About to try casting

[harrygrey382]

I warm the mould til the sprue takes a couple or 3 seconds to harden then drop the bullets (sorry, boolits) still really hot into a bucket of cold water.
You can heat treat them in your cookers oven to get the hardness really high but you could land up with gas cutting as a result (burning gases passing alongside the boolit) as the boolit is too hard to obturate into the rifling.

Have a look at http://castboolits.gunloads.com

ok cool, I'll try that. Muir was warning about warping, but I'll try it and see. I don't think these boolits are that long... I don't need them really really hard do I? If I could go above 2000fps that wouldn't be bad though. Also - would a mix of carnauba wax, alox and turps be a suitable lube for these speeds?

I've already got some good info off that site, it's impressive. But it's good to get some advice from people closer to home too. Especially when they have linotype available!

 

[Muir]

I warm the mould til the sprue takes a couple or 3 seconds to harden then drop the bullets (sorry, boolits) still really hot into a bucket of cold water.
You can heat treat them in your cookers oven to get the hardness really high but you could land up with gas cutting as a result (burning gases passing alongside the boolit) as the boolit is too hard to obturate into the rifling.

Have a look at http://castboolits.gunloads.com

\

This will only occur with ill fitting, undersized bullets. In 30 years of cast bullet experimentation at high speeds I have never encountered this with properly fit and loaded bullets. Again, I believe in a more controlled way of heat treating bullets than a bucket affords but to each their own.

That all said, there is not always the need to harden bullets provided you adjust the pressures to stay below the yield strength of the alloy you are using. For light target loads it has no benefit other than the following: First, heat treating as I do anneals the gascheck which aids in accuracy. Second, you can use one bullet for all your loads: heat treated or not and not worry as long as your pressures stay below the yield strength of your heat-treated alloy.~Muir

(PS: Hate the term "boolits".....)

PS: Buy a stick of 50/50 alox lube. By the time you make it it will cost more than commercial stuff and may or may not work as well.

 

[harrygrey382]

\

This will only occur with ill fitting, undersized bullets. In 30 years of cast bullet experimentation at high speeds I have never encountered this with properly fit and loaded bullets. Again, I believe in a more controlled way of heat treating bullets than a bucket affords but to each their own.

That all said, there is not always the need to harden bullets provided you adjust the pressures to stay below the yield strength of the alloy you are using. For light target loads it has no benefit other than the following: First, heat treating as I do anneals the gascheck which aids in accuracy. Second, you can use one bullet for all your loads: heat treated or not and not worry as long as your pressures stay below the yield strength of your heat-treated alloy.~Muir

(PS: Hate the term "boolits".....)

PS: Buy a stick of 50/50 alox lube. By the time you make it it will cost more than commercial stuff and may or may not work as well.

But I like making things... and have the Alox already! OK, where do I buy it - carnauba isn't dirt cheap anyway. I hate the boolit thing too. So you heat treat after sizing/GC seating - how do you do it? Or how would I with dodgyrog's linotype - lead 50-50 alloy?

 

[Bavarianbrit]

I KNOW THIS IS SHOUTING.
BUT NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT CASTING INDOORS BEING EXTREMELY DANGEROUS FOR YOUR HEALTH. IT HAS F]CKED UP QUITE A FEW GERMANS WHO DID IT IN THEIR CELLAR WORKSHOPS. BRAIN DAMAGE.
Regards
Martin

 

[8x57]

I,m sorry to hear that Martin, but it's their own fault really as both Lyman and Lee in particular take great effort in bringing the health risks to the attention of all reloaders. While I am new to casting I am well aware of the risks involved and always ensure that my workshop is well ventilated when casting. I am also careful of lead residue on my hands, something that all shooters should be aware of on indoor ranges where lead bullets are used.

 

[harrygrey382]

Re: Proofing etc

I KNOW THIS IS SHOUTING.
BUT NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT CASTING INDOORS BEING EXTREMELY DANGEROUS FOR YOUR HEALTH. IT HAS F]CKED UP QUITE A FEW GERMANS WHO DID IT IN THEIR CELLAR WORKSHOPS. BRAIN DAMAGE.
Regards
Martin

now hang on - no one is talking about the dangers because we all assume that being intelligent adults we know lead is dangerous. No one has suggested any dangerous practices, there's no reason at all to suggest anyone isn't taking safety seriously. In fact i think it's very insulting to even say we should think about it. Of course we are. You don't bring up firearm safety in every shooting thread, or food poisening in every cooking thread. So why here? And by the way i was planning on casting outside.

 

[JAYB]

now hang on - no one is talking about the dangers because we all assume that being intelligent adults we know lead is dangerous. No one has suggested any dangerous practices, there's no reason at all to suggest anyone isn't taking safety seriously. In fact i think it's very insulting to even say we should think about it. Of course we are. You don't bring up firearm safety in every shooting thread, or food poisening in every cooking thread. So why here? And by the way i was planning on casting outside.

That's the way to do it

With regard to heat treating the Muir way, I'll give you a clue. You need a couple of baking trays, a drill (electric preferably) various drill bits, nuts, bolts and washers, an oven, and some means of fast, and equal quenching, along with the appropriate instructions


John

 

[Muir]

I KNOW THIS IS SHOUTING.
BUT NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT CASTING INDOORS BEING EXTREMELY DANGEROUS FOR YOUR HEALTH. IT HAS F]CKED UP QUITE A FEW GERMANS WHO DID IT IN THEIR CELLAR WORKSHOPS. BRAIN DAMAGE.
Regards
Martin

BB: I understand your concern. Thanks.~Muir

Harry,

Just use a portion of the linotype for hardening. I used wheel-weight and linotype to a 9:1 mix. Hard enough for low pressure shooting and easily hardened.

I heat treat in an oven, in a fitted rack, and quench in room temperature water. We'll get to that after you're making good bullets. The Lube should be available from about any outfit like MidwayUK

Midwayuk - Bullet Lubes

RCBS is 6.99 pounds sterling and will would work as well as any for now. I like Javelina Lube (5.09 a stck) but just because I have used it for a few decades after having found a case of it at a giveaway price in 1983. Too bad they don't carry Tamarack Hi Temp. My favorite. It is what I use for prairiedogs on hot summer days.~Muir

 

[harrygrey382]

BB: I understand your concern. Thanks.~Muir

Harry,

Just use a portion of the linotype for hardening. I used wheel-weight and linotype to a 9:1 mix. Hard enough for low pressure shooting and easily hardened.

I heat treat in an oven, in a fitted rack, and quench in room temperature water. We'll get to that after you're making good bullets. The Lube should be available from about any outfit like MidwayUK

Midwayuk - Bullet Lubes

RCBS is 6.99 pounds sterling and will would work as well as any for now. I like Javelina Lube (5.09 a stck) but just because I have used it for a few decades after having found a case of it at a giveaway price in 1983. Too bad they don't carry Tamarack Hi Temp. My favorite. It is what I use for prairiedogs on hot summer days.~Muir

hmm, is that your kitchen ooven or a dedicated one?
Dodgyrog has mixed the linotype 50-50 with straight lead i think. Yeah better to learn to walk before trying to run...

 

[gitano]

Dropping bullets into buckets of water is ill advised. Long bullets can literally bend from uneven cooling.

Emphasis mine.

I 'water-quench' most of the bullets I cast, BUT, they're mostly "short and fat". I recently cast some 220-grain 8mm bullets, and per my 'usual' procedures, water quenched them. About 5% of them warped noticably, and another 5% measurably. I haven't any experience with .243 casting so I will defer to Muir on the likelihood of problems with that caliber. The 8mm bullets I referred to above that had "noticeable" warping, I just melted. Those with "measurable" warping got "straightened" in the resizing process.

I have never been able to achieve the level of precision with cast bullets that I achieve with jacketed bullets. I would assume total responsibility for that circumstance if it weren't for the fact that I have used other's cast bullets, and not obtained any better results. EXCEPT for over-the-counter cast bullets from Oregon Trail. It 'bothers' me that I can't do as well as Oregon Trail, but it's the truth whether it bothers me or not.

Regards,
Paul

 

[Muir]

hmm, is that your kitchen ooven or a dedicated one?
Dodgyrog has mixed the linotype 50-50 with straight lead i think. Yeah better to learn to walk before trying to run...

I use my kitchen oven. At 450 degrees they do no harm... get them melted and you may have another story. Another way of hardening bullets, but one that I don't use, is to freeze them for two weeks. You lose the advantage of annealed gas checks then. ~Muir

 

[harrygrey382]

I use my kitchen oven. At 450 degrees they do no harm... get them melted and you may have another story. Another way of hardening bullets, but one that I don't use, is to freeze them for two weeks. You lose the advantage of annealed gas checks then. ~Muir

ok good to hear. She might get a suprise but i don't think will mind...

is this the lube - Midwayuk - RCBS Rifle Bullet Lube Hollow and can you use it in a pan?

 

[Muir]

Sure. Melt it in a double boiler affair and pour it around the based of the bullets as they are standing up in a shallow, small diameter pan. You can punch the bullets out with a piece of 1/4" ID tubing beveled on the end. The cheaper Javelina lube is a good lube and probably no better than RCBS. (I use it...) Buy a few sticks as without a lubrisizer, your waste level will be somewhat high... and it sucks to pour the lube into the pan and find you had too little to get the job done! ~Muir

 

[gitano]

A picture's worth a thousand words.

Regards,
Paul

 

[harrygrey382]

great thanks guys