A funny old world when "a majority" is only "a majority" when it suits...

[enfieldspares]

MP Peter Bone has lost his seat after a recall petition, meaning a by-election will be held early next year.

The recall petition was signed by 13.2% of eligible voters in the constituency, above the 10% threshold required for Mr Bone to lose his seat. In a statement on X formerly Twitter, Mr Bone said the majority of the electorate in the constituency chose not to sign the recall petition, describing the process as "bizarre".

That'd be a different sort of "a majority" than the majority of the electorate that chose not to go to the ballot box to vote "Leave" in the EU Referendum then? For back then more people out of all those that could vote chose not to vote "Leave" than actually went to the polling stations and voted such.

Democracy. It's great. Just not now for Mr Bone as great in 2023 as it was back in 2016.

 

[timbrayford]

MP Peter Bone has lost his seat after a recall petition, meaning a by-election will be held early next year.

The recall petition was signed by 13.2% of eligible voters in the constituency, above the 10% threshold required for Mr Bone to lose his seat. In a statement on X formerly Twitter, Mr Bone said the majority of the electorate in the constituency chose not to sign the recall petition, describing the process as "bizarre".

That'd be a different sort of "a majority" than the majority of the electorate that chose not to go to the ballot box to vote "Leave" in the EU Referendum then? For back then more people out of all those that could vote chose not to vote "Leave" than actually went to the polling stations and voted such.

Democracy. It's great. Just not now for Mr Bone as great in 2023 as it was back in 2016.

Mr Bone is free to stand for reelection if he believes that the majority of his constituents wish to retain his services as their MP

 

[enfieldspares]

I make no comment...this is not the purpose of this thread...about the merits of Remain or of Leave. But merely to illustrate that those sat at the table taking part in the game play "the will of the majority" card at their peril.

 

[lochty]

Especially in Scotland....

 

[finnbear270]

Include Wales.

 

[Apthorpe]

MP Peter Bone has lost his seat after a recall petition, meaning a by-election will be held early next year.

The recall petition was signed by 13.2% of eligible voters in the constituency, above the 10% threshold required for Mr Bone to lose his seat. In a statement on X formerly Twitter, Mr Bone said the majority of the electorate in the constituency chose not to sign the recall petition, describing the process as "bizarre".

That'd be a different sort of "a majority" than the majority of the electorate that chose not to go to the ballot box to vote "Leave" in the EU Referendum then? For back then more people out of all those that could vote chose not to vote "Leave" than actually went to the polling stations and voted such.

Democracy. It's great. Just not now for Mr Bone as great in 2023 as it was back in 2016.

The difference being quite fundamental. In the referendum there were options to vote both ways and more chose to leave. In Bone's case, there was no option to keep him. It was a one-sided vote, only a single option existed and it is a petition, not an exercise in democracy.

 

[timbrayford]

The difference being quite fundamental. In the referendum there were options to vote both ways and more chose to leave. In Bone's case, there was no option to keep him. It was a one-sided vote, only a single option existed and it is a petition, not an exercise in democracy.

There is an option to keep him at the by-election

 

[kennyc]

The difference being quite fundamental. In the referendum there were options to vote both ways and more chose to leave. In Bone's case, there was no option to keep him. It was a one-sided vote, only a single option existed and it is a petition, not an exercise in democracy.

it is a way to make it possible to remove an MP who has lost the confidence of his/her constituents, the democracy part comes when the by-election is held, without this it is almost impossible to remove a sitting MP, would you prefer that an MP sits until the next General Election whilst doing diddly squat for the constituency? (Nadine Dories anyone? ) to try and paint it as anti democratic is incorrect.

 

[slider]

We Scots know all about the principles of democracy and majority, when "no" allegedly means "yes"..

 

[Apthorpe]

it is a way to make it possible to remove an MP who has lost the confidence of his/her constituents

Not quite right. It is not a way to remove an MP who has lost the confidence of the constituents. It can be used only under three conditions as follows:
MPs can be recalled under three circumstances:

• Conviction in the UK of any offence and sentenced or ordered to be imprisoned or detained, after all appeals have been exhausted. Note – a sentence over 12 months in jail automatically disqualifies someone from being an MP;
• Suspension from the House following report and recommended sanction from the Committee on Standards for a specified period (at least 10 sitting days, or at least 14 days if sitting days are not specified);
• Convicted of an offence under section 10 of the Parliamentary Standards Act 2009 (making false or misleading Parliamentary allowances claims). Note – the sentence does not have to be custodial for this condition.

If one of the conditions is met the Speaker of the House must notify the local returning officer. They are known as a petition officer when dealing with a recall petition.

, the democracy part comes when the by-election is held, without this it is almost impossible to remove a sitting MP, would you prefer that an MP sits until the next General Election whilst doing diddly squat for the constituency? (Nadine Dories anyone? ) to try and paint it as anti democratic is incorrect.

I didn't paint it as antidemocratic, simply as not democratic. A by election has been triggered by the local Labour Party. I'm not a constituents, but there is a valid argument that one elects an MP /party at a general election to sit for the full term. The voters made their bed and should lie in it.

Interestingly, there is no way to remove an MP only because he has lost the confidence of his constituents. Should there be?

 

[Apthorpe]

There is an option to keep him at the by-election

There may be or may not be, but not an option to keep him and the same party. The guy's obviously a tw@t and I wouldn't vote for him, but the process creates biases.

 

[Heym SR20]

In company law a 75% majority of voting shares is usually needed for major changes to constitutional matters.

Most other countries have a threshold of 66% or 60% for major changes to constitutional matters with at least a majority of the electorate voting.

Most other countries have either a system of proportional representation or a system where there are multiple rounds of voting until one candidate gains a majority.

Yet here in the UK we have a system where:

1) MPs, Concellors, MSPs etc are voted in on basis of most votes wins. Where you have multiple candidates (eg most of Scotland), most candidates get about 20ish percent of the vote, yet then make decisions on behalf of the electorate.

2) as for constitutional matters its on 50% plus 1 vote, and doesn’t matter what proportion actually gets out and votes.

So in both cases the majority are dragged over the cliff into oblivion by a very small proportion of electorate- and those elected say they represent the majority.

I suppose Britain did have the mark 1 version of the parliament. Latter parliaments saw its shortcomings and made theirs better and more representative.

 

[geoshot]

MP Peter Bone has lost his seat after a recall petition, meaning a by-election will be held early next year.

The recall petition was signed by 13.2% of eligible voters in the constituency, above the 10% threshold required for Mr Bone to lose his seat. In a statement on X formerly Twitter, Mr Bone said the majority of the electorate in the constituency chose not to sign the recall petition, describing the process as "bizarre".

That'd be a different sort of "a majority" than the majority of the electorate that chose not to go to the ballot box to vote "Leave" in the EU Referendum then? For back then more people out of all those that could vote chose not to vote "Leave" than actually went to the polling stations and voted such.

Democracy. It's great. Just not now for Mr Bone as great in 2023 as it was back in 2016.

In both cases only votes which are actually cast actually count, claims about the possible direction of votes not cast are speculation at best, probably nonsensical

Mr Bone's claim is clearly rubbish, but it has one tiny kernel of reason/sense
The vote which affected him only had one option and he may try, however pointlessly, to argue that he was deposed by a relatively small proportion of his electorate and therefore he might have had the support of the majority
It clearly doesn't matter and won't change anything as the vote met the requirements of the relevant laws, but he has identified (just like others before him) a small chink in the armour of electoral laws
I'm not claiming I support him or that I'd want him as my MP, but perhaps it would be fairer in these ballots for the question to be a Yes or No answer to a question such as "do you wish to unseat the sitting MP for this constituency" - but that isn't an option at present for some reason

As for the 2016 referendum, it offered two options of course
So, all of those who didn't vote equally ignored Leave & Remain
It would be equally nonsensical for either side to claim the support of those who, for whatever reason, didn't cast their vote on that occasion
Just as it would be risible for the losers in any Parliamentary constituency vote to claim that only the winner was opposed by all those who didn't vote - even though in many elections "the none of the above" might actually be the majority - the non-voters equally ignored all candidates

As said, in our system it's don't vote = don't count