing well to take deposits off contractors before they are signed on.

Stop the contract and get a company in to deep clean each time a larder is left in a state, standards would soon be up to spec!

But that's before you start looking what ends up flushed down the drains!

A very good idea. 100%. in reality getting a deposit from a 6 deer a year stalker where costs were directly reduced from the deposit they’ve placed would be a nightmare, some people’s ideas of good practice and hygiene are miles apart, There would be arguments how do I get my deposit back because i’m packing it in or haven’t shot any deer for 6 months - you’re being unfair, you weren’t here when I had a deer, and as you’ve set the standards too high for their experience
no no no no no NO
bullocks to that - you’ve paid out the dollar to keep your venison safe why let an unknown sink your ship and at the end of it your responsible for it all
your choice. not for me

 

[baguio]

It my believe that a communal larder would work in areas of high deer densities like the central belt. It would need to be run by a part time butcher or similar and a % of the cost go to him. The deer then could be butcher for personnel use for restaurants and hotels and if there were any left they could go to a recognised game dealer. I believe it would only need to be open 3 days a week so would suit a retired person or some one looking for part time work.

I disagree with pretty much everything you have written TBH. The idea of this larder is that it would be open every day surely. 3 days a week makes it totally pointless. Why does it need to be run by a butcher, retired or otherwise? Are you thinking that it would include a larder to be used by everyone who put a deer in it? Who's cleaning up after that? What happens to the waste? Terrible idea in every way

 

[David Barker]

baguio surly a butcher or similar qualified person could check the deer coming in to the unit. If it was good that's fine if not he could send it away with the hope he educates the Fella in what is required. I think if local deer managers new what days it was open then they could work round that most having an area to keep deer for at least a day. The person bringing the deer in can decide what he wants done with his deer e.g. butchered by the butcher or sold as the butcher sees fit. I believe most deer managers around Glasgow and across the central belt only shoot what the can eat. Reason are lack of game dealers or facility's to have there deer processed fit for Restaurants etc. In Scotland we cannot sell to shops restaurants or to the public we must go through a RGD. So this would be the way to do it and get maximum for our deer. While encouraging deer managers to shoot more than 3 or 4 a year.
The old saying build it and they will come. So who should pay would be the question. Scottish government as it is to there benefit and the cost would be off set by the deer they would not need to pay contractors to Kill. Reasons not to do it are many but mainly greed and political stupidity.

 

[Overlay]

baguio surly a butcher or similar qualified person could check the deer coming in to the unit. If it was good that's fine if not he could send it away with the hope he educates the Fella in what is required. I think if local deer managers new what days it was open then they could work round that most having an area to keep deer for at least a day. The person bringing the deer in can decide what he wants done with his deer e.g. butchered by the butcher or sold as the butcher sees fit. I believe most deer managers around Glasgow and across the central belt only shoot what the can eat. Reason are lack of game dealers or facility's to have there deer processed fit for Restaurants etc. In Scotland we cannot sell to shops restaurants or to the public we must go through a RGD. So this would be the way to do it and get maximum for our deer. While encouraging deer managers to shoot more than 3 or 4 a year.
The old saying build it and they will come. So who should pay would be the question. Scottish government as it is to there benefit and the cost would be off set by the deer they would not need to pay contractors to Kill. Reasons not to do it are many but mainly greed and political stupidity.

Morning David
general consensus was for a short term chiller storage facility, you would need a game dealer type to do anything else apart from storage, it would be a very nice thought, i wouldn’t have thought that would make it into a real venture to be honest. more so toooooo complicated

 

[baguio]

baguio surly a butcher or similar qualified person could check the deer coming in to the unit. If it was good that's fine if not he could send it away with the hope he educates the Fella in what is required. I think if local deer managers new what days it was open then they could work round that most having an area to keep deer for at least a day. The person bringing the deer in can decide what he wants done with his deer e.g. butchered by the butcher or sold as the butcher sees fit. I believe most deer managers around Glasgow and across the central belt only shoot what the can eat. Reason are lack of game dealers or facility's to have there deer processed fit for Restaurants etc. In Scotland we cannot sell to shops restaurants or to the public we must go through a RGD. So this would be the way to do it and get maximum for our deer. While encouraging deer managers to shoot more than 3 or 4 a year.
The old saying build it and they will come. So who should pay would be the question. Scottish government as it is to there benefit and the cost would be off set by the deer they would not need to pay contractors to Kill. Reasons not to do it are many but mainly greed and political stupidity.

Sounds like you're describing a game dealers and not an open larder as this would be a full time job. Any competent stalker can check the deer coming in. It doesn't need to be a butcher. Most of us can cut deer up too.
If a stalker has somewhere that they can keep their carcass for a day or two whilst they wait for the Open Larder to open, they must have their own larder/chiller already? If not, most of us have day jobs that don't work around days that an open larder opens. A shed isn't going to cut it for a couple of days even in Scotland!

 

[Pete6.5]

Most people are to tight to want to pay the money to run this sort of thing. And some people hand on heart think they have done a good job when they walk out the larder but it reality isn't anywhere near good enough.

 

[Dave31]

As someone who doesn't have access to a Larder in the central belt, it sounds like a great idea. However, I can understand why for the owner it's a terrible idea to let all and sundry in to wreck the place (possibly).

 

[The Singing Stalker]

Really interesting thread this. Lots of challenges to overcome in order to make this work.

 

[David Barker]

Baguio i have a chiller unit as do most of my friends this is not enough to satisfy FSS. So that is were a proper fit for purpose larder local would meet all requirements by government departments. There is a massive difference to knowing how to cut a deer in to bits than the job left by a professional butcher. Also to sell on to the retail trade would require a faculty's that meets there requirements .So having a small chill in Scotland is only suitable for your own purpose. This is why we have to many deer as we have no way of passing our deer on. If you read the findings of the deer working group this idea was put forward as a way of reducing deer number's. It was also put forward to Government and accepted as a need by the lowland deer panel.

 

[muddy42]

Great idea. I don't have a game dealer for 40 miles, but some will collect if you are big enough.

There must be a way to overcome the issue of a few 'bad eggs' leaving the larder dirty. There are training courses, we have technology, CCTV, can write a set of rules, 'two strikes and your out' etc.

For example many estates have large larders where ten or more people use the same facility. If they can make it work, others surely can.

There is masses of 'magic grant money' floating around Scotland, it would be good to put some of this to use.

 

[Pete6.5]

So If someone spends 15-20k (very easily done properly more) and the electric and water bill and time to clean and time spent with paperwork. With lets say 20 people using it (at a guess). What would people be happy paying for the use of a good facility?

 

[David Barker]

Pete6.5 the idea is the unit pays for its self and putting deer in it would earn you money. You would only pay if you want your own deer done properly with a butcher. A local butcher charges between £20 - £30 for processing one deer.

 

[Tim.243]

So If someone spends 15-20k (very easily done properly more) and the electric and water bill and time to clean and time spent with paperwork. With lets say 20 people using it (at a guess). What would people be happy paying for the use of a good facility?

None as I have my own...much easier that way as we see all day long peoples opinion vary a lot just over just one word let alone how they clean out a deer...

 

[Pete6.5]

Pete6.5 the idea is the unit pays for its self and putting deer in it would earn you money. You would only pay if you want your own deer done properly with a butcher. A local butcher charges between £20 - £30 for processing one deer.

Ok so how much would you be happy to give over as a price per kilo. Example if the game dealer is paying £1.50 would it be ok to loose 50p per kilo and only get £1 per kilo and the 50p per kilo go to the owner of the chiller

 

[muddy42]

Realistically vension sales won’t work – not large enough, too complicated and there is a timing issue – you need the capital upfront.

I would want all the members taking the financial risk. So if the capital cost if £15k, maybe you’d get a £5k grant, leaving £10k. 10 members, say £1k each to be paid upfront.

It would probably be best to go for a pre-fab, plug and play unit. This will help with the landowner if things go wrong.

I’d run the costs on a similar basis. Run an annual Budget, divide by the number of members, and request a float upfront. Recheck the sums at the end of the year and do an adjustment.

There would of course be other details - rules of conduct, procedures etc. Whoever is managing the books and bills should get a discount.

 

[David Barker]

Ok so how much would you be happy to give over as a price per kilo. Example if the game dealer is paying £1.50 would it be ok to loose 50p per kilo and only get £1 per kilo and the 50p per kilo go to the owner of the chiller

I feel your missing the point there is no owner it would be a cooperative. I see your from Wiltshire do this problem will not effect you at all. Sadly this is a Scotland only problem and one that will need sorting unless we can keep paying 100,s of millions over the next 10 years..