45/70 nitro factory loads in a modern Marlin Lever Action
- Thread starter Vince1968
- Start date
Trouble is that website has a big disclaimer basically saying this is not load data, use at your own risk, it doesn’t reference pressures as I doubt the authors know.
That data is for ruger number 1 rifles, it doesn’t list that powder for trapdoor or lever actions.
There are better powders out there for higher velocity loads, obviously without getting too fast for cast lead .
jamtil
New Member
If your looking for a lighter load I can recommend reload Swiss RS14 in 45-70.
It’s a relatively new powder (2022) but has been designed to kind of mimic the now impossible to obtain unique powder.
In short it’s a bulky powder designed to fill more of a case like 45-70 but be more of a mild gallery load that faster burning powders can achieve. They publish starting loads which are very mild to shoot and have good accuracy out of my Perdersoli sharps rifle. I would suggest you take a look at their reading data and start from there and work your way up.
As other have mentioned 45-70 is a big case and faster burning pistol powders can be used in 45-70 but there is no margin for error the pressures are high when your filling such a small amount of case. A double charge is hard to spot and catastrophic.
That’s why I picked a powder like RS14 which has been designed for this use.
It’s a relatively new powder (2022) but has been designed to kind of mimic the now impossible to obtain unique powder.
In short it’s a bulky powder designed to fill more of a case like 45-70 but be more of a mild gallery load that faster burning powders can achieve. They publish starting loads which are very mild to shoot and have good accuracy out of my Perdersoli sharps rifle. I would suggest you take a look at their reading data and start from there and work your way up.
As other have mentioned 45-70 is a big case and faster burning pistol powders can be used in 45-70 but there is no margin for error the pressures are high when your filling such a small amount of case. A double charge is hard to spot and catastrophic.
That’s why I picked a powder like RS14 which has been designed for this use.
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45/70 is a bit of an oddball. Original rifles should only be used with black powder but since yours is a modern replica, it falls into one of three categories, weak design, moderate design and strong designs. There’s different standards for them all.
Strong designs is ONLY Mauser type bolt actions and Ruger no.1.
Medium includes some lever actions and modern replicas should be in this category
Weak designs such as Sharps and Trapdoor is really only good for black powder as the manufacturers manual will confirm.
If you look at reloading manuals such as Lyman and Lee you will find loads for each category.
The problem is that most of the powders required for lower (low-medium) pressure loads is not available in the UK and higher pressure loads such as those published by other manufacturers such as Vithavouri is unsafe for use in lever actions and similar as you will notice in the fine print of the load data.
Be very careful and enjoy shooting these rifles.
Strong designs is ONLY Mauser type bolt actions and Ruger no.1.
Medium includes some lever actions and modern replicas should be in this category
Weak designs such as Sharps and Trapdoor is really only good for black powder as the manufacturers manual will confirm.
If you look at reloading manuals such as Lyman and Lee you will find loads for each category.
The problem is that most of the powders required for lower (low-medium) pressure loads is not available in the UK and higher pressure loads such as those published by other manufacturers such as Vithavouri is unsafe for use in lever actions and similar as you will notice in the fine print of the load data.
Be very careful and enjoy shooting these rifles.
Smellydog
Well-Known Member
The Sharp is not a weak design.
Iirc Shiloh Sharp's will say you can use Ruger level loads. Maybe an original should be treated kindly.
Anyway I guess the rifleman's shoulder would give way first. Short of one of the heavy versions.
The trapdoors are BP equivalent only.
My understanding is it’s not the design that is wall it was the steel reliability / strength in the older / original rifles.
It is both partially, metals around that era was not of the same standard and consistency as it is now and there is a huge difference between the pressure curves in black powder and nitro, and therefore the stress levels. Even at the same peak levels, Nitro is at peak for much longer than black powder and exerts too much strain.
Shilo might not be close enough copies to be of concern, if you add enough meat around the action it will be strong, the walls on originals and close copies, is quite thin and definitely cannot handle modern pressures. Pedersoli as predominant example has a maximum peak pressure of 29000psi and Ruger (modern CIP) pressure is 40000psi.
Shilo might not be close enough copies to be of concern, if you add enough meat around the action it will be strong, the walls on originals and close copies, is quite thin and definitely cannot handle modern pressures. Pedersoli as predominant example has a maximum peak pressure of 29000psi and Ruger (modern CIP) pressure is 40000psi.
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