Will I benefit from an adjustable stock??

[SD198]

Hi all- pretty generic question that I am expecting a lot of "if it ain't broke don't fix it" responses to, but I am trying to work out how to decide whether I would be likely to improve my accuracy changing my current thumb hole laminate stock (Boyds) for an adjustable stock such as the GRS Fenris. I use a .308 Howa 1500 with a heavy barrel for deer, shooting off quad sticks or from seats. I use a Zulus day/night scope. I gather the Fenris is about the same weight as my Boyd, so no change there - but obviously I would be able to change my length of pull and cheek on the Fenris. Currently I am achieving about a 2" group off sticks at 100m, but with the occasional shot straying out to say 4".

Is an adjustable stock likely to help improve accuracy? Any views greatly appreciated!

Many thanks

 

[TringSaint]

What is your grouping off a rest or bipod when shooting prone? If it’s still 2” then it’s either down to the rifle or how you hold it.
An adjustable stock may improve your head position, but if your shouldering of the rifle and cheek weld is poor, or if the rifle simply is shooting at its max accuracy then you are throwing money down the drain.

I would seek to identify what the max accuracy is for that rifle in a very controlled environment (so lots of bags/bench rest/bipod and time to really concentrate on each shot) and then look at how you can translate as much of that as you can into your shooting off sticks.
If you can get down to 1moa off a solid rest and can tune down to 1.5 moa for example off sticks then I wouldn’t bother with a different stock, unless you really want a new stock!!

But if you simply can’t improve off sticks even when adopting all the best practices from being in a rest, then it might be that the stock doesn’t fit you when in an upright position.

FWIW, 2 of my deer rifles have adjustable sticks as does one of my rimmies, but I can shoot the non-adjustable ones just fine too as I have the scopes positioned how I like them to be (others sometimes find my rifles hard to shoot with because of the scope position)

 

[cjm1066]

Does your current stock fit? If so no advantage, you can pack your current stock with tape and cardboard if you want to experiment?

 

[SD198]

Thanks for the replies. The grouping is noticeably better off a bipod on a bench - closer to 1" at 100m, so I guess there's nothing amiss with the rifle.

As for whether the rifle fits me, I'm not really 100% sure how to test that - but it feels pretty natural, I believe my trigger finger sits where it should on the trigger blade (although my hand is not far enough forward to be able to have my trigger finger bent at 90° to the trigger as I have seen in some photographs) and I am able to look straight down the scope whilst only having to cant my head to the side very slightly (although it is more my jaw in contact with the stock rather than my cheek).

Think I may have a play around with raising the stock higher to my cheek and see how that feels..

 

[Malxwal]

Mount the rifle snug to your shoulder and cheek snug on the comb, but with your eyes closed. When you open your eyes, note immediately if you see a perfect sight picture through the scope. If not you need to sort that out, with lower mounts, foam taped on your stock etc.

 

[TringSaint]

As above - have you tried a lower mount or different scope position so that your head is in a more natural position?

 

[SD198]

Well I just tried the shutting my eyes test and I get a pretty good scope picture - provided I weld to the stock with the top of my lower jaw rather than my cheekbone. That is what I have always done and I gather that that is deemed an acceptable alternative to the cheekbone?

 

[Malxwal]

Well I just tried the shutting my eyes test and I get a pretty good scope picture - provided I weld to the stock with the top of my lower jaw rather than my cheekbone. That is what I have always done and I gather that that is deemed an acceptable alternative to the cheekbone?

Not for me, but then I don't know what level of accuracy you aspire to, or what is necessary for your needs.

 

[Auroch]

I’ve been swapping the .308 barrel from my R93 between a standard sporter stock and my KKC laminate adjustable stock. In the sporter I’ve been getting 1 - 1.5 MoA but in the kkc it’s between 0.5 - 1.0 MoA. I put it down to the improved ergonomics, particularly the steeper pistol grip and slightly longer length of pull. When using the 243 barrel there is a far less noticeable accuracy impact, which I suppose could point to inconsistencies in my recoil management with the 308 being at the heart of the issue.

 

[HonestJohn]

2” off sticks at 100 is not bad, stock fit won’t really improve on this, practice will.

 

[Stalker62]

Currently I am achieving about a 2" group off sticks at 100m...

 

[nocturnaldave]

Nothing wrong with that off sticks. I find that my fit with the rifle changes with position and the weather. If I’m shooting standing supported off a fence post, sticks, gate etc then I like a shorter stock and lower cheek piece position. If I move to prone then a longer stock and higher cheek piece suits better. If I’m wrapped up in layers like an onion on a cold day I have two inches of warm layers adjusting my length of pull for me. I like an adjustable stock for that reason…. It gives me options. Having said that if I’m just out and about and don’t know what shot will present itself then I usually set the rifle up for a standing position and make the best of it.if I know it’s going to be a session of prone then I will adjust for that.

 

[nocturnaldave]

Forgot to say… my main two rifles both are in GRS stocks. I like them but they aren’t for everyone. Get behind one first and see if you like it.

 

[1894]

Until 2019 I was a rabid ‘classic’ straight comb stick user user for over 20years
Game dealer went head shot only and I bought an adjustable cheek piece vertical grip stock
It does make a huge difference to comfort and hence ease of accuracy
Before standing on sticks used to tire my wrist and sight picture had to gained with care to be repeatable.
The vertical grip removes the tension in my wrist and the cheek piece is like a 3rd hand it is that much steadier.
So yes they are worth it

 

[jasonmillar]

Until 2019 I was a rabid ‘classic’ straight comb stick user user for over 20years
Game dealer went head shot only and I bought an adjustable cheek piece vertical grip stock
It does make a huge difference to comfort and hence ease of accuracy
Before standing on sticks used to tire my wrist and sight picture had to gained with care to be repeatable.
The vertical grip removes the tension in my wrist and the cheek piece is like a 3rd hand it is that much steadier.
So yes they are worth it

I use one on a 22LR and it helps me

 

[tarponhead]

If you can, get someone with lots of experience to critique your technique on a range - you may find that new habits on consistent gun mount and trigger pull would make a bigger difference than new kit. Ian Farrington and Paul Hill at Corinium come immediately to mind. Well worth the investment.

 

[SD198]

Just in case it helps anyone in a similar position - I replaced my non adjustable boyds thumbhole stock for an adjustable GRS Fenris and my accuracy does seem to have improved - now roughly 1" groups at 100m off sticks. More generally, the rifle feels much more " natural " to hold and I am v pleased. I still seem to have a tendency to shoot slightly off to the right when shooting from a seat for some reason....

 

[Hook'N'Bullet]

I had a .223 Howa 1500 with heavy barrel and Boyds thumbhole stock and found my head sat wayyy too low to see through the stock. Had to hover a bit to see through it. Kept it for about a year thinking I'd change stock but flogged it in the end. If you get an adjustable stock, that fits you properly you wont know yourself. Benefits are 10 fold

Hi all- pretty generic question that I am expecting a lot of "if it ain't broke don't fix it" responses to, but I am trying to work out how to decide whether I would be likely to improve my accuracy changing my current thumb hole laminate stock (Boyds) for an adjustable stock such as the GRS Fenris. I use a .308 Howa 1500 with a heavy barrel for deer, shooting off quad sticks or from seats. I use a Zulus day/night scope. I gather the Fenris is about the same weight as my Boyd, so no change there - but obviously I would be able to change my length of pull and cheek on the Fenris. Currently I am achieving about a 2" group off sticks at 100m, but with the occasional shot straying out to say 4".

Is an adjustable stock likely to help improve accuracy? Any views greatly appreciated!

Many thanks

 

[WalkedUp]

How did you get on? The ergonomics of straight stocks are flawed by conflict of needing to be low to remove the bolt, whilst modern telescopic sights sit high due to their large objective bells. It is much more comfortable to shoot an adjustable stock.

 

[The Singing Stalker]

Before you go spending a load of money on a stock, there is plenty to do and research.
First off, better kit is to help you improve when you have mastered everything else, like position, trigger grip and technique etc.

The following are generalisms. So,
Spend more time shooting or practicing. Spend more time practicing with an air rifle. Most people do not shoot enough, (me also) yet expect to be getting bullet on bullet at 100 yards when shooting from the hip. That is usually the biggest thing to master.
Master the technique, your breathing, your trigger, first.

Shooting off a bench or the ground, using bags where you are well balanced and rested is going to give you a tighter group than shooting off quads stick or twin sticks, as an example.
Your head position is going to be different, from a lying position to a standing position, this can also affect accuracy.
Your head should set up to the position that you shoot from the majority of the time.
Type of bullet used can affect accuracy.
Once your technique is sorted you can then look at fit in detail.

look at some videos of shotgun fit. There are loads of them, they explain how to understand cheekweld etc. experiment with bits of foam taped to your rifle for fit. There are one or two rifle fit videos out there, mainly American, they can be difficult to find. There may be more now as it has been a few years since I looked. But, they are definitely worth watching.

Most stocks are designed for an average sized person, normally 14 and 1/4’ lop I think. If you are an average size person, then you may not need to change anything. I, on the other hand, am a bit weird, and standard rifles do not fit me, at all, hence why I went down this journey. If ever any one advises you to, put the stock of your rifle in the crook of you arm and the measures that for lop, walk away, there is so much more to it, are you a fat git, or a beanpole, wide shoulders, narrow? Everything affects fit. Also, the clothes you wear, in the winter we tend to wear more so thicker.

In conclusion, Sort out the basics first, then experiment with foam on rifle, then, once you know your measurements for where you need to be, then and only then you can consider getting a new stock.
I once went to an archery day, shooting recurve and longbows, and we asked the guy running it about the Olympic bows with weights and fancy things. His answer was, “when you can consistently put an arrow in a two pence piece grouping, then you can consider going for one of those.”