To that end, here’s a question for y’a - would you prefer a pair of original Swaro SLC, or a modern brand new 2021 Hawke Fronter ED X / Vortex (etc) ? Modern cheaper mid-end vs older top end…
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Binos - Olden but Golden vs New School tech
- Thread starter Ben23
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John Gryphon
Well-Known Member
I havent even seen a pair of Hawke or Vortex so I cant comment but the older SLC`s have outshone every other cheaper lots.
I had the opportunity to compare a SLC with Vortex of identical mag & objective size (8x56) at a Bisley trade show some years ago and feel able to comment meaningfuly:
The Vortex were impressive and without doubt exceptional value but they lacked that last light magic and everyday sparkle of the SLC’s.
There’s a reason Swaro, Zeiss and Leica glass is expensive and there are no short-cuts in producing such exceptional optics.
Feel free to disagree and I won’t be upset. It is after all what the Stalking Directory is about!
K
Please be aware of the narrow (tunnel-like) field of view that is even more noticeable than the 7-power. In other words “try before you buy”.
K
norcan
Well-Known Member
7x42 has 46deg AFOV
10x40 has 60deg AFOV
I’ve always been carp at maths but trust in my vision has never been in doubt.
If not already please look through both and let me know if my observation makes sense or not.
K
norcan
Well-Known Member
Are you talking about Field of view?
7x42 has 114m
10x40 has 108m.
But AFOV is size of image shown.
(in very very simple terms)
Now, I haven't tried any of the Habicht binoculars. So I could be completely wrong about these binoculars.
But just going by my own binoculars, and their specs with AFOV from 60-70 deg.. there is a difference in image size.
7x42 = 46" TV
10x40 = 60" TV
Both viewed at the same distance, showing the exact fotball match.
Larger is better...
7x42 has 114m
10x40 has 108m.
But AFOV is size of image shown.
(in very very simple terms)
Now, I haven't tried any of the Habicht binoculars. So I could be completely wrong about these binoculars.
But just going by my own binoculars, and their specs with AFOV from 60-70 deg.. there is a difference in image size.
7x42 = 46" TV
10x40 = 60" TV
Both viewed at the same distance, showing the exact fotball match.
Larger is better...
I am not even in the Ark with binos, more like a fossil: my favourites are a pair of 6x30 Taylor Hobsons MOD issue from 1943 that I got with a case for £40. They are ridiculously heavy for their size but have a lovely wide field of view and generate a brilliant 3d effect as when fully opened to fit my eye spacing, the lenses are 12cm apart. The glass is phenomenal, and I actually prefer the image to that in my posh scopes (Kahles 6-24x56 and a S&B PMII 10x42). Apparently the UK was the go to nation for top end optics back in the day. How the mighty have fallen.
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John Gryphon
Well-Known Member
Come on stalkers look a bit harder.
John Gryphon
Well-Known Member
Yes that is probably the most important part of bino assessment,early and late light viewing and where the also rans come well behind.
For years I used MOD Avimo 7x42s. Perfectly fine, built early 80s and well used. Porros, rubber armoured and robust. After one knock too many, they went out of collimation and were BLRd and no-one seemed to want to issue me any more...............The things I liked about the Avimos were the field of view and the mils divisions. The overall height was a little annoying, but not really crucial when deerstalking.
When it came time to replace them, I had a long think about what to purchase. Did I go "vintage" aka "previously-loved" or push the boat out and get a new set of top end Swaros/Leica etc? In the end, after a lot of skulking in specialist boutiques, I decided to try out the Leica Trinovid BA in 7x42. Yes, they are roofies, and I was slightly surprised by the weight, considering they are more compact than the Avimos. But they work and I like them.
But I must be a creature of habit, because I couldn't stop myself looking for a set of 7x42 porros. Not the Avimos. I found a very good condition Swaro 7x42 Habicht in green rubber armour and couldn't resist pulling the trigger on them. And they even have the mils reticle, so if the deer are too far away for the rifle, I can call a fire mission down on them..................And to cap it all, they were issued by the Austrian army at some point.
However, one thing I was not interested in acquiring was anything in the 10x magnification. Personal choice, but I find a) the wobble is too much (and that's without a hint of Parkinsons or bottles of Barolo down me) and b) my eyes feel the strain much sooner when glassing a lot. I can use the 7x all day without feeling any strain.
When it came time to replace them, I had a long think about what to purchase. Did I go "vintage" aka "previously-loved" or push the boat out and get a new set of top end Swaros/Leica etc? In the end, after a lot of skulking in specialist boutiques, I decided to try out the Leica Trinovid BA in 7x42. Yes, they are roofies, and I was slightly surprised by the weight, considering they are more compact than the Avimos. But they work and I like them.
But I must be a creature of habit, because I couldn't stop myself looking for a set of 7x42 porros. Not the Avimos. I found a very good condition Swaro 7x42 Habicht in green rubber armour and couldn't resist pulling the trigger on them. And they even have the mils reticle, so if the deer are too far away for the rifle, I can call a fire mission down on them..................And to cap it all, they were issued by the Austrian army at some point.
However, one thing I was not interested in acquiring was anything in the 10x magnification. Personal choice, but I find a) the wobble is too much (and that's without a hint of Parkinsons or bottles of Barolo down me) and b) my eyes feel the strain much sooner when glassing a lot. I can use the 7x all day without feeling any strain.
sikastag270
Well-Known Member
fawn in front right of large deer. am i right john.
I have used owned plenty different models over the years, I would say you couldn't go wrong with older model Zeiss 7x42 or swaro SLCs they are beautiful binoculars to use and do not lose out by much to the highly touted new end glass.
I currently have a pair of the Zeiss bgats in 7x42 and also a pair of victory HT in 8x42 they are both great but my most used nowadays are the HT they are the more modern take on the bgat and are IMHO the best hunting binoculars I have used both in design and low light the brightest is exceptional, there is currently a pair on the site for sale over your upper limit budget but not by much I would not be without mine.
D
I currently have a pair of the Zeiss bgats in 7x42 and also a pair of victory HT in 8x42 they are both great but my most used nowadays are the HT they are the more modern take on the bgat and are IMHO the best hunting binoculars I have used both in design and low light the brightest is exceptional, there is currently a pair on the site for sale over your upper limit budget but not by much I would not be without mine.
D
I’m going to be looking at some Leica Ultravid 10x42 (non HD, non Plus), later this week.
Going to try and compare them with some older Swaro SLC if I can (although not side by side, as different shops), and also with new Vortex and Hawke, maybe older Nikon HGL, older (non waterproof or gas filled) Habicht, etc.
LCE won’t let me try overnight, or away from the shop, but they will let me buy them and return them within 2 weeks if I don’t like them, so that’s quite tempted - could take them out a few times and compare them to my Helios in real world conditions
(Do PM me if you have any 10x binos for sale, would maybe consider other mags too, ideally under £600 (or very close)).
Going to try and compare them with some older Swaro SLC if I can (although not side by side, as different shops), and also with new Vortex and Hawke, maybe older Nikon HGL, older (non waterproof or gas filled) Habicht, etc.
LCE won’t let me try overnight, or away from the shop, but they will let me buy them and return them within 2 weeks if I don’t like them, so that’s quite tempted - could take them out a few times and compare them to my Helios in real world conditions
(Do PM me if you have any 10x binos for sale, would maybe consider other mags too, ideally under £600 (or very close)).
John Gryphon
Well-Known Member
Yes good spotting,lots missed it lol. 10/10
1 point deducted as correct nomenclature is "calf" like red deer and not fawn.
Well I bought a pair of Leicas 8x56 in about 2005 then another pair of the new shiny 10x42 last year with the ballistics stuff.
Is there a difference, yes. The newer pair give slightly better performance despite a lower exit pupil. However the 8x56 are excellent and had I not tried a new pair I would have been very happy with the 8x56.
Depending on the price and the need for lasers and ballistics stuff I suspect the 8x56 are better value secondhand than new 10x42
Is there a difference, yes. The newer pair give slightly better performance despite a lower exit pupil. However the 8x56 are excellent and had I not tried a new pair I would have been very happy with the 8x56.
Depending on the price and the need for lasers and ballistics stuff I suspect the 8x56 are better value secondhand than new 10x42
No need for lasers or ballistics stuff.
Also found a pair of SLCs in 8x30, which look very pretty indeed, but would be stepping from 42mm down to 30, whilst not increasing mag at all, so not sure they'd be worth forking out for over my Helios to help with buck ID. Same price for the SLC 8x30 as the Ultravid 10x42 too, so the Leica might have it there.
Going to get hands-on later this week (maybe tomorrow) but always good to go into the shop clued up rather than learning all this stuff afterwards when its too late!
Also found a pair of SLCs in 8x30, which look very pretty indeed, but would be stepping from 42mm down to 30, whilst not increasing mag at all, so not sure they'd be worth forking out for over my Helios to help with buck ID. Same price for the SLC 8x30 as the Ultravid 10x42 too, so the Leica might have it there.
Going to get hands-on later this week (maybe tomorrow) but always good to go into the shop clued up rather than learning all this stuff afterwards when its too late!
Lightweight!I still use a pair of 7x45 Zeiss Nightowls which I bought new 20 odd years ago. Optically great & lugging them around saves me from having to go to the gym…..
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