Spear Chucker
Well-Known Member
Advice please. I am using a new (less than a year out of the box) Weatherby Vanguard 24"barrel in 25-06 Rem. The barrel was thoroughly cleaned 8 shots prior to the zeroing session.
I am using PPU 100gr SP rounds - some will be laughing already- zeroing with the Pulsar Digex C50 at 100 yards, 14 X magnification and getting 1/2" groups with no problem.
I backed out to 200yds and things got a bit more interesting. Firing groups of three, I was within 1" (low) of the bull in target 1 in the picture for the first shot. Then two fliers for shots 2&3 as marked. Thought it was just me being a dope, so let the rifle cool down and started again on target 2. Shot 1 pretty much exact repeat of Target 1, 1" from the bull (low) - happy happy. Shots 2 and three were well off as marked in the picture.
I took one shot at target 3 on the 100yd profile I was happy with, using a 3" hold-over and got an acceptable result that told me I need 4" hold-over at 200yds. I threw the towel in before getting frustrated or chasing fliers around the target.
There are a number of potential reasons in addition to operator error and I wondered whether there were any more experienced shots with a view. The questions I had were:
1) Is it me or a combination of me and the kit? I assume that the problem -or a good part of it- lies behind the rifle - the kit is rarely to blame in these situations. When using my Tikka T3 and federal ammo in .308 I am consistently on the mark with no aberrations beyond the norm (fluffed shot etc).
2) Is the first shot "on" because the barrel is "cold" and the following shots are from a hot barrel? If so, what do you zero for?
2) Many people think PPU ammo is fine (me included when it was going through my Steyr Mannlicher), others say that it can give variable results -"cheap for a reason". At 100yds it seems good, giving consistent groups. Conditions were favourable with a light breeze from the South while firing North. If it is the ammunition, what do people feel is a good round to try?
3) Is it the sight? At 14 x mag across 200yds, the definition of the bull -even enlarged as it was- was a bit ropey and ill defined. It was easily enough for a fox in daylight, but for clear view of the bull of an 8" target it was less than perfect.
4) Have I missed something else?
The rifle is not to blame, it is definitely built to a price point rather than a quality point, but at 100yds, the results are exactly as it says on the tin. It has its quirks. The trap door mag was a delight and unless closed with pin point precision, would dump the entire contents on the floor as soon as I worked the bolt. I bought a proprietary detachable magazine and mag housing and this is just as irritating. It is plastic. It doesn't feel like a quality item at all. The release catch at the front of the mag housing has to be engaged exactly correctly and tested before I can have any confidence it isn't going to drop out or come loose when I work the bolt.
If anyone has any answers as to how one deals effectively with this I would be grateful for guidance. I hope the guidance isn't "chuck it in the ditch and buy a proper rifle and use better ammo!
I am using PPU 100gr SP rounds - some will be laughing already- zeroing with the Pulsar Digex C50 at 100 yards, 14 X magnification and getting 1/2" groups with no problem.
I backed out to 200yds and things got a bit more interesting. Firing groups of three, I was within 1" (low) of the bull in target 1 in the picture for the first shot. Then two fliers for shots 2&3 as marked. Thought it was just me being a dope, so let the rifle cool down and started again on target 2. Shot 1 pretty much exact repeat of Target 1, 1" from the bull (low) - happy happy. Shots 2 and three were well off as marked in the picture.
I took one shot at target 3 on the 100yd profile I was happy with, using a 3" hold-over and got an acceptable result that told me I need 4" hold-over at 200yds. I threw the towel in before getting frustrated or chasing fliers around the target.
There are a number of potential reasons in addition to operator error and I wondered whether there were any more experienced shots with a view. The questions I had were:
1) Is it me or a combination of me and the kit? I assume that the problem -or a good part of it- lies behind the rifle - the kit is rarely to blame in these situations. When using my Tikka T3 and federal ammo in .308 I am consistently on the mark with no aberrations beyond the norm (fluffed shot etc).
2) Is the first shot "on" because the barrel is "cold" and the following shots are from a hot barrel? If so, what do you zero for?
2) Many people think PPU ammo is fine (me included when it was going through my Steyr Mannlicher), others say that it can give variable results -"cheap for a reason". At 100yds it seems good, giving consistent groups. Conditions were favourable with a light breeze from the South while firing North. If it is the ammunition, what do people feel is a good round to try?
3) Is it the sight? At 14 x mag across 200yds, the definition of the bull -even enlarged as it was- was a bit ropey and ill defined. It was easily enough for a fox in daylight, but for clear view of the bull of an 8" target it was less than perfect.
4) Have I missed something else?
The rifle is not to blame, it is definitely built to a price point rather than a quality point, but at 100yds, the results are exactly as it says on the tin. It has its quirks. The trap door mag was a delight and unless closed with pin point precision, would dump the entire contents on the floor as soon as I worked the bolt. I bought a proprietary detachable magazine and mag housing and this is just as irritating. It is plastic. It doesn't feel like a quality item at all. The release catch at the front of the mag housing has to be engaged exactly correctly and tested before I can have any confidence it isn't going to drop out or come loose when I work the bolt.
If anyone has any answers as to how one deals effectively with this I would be grateful for guidance. I hope the guidance isn't "chuck it in the ditch and buy a proper rifle and use better ammo!
Yup, you got it. I especially favour the "snooker" shots - belting the round into a target off a nearby stone.
