BASC statement on Home Office proposals

[enfieldspares]

What? With Amber Rudd? Have fun. In the meantime Hell'll likely freezeover...see how they still deny Windrush? You think you can do better with her via your political action? Will BASC even publish IN FULL opinion its members have paid for? It took you a while to get there but you've finally become the British NRA. When is that 10 Year Certificate arriving? Pointless though isn't it if then no one can afford the medical fees you've given a free pass to.

 

[Frank Homes]

ES,

You just can't help yourself can you; why do you let your arguments down by your rabid anti-Conservative statements?

F

 

[enfieldspares]

Whats her party to do with it? Silly reply from you. There's no rabid about it. It matters not whether she is red, blue, polka dot green. Same as there's been two years to raise this with the Scottish Nationalists. Or are those that criticise the medical fees requirement regime in Scotland rabid anti-SNP?

In England and Wales she's the Government Minister. She stands at the Dispatch Box. She signs off the policy. And Hurd her Junior. No doubt she didn't know about this matter either. Which is odd given BASC's pledge to political action. Or couldn't they afford the cost of the stamp on the letter to her?

 

[rodp]

Didn't labour instigate Windrush, Tories just carried on with what labour thought was good idea (Until Corbyn the commie forgot who started it):?:

 

[enfieldspares]

I think Windrush, and this fees, is a Home Office that sees its own elected weak and compliant Ministers as an irrelevance to how it operates. The HO needs a few sackings to bring it back into line. To encourage the others. The Ministers are in charge...not the Mandarins. Abbott will be just as bad too easily persuaded by her civil servants...not prepared to do the work to understand the issues. Heaven help us as shooters. May, Rudd, Jacqui Smith, Blunkett and Straw and Howard before. None up to the task of facing down their Mandarins or ACPO in shooting issues. Second raters. It was David Cameron, not May, in 2014, remember who blocked the proposed fees increase.

 

[kes]

I am not interested in stuff irrelevant to the process of medical checks. It's the BASC context of your allegations (as identified by Patrickt) that I question. And you base all this on your assumption that Glenser was the QC instructed by BASC. Any assertion made or passed on by you is your responsibility, in law. The mere fact that you think 4 weeks is excessive is bizzarre (one normally has to brief a solicitor, who then instructs the barrister). A quick check shows that you are a obsessive BASC basher. If it turns out that Glenser was not the QC in question, then your own currency will be further devalued. That's all.

You have missed the essential point. Despite my currency being further devalued I would simply ask why was it would not have been helpful at any stage in the last four weeks to have mentioned that Alan Maclean was the QC from who the advice was sought and the detail of that advice once received.
Considering the last post you deleted I am surprised at your comments but then again, I am a confirmed BASC basher, without merit or justification.

 

[rodp]

What? With Amber Rudd? Have fun. In the meantime Hell'll likely freezeover...see how they still deny Windrush? You think you can do better with her via your political action? Will BASC even publish IN FULL opinion its members have paid for? It took you a while to get there but you've finally become the British NRA. When is that 10 Year Certificate arriving? Pointless though isn't it if then no one can afford the medical fees you've given a free pass to.

You must have missed the question above. Post 45.

 

[Frank Homes]

ES

It's a common theme with you so not silly at all.

F

 

[timbrayford]

Don't agree. And it assumes Lincolnshire would fight it. What if their PCC refuses to fund it?

As we will ALL...yes that is ALL of BASC's 100,000 members pay more because we haven't fought this now. So that £50, £60, £70, £80 x 100,000. Every five years. Makes a Judicial Review look cheap.

Legal opinion is just that, opinion. It is not a cast iron guarantee that the outcome of a case may be X or Y. Sometimes the outcome...as it may have been here...is that is health condition A, B, C applies to an applicant then X applies. But if ONLY health condition E through Z apply then Y applies. And if health condition D applies then whilst the Chief Constable may want it then HE must pay.

A Judicial Review gives certainty.

This retreat by BASC doesn't even give that...it just allows shooters to be further bullied...

So if BASC bankrupted itself fighting a legal campaign that was doomed to end in failure this would no doubt receive your full support on a worthy effort, but it would be of no practical use to the shooting community whatsoever

 

[kes]

So if BASC bankrupted itself fighting a legal campaign that was doomed to end in failure this would no doubt receive your full support on a worthy effort, but it would be of no practical use to the shooting community whatsoever

In fairness, you describe a situation which is highly improbable and, assuming shooters are keen to support their 'lifestyle' a call for additional funding in such a situation would be well received - I would put my hand in my pocket for such a worthy cause.
What should significant balances be or if not to support ALL members interests ? Somewhat more democratic than buying wetlands for a small section of the sport. Even the latter is entitled to its share would you not say.
Irritation and frustration lead to differences - we are all shooters who need each other, but most importantly for those we pay for, to do what is best for all elements of our sport. Look back and its hard to say we have been well served i would suggest.

 

[timbrayford]

Irritation and frustration lead to differences - we are all shooters who need each other, but most importantly for those we pay for, to do what is best for all elements of our sport. Look back and its hard to say we have been well served i would suggest.

I agree, I can't remember Jonathan Swift doing anything outstanding for shooting sports, but to return to matters of immediate concern. If BASC has sought an expert opinion they would be remiss in their duties not to heed it, despite the apparently superior knowledge of a whole host of keyboard warriors.

 

[rodp]

I agree, I can't remember Jonathan Swift doing anything outstanding for shooting sports, but to return to matters of immediate concern. If BASC has sought an expert opinion they would be remiss in their duties not to heed it, despite the apparently superior knowledge of a whole host of keyboard warriors.

But has anyone seen the questions asked, or the reply?

 

[kes]

I agree, I can't remember Jonathan Swift doing anything outstanding for shooting sports, but to return to matters of immediate concern. If BASC has sought an expert opinion they would be remiss in their duties not to heed it, despite the apparently superior knowledge of a whole host of keyboard warriors.

It would be good for members to know who was asked for an opinion and his claim to expert status in this field. It would be good to know also what his brief was precisely. Finally it would be good to know the context of his advice. Members have paid for it, Members should perhaps have access to it (website confined to the members area? The least important aspect is what he was paid, since a simple comparison could be made by the trusted servants of BASC.
I would however be interested to know the manner in which it was authorised, as procurement of services should only be done by a process which achieves demonstrable VFM. Was it exec action by Chmn alone or Council ?
The fact that it might have been the right thing does not change the need to do things properly - we are all keyboard warriors after a fashion.

 

[timbrayford]

Agreeing with both #53 & #54 the leadership of BASC would do well to keep the membership better informed about events of this nature & the decision making process. A link to the members only section of the website might be the way forward when disclosing the details?

 

[teyhan1]

Agreeing with both #53 & #54 the leadership of BASC would do well to keep the membership better informed about events of this nature & the decision making process. A link to the members only section of the website might be the way forward when disclosing the details?

Absolutely no point, someone would just screen shot it and release the info for all to see.
Haven't been a member for many years now. Went to CA and they were just about Fox hunting. Did BDS too but they went too commercial.
Now with SACS and am quite happy with them

 

[rodp]

Absolutely no point, someone would just screen shot it and release the info for all to see.
Haven't been a member for many years now. Went to CA and they were just about Fox hunting. Did BDS too but they went too commercial.
Now with SACS and am quite happy with them

What would that matter so long as all was above board? If the correct questions have been asked, in the correct context, and answers that are unquestionable were forthcoming then what's to hide?
However, I doubt they will be released and instead a reply of "witheld due to _ _ _ _ _ _ _" (insert to suit) will follow. The big question now is "does anyone really trust BASC"? I know my answer, for others it's up to them to decide.

 

[reloader54]

Is there anyone who really believes basc, or any other organisation can really stop this??? its a 'done deal' - there will be no consultation in the true meaning of the word. They are following the laid down legal procedure to 'invite' members of the public to 'have their say' either at poorly publicised public meetings or by letter/electronic mail etc. Nothing more than that. And nothing more than that will actually happen. That procedure does not include a legal obligation to listen or act on any proposals, suggestions or alternative points of view. It will happen. End of story.

 

[JTO]

If my GP charges, it will certainly cost them a lot more in wasted appointment time.

 

[exmarksman9870]

Can basc tell me why i should re join them or go the C A from now on or will they ignore me.... it seems basc are not giving a toss about it...

 

[David63]

Which organisation you join is absolutely up to you, all have different packages and benefits.
The CA of which I am long standing member have a very broad remit, BASC more focussed on shooting.
I do not think I have ever ignored you and I have always tried to help members of this forum when I can