BASC says don’t pay medical fee
- Thread starter David63
- Start date
Gus. I'm really not wanting to call you out on this but I find it really difficult to believe that Police Scotland would do such a U turn or say anything like that at all. As far as I am aware they are not reccommending any specific fee althouigh they are (to my knowlege) advocating a fee, which is in tune with the latest BMA guidelines (and against the BASC advice).
I asked Mr Chief Cheese (F S-L), here's his response...
I asked Mr Chief Cheese (F S-L), here's his response...
Sturgeon-Lamb said:
Last edited:
nun_hunter
Well-Known Member
Plenty of suicides but generally SGC rather than FAC.
Because if I go off the rails and start shooting everyone in the next village north, Question 1 "Do you have concerns" leaves them wide open when victims lawyers come calling.
The GP is a GP not a psychotherapist or psychoanalyst and is not qualified to answer Q2 in its entirity.
Most GP's are on the 'locum trail' these days so don't really know their patient well enough (if at all).
If they answer any of the first 2 questions ... it leaves them wide open when victims lawyers come calling.
They have a childhood resentment of men in uniform ?
The though of having to speak to anyone who dares to think they have authority over them promotes derision and bed wetting ?
I agree with that sentiment 100%
Thanks for your understanding. I feel a charge of between 15 to 30 pounds depending on the work is not unreasonable. The money goes to the practice not me directly. <snip> If there is any incident with a FAC holder including suicide, we will be called tho give evidence in a coroners court and account for our decision and possibly face legal action and GMC censure
Well done £15 to £30 is (in my mind at least) acceptable, a voice of reason
Skywull, the man said "If" ....
If a GP were to be held to account for his/her/whatever recommendations, then aren't the Polis passing the buck -pun intended-. Thus if they are now making a GP effectively decide who can/cannot have a firearm, then the FLO's responsibilities are diminished, effectively a change of contracted work conditions that requires a commensurate reduction in pay. The savings thus generated can be used to pay the GP. However we may just trade one demi-god for another. If public safety is the issue, then why do I not have to produce a licence to buy the latest super-car/motorbike? Why am I allowed to buy petrol? afterall a Molotov Cocktail is infinitely more hazardous than a licensed Fire-arm, and I'll bet a fiver to a pinch of deer dung that more people are hurt handling petrol/arson than by LFA. Yes I am being flippant, but roll on the day that Fire-arm/explosive licensing is done from a centralised office properly staffed by professionally qualified unbiased persons, with a unified set of standards applied everywhere. Naturally if Scotland leaves the UK, they would have to set up their own system, and from the verbiage being uttered it'll end up like Zimbabwe, everybody being equal -except the demi-gods of course- with nought.
sikastag270
Well-Known Member
last week i forked out £200 to hopefully renew my license.
ms sufferer for 20 years.
all those in england dont no how lucky they are
rant over
ms sufferer for 20 years.
all those in england dont no how lucky they are
rant over
Because if I go off the rails and start shooting everyone in the next village north, Question 1 "Do you have concerns" leaves them wide open when victims lawyers come calling.
The GP is a GP not a psychotherapist or psychoanalyst and is not qualified to answer Q2 in its entirity.
Most GP's are on the 'locum trail' these days so don't really know their patient well enough (if at all).
If they answer any of the first 2 questions ... it leaves them wide open when victims lawyers come calling.
They have a childhood resentment of men in uniform ?
The though of having to speak to anyone who dares to think they have authority over them promotes derision and bed wetting ?
I have never met my current GP. Moved two years ago. Only time I set foot in the surgery was to drop off the registration forms.
I think I have been to the GP less than 10 times in my entire life. Last visit 4 years ago. Nothing mental health related ever in my history which I doubt is more than two sides of A4.
As far as my GP is concerned I could be completely looney toons and self medicating with every type of pill under the sun and he wouldn't have a clue. (I hasten to add that that isn't the case)
To be honest I would have thought him very carelessif not negligent if he just ticked to boxes and sent it back!
Regardless of how all this is panning out you would have to be virtually brain dead to think that GPs would put themselves in any kind of position where they could be held to blame if a FAC/SGC holder lost it and went on a shooting spree.
Ian.
Ian.
Ian, Its not really the point is it - I have been a reference for a number of people I know - with rather more knowledge of the individuals concerned, ther home life etc. Whilst I am always responsible in being a reference, no-one can be held responsible if someone flips - I believe its more likely a non fac/sgc holder will kill than an fac/sgc holder/ The most important point is that the screening system before this was excellent the police assessment of those who applied was poor and gave guns to those who were unsuitable and went on to kill. I doubt anyone minds the new system if its better but how can it be, it costs more and is already being abused by the police? Let them do their job properly first. BASC was blind, expecting a ten year licence from thus concession - they have been wrong before.
Kes, remember the bin driver who lied to his Dr to renew his HGV and went on to kill a lot of people in Scotland. The GP was named by the press and investigated. I have been to inquests where patients have killed themselves and faced a lot of adversarial scrutiny from the family's barrister. The reason why 90 % of doctors do not want to sign the form in S Wales is that they do not have the time or want to take the responsibilty. If someone went on the rampage after being cleared by their Dr despite having a clear medical record; the GP would still be hounded by the press and investigated by the GMC. Can you understand why they do not want to the form ? I pay 60 £ a day MDU(medical protection union, insurance vs being sued and for court representation) fees; part of which have been used for Barristers fees in the past to appear at inquests. In fact 80 % of the time I have needed the MDU is for coroners appearances. I can see why GPS want to charge.
Bandit Country
Well-Known Member
...or indeed anywhere else, is entirely understandable. As previously noted, they are GPs, not psychoanalysts or psychiatrists. They are clearly not (usually) competent to express any sort of opinion on an individual's suitability to possess a firearm, beyond confirmation of their patient's current medical status. Given this statement of the b******g obvious, why did the BMA ever agree to the arrangement?
Because they didn't think through the full implications of doing so.
Hear Hear ...
The idea that our medical records are marked to show we have guns in our possesion has merit (in my opinion), as stated that's a 15 second job to enter the read code, and i beleive it will provide a step towards the 10 year licence.
I see two main problems at the moment, the complexity and culpability of the current form and the additional charge hoisted upon the applicant.
Hear Hear ...
The idea that our medical records are marked to show we have guns in our possesion has merit (in my opinion), as stated that's a 15 second job to enter the read code, and i beleive it will provide a step towards the 10 year licence.
I see two main problems at the moment, the complexity and culpability of the current form and the additional charge hoisted upon the applicant.
The problem is Police Scotland making up there own criteria, the HO guidence is very simple and the standard letter only asks if GPs have any concerns over the applicants suitability to have a FAC/SGC and to put a marker on the applicants medical records.
As Miki said the marker would take seconds to do and if there are any concerns the GP need only say so, then police will ask the applicant to request a full medical report from his GP for which it has been agreed he will pay for.
Police Scotland have decided that if the applicant does not pay for their initial letter or the GP surgery fails to respond then no FAC will be issued, this is not the fault of the GPs or the applicant its Police Scotland who should be getting a verbal bashing on this thread.
Ian
One presumes BASC are doing this on all our behalves - if not one wonders why ?
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