BDS 'Advanced Stalkers Qualification'

Our passion is your passion... stalk with us!
6pointer said:
I am sure the industry will set there own standards .I cant se FC asking for a gold . They will always ask for specific qualification that meet there needs. The bronze silver or gold award could be a away of getting finding out the badge hunters and can count them out from doing a job.I remember my old boss asking if I could make a penis out of putty I said no I hadn't tried, He said that's good to many making putty pricks and not working we don't ne another
Click to expand...

I don't see it as an award that would give you entry criteria to industry jobs though. There are very few full time deer jobs out there compared to deer stalkers.

If the award was thought through and better presented I would like to see it as a way of demonstrating an accumulated level of both experience and formal learning. This would have a much wider benefit to the stalker if it became recognised as there are many putting themselves forward for permissions and leases and why shouldn't those that are actively bettering themselves and building on their experience get the best opportunities?

The question is how to you quantify and incorporate practical experience into the award?
 
I like the concept, but in its current form I don't see the value.

I think there should be a set syllabus for each award, so each bronze, silver or gold was the same. You could then use additional courses to maintain the level - whether that is keeping certs up to date or going to best practice events or doing other (deer related) activities.
 
Tackleberry270 said:
I don't see it as an award that would give you entry criteria to industry jobs though. There are very few full time deer jobs out there compared to deer stalkers.

If the award was thought through and better presented I would like to see it as a way of demonstrating an accumulated level of both experience and formal learning. This would have a much wider benefit to the stalker if it became recognised as there are many putting themselves forward for permissions and leases and why shouldn't those that are actively bettering themselves and building on their experience get the best opportunities?

The question is how to you quantify and incorporate practical experience into the award?
Click to expand...

Surely the benefit is to the BDS as Monkey Spanker has already pointed out that as an example he already has the qualifications to get a gold star so it will cost him £100 just for the BDS to look at his qualifications and award him a gold star?

The bit I do not get is that this new gold star doesn't have any weight behind it other than the fact it is issued by the BDS. What is to stop every deer related enterprise (or even BASC or the CA) knocking out their own version? Whose then holds the most credibility?
 
Makes me wonder where all this charitable money goes to and is used by under the heading deer welfare because with membership, donations, monies bequeathed, courses and now the likes of this they must make a good old stash.
Regards
Jimmy
 
jimmy milnes said:
Makes me wonder where all this charitable money goes to and is used by under the heading deer welfare because with membership, donations, monies bequeathed, courses and now the likes of this they must make a good old stash.
Regards
Jimmy
Click to expand...

Wrong. But they are in a healthier position than they were 14 or 15 years ago. The finances or the projects and research that they fund are not a secret. Non members and members probably have access to the details.
 
nun_hunter said:
Surely the benefit is to the BDS as Monkey Spanker has already pointed out that as an example he already has the qualifications to get a gold star so it will cost him £100 just for the BDS to look at his qualifications and award him a gold star?

The bit I do not get is that this new gold star doesn't have any weight behind it other than the fact it is issued by the BDS. What is to stop every deer related enterprise (or even BASC or the CA) knocking out their own version? Whose then holds the most credibility?
Click to expand...

It has issues. See post 25 on my take on what they are trying to achieve and google some of the guilds for info. Putting aside the anti BDS sentiment from some the BDS are arguably the authority and subject matter experts on Deer but I think they need to look at making some amendments to the scheme before it is of any use to anyone.
 
The question was put earlier on. Will anybody, and apparently there are 15,000 members (presumably more now as new are joining every day) on SD now, admit to having signed up for this certification programme? It is not a course. If nobody has, one would imagine that the marketeers at BDS might think that perhaps they have not got this plan, which may well be quite commendable if couched in different ways, quite correct.
I think BDS do good work and am very happy being a member and supporting them. The thing we all have to watch is that this further certification programme somehow gains credence and in a few years it will become yet another request from police that one must have DSC1 AND 2 AND minimum bronze award to satisfy FAC requirements.
So let us 15,000 state our considered case now. We really can not be ignored. Can we? But, I emphasise, our considered case. One for the administrators (read more work), I think.
 
It looks to me as a bit of a money maker with good intentions hidden in the background. The worrying thing is when this becomes a requirement because it appears to be a level above the existing qualifications, it would be a shame for this to become a requirement as it gives somebody more of a covered ar$e feeling when leasing ground to somebody.

As mentioned before the only way to obtain gold is to do the BDS deer management course and the BDS advanced stalkers qualification. that's pretty frustrating in itself as it forces you to do their courses albeit they may be the only providers of that particular training, but what really annoys me is that they award 20 points to the BDS first aid course but only 15 points to any other. Why do BDS think that their course is better or worth more points than another training provider? to me that's not right.

I also think the modular way it is constructed is leaving it open to abuse in some ways. it means a lack of uniformity and allows people to cherry pick what they do to achieve what is supposed to be a uniform standard. there is nothing to stop me picking the easiest path to 200 points after having completed DSC1, 2 and the 2 other obligatory BDS courses.

if we look at the DMQ website the figures for DSC 1 & 2 registrations are published and also the number that have completed the course. looking at the figures have made me wonder if the number of people doing these courses has plateaued and now in decline as the market reaches saturation point and the fact the training is provided by several organisations. could it be a case that the money coming in is dwindling so something new has to be created? I also think its not right that the DMQ awards are offered by many training providers but this will likely be confined to only BDS. if I do training with other organisations and pay BDS to look at that training provided by others then give me a gold award I feel that's poor of them and are taking money for nothing.
 
I wonder if, after 51 posts, and 2.5k views, anyone from the BDS marketing department who, I imagine, came up with this scheme, are taking cognisance of what is happening on this site. One would like to think so, but maybe not.
BDS, what do you say?
 
Last edited:
I hope for their sake the new training manager they were privvy to this new course prior to appointment. It would be a little irritating walking into a new job and having to deal with the understandable reaction.
 
What is really disappointing is that they as an organisation have put money spinning ideas ahead of what is good for the deer sector. There are core qualifications that aid a practitioner to hold professional standards and demonstrate competence. This is just a posers badge.

Yet again BDS have failed to address some of the most important aspects of deer sector professional responsibilities such as with risk assessment and human resource management. This is an award for lone wolves, not team players.
 
I always thought they would come up with the gold standard after paying my money and getting level 1 and 2, I noticed the "badges" for that were bronze and silver in colour. As I've said before I'm not a fan of exams and sustificates and think on the ground training is far more valuable. However in this ever growing sector I realise certain bodies e.g. Forestry companies, the FC, Natural England etc need to have a scale on which to measure a persons ability prior to allowing them out to shoot deer on their watch. With that in mind and my desire to find affordable stalking where I could take lead of my stalking and enjoyment of it, I did the exams and paid the money mainly to give me a better chance of being accepted as a suitable candidate for a lease or syndicate. That said what I have found is that the professionals (and by that I mean guys who have great knowledge and experience not necessarily who make a living out of stalking) soon see through the badge collectors who have only shot 3 deer but spend more days in the classroom than out stalking. They can collect all the badges they want and I hope they learn something along the way (I certainly did), but them badges will never make you a stalker or replace the knowledge you will get from getting out in the field and stalking some deer. Ideally with one of the aforementioned professionals. What I think BDS and others should do is not try to get money from the masses for courses which will provide little further learning than could be found in a book but spend more of it's income on schemes such as the BASC and FC stalking schemes. Get these guys out in the field actually stalking deer and learning from those who do it day in. Sure it will cost money but what's better, a badge to look at or the experience gained from being out in the field?
 
I fear the bds have lost their way here. This risks demeaning the value of their other courses to nothing more than a status symbol. The point of the exercise is lost and it's just about money in the bank and bragging rights.
 
Not if it were me Pete a stroke of a pen would be the answer straight through Goffins stupidity. I would get the top brass round the table and have a real talk about standards and policy's that would improve deer welfare and give ordinary people a chance to Watch Photograph and manage our increasing population.
 
Too much emphasis on people getting Gold, Silver or Bronze medals and the MONEY AROUND IT, nothing said about where the money is going to be used as per earlier suggestion by a charity (but not really concerned about that too much), will this make the stalker a better stalker or going to help more with the welfare of the deer on the permissions or estates that are run by these stalkers. Me i have no qualifications at all in anything to do with deer, i know of a few older guys that have been shooting for years for nearly as old as i am and they have no qualifications but probably forgot more than i know and these men and women have been talking for years about courses and certificates and what if the government make it a legal requirement to take deer on their own grounds, it was even suggested that i take some courses and be able to take them out with me. So until it becomes a legal requirement to have all these certificates and i need to pay somebody for these courses, Well its just another money making scheme.........My thoughts only of course.....and possibly the 75 year old who asked if i could sit the exams so that he could still shoot over his own land.....I will not be participating..
 
goathunter1 said:
I wonder if, after 51 posts, and 2.5k views, anyone from the BDS marketing department who, I imagine, came up with this scheme, are taking cognisance of what is happening on this site. One would like to think so, but maybe not.
BDS, what do you say?
Click to expand...

"We are not a deerstalking fraternity but rather a Charity that promotes the welfare of, and interest in, UK Deer".

Surely?

K
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

BDS Deerbytes: Clarity on DMC3
Replies
11
Views
1K
Smelly Yeti
Smelly Yeti
Available: Wild Boar Online learning and Assessment Day Bristol 4th June
Replies
0
Views
356
BDS - Charity Account
BDS - Charity Account
Wanted: Looking for mentor/someone to shadow - Hampshire
Replies
9
Views
2K
bottletopbill
bottletopbill
Advanced Deer Management course with BDS
Replies
0
Views
451
T.eddie
T.eddie
New owner and mod/admin
3 4 5
Replies
92
Views
6K
bulric
B
R. Macleod & Son - The Best Hunting Companion
Back
Top