Gun laws daily telegraph

This graphic shows levels of shotgun crime in Scotland. Remember, S2 guns are so if a problem they need to be brought under stricter control apparently...deapite being the least used type of gun in crime, beaten by a country mile by handguns that were banned in 1997 and airguns that were licenced in 2015. UK governments don't base their firearms laws on fact, it's all driven by emotive ignorance.
 

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No…Scotland has a different system….SHOGUN
Yes. And it works really well. All the police know who has what and where, irrespective of what or where your certificate is. It would he dead easy for there to be a dedicated phone line for sales, so you call up, give the certificate number and it confirms the name and address of the holder or if its a fake or expired etc. It doesn't even next to be staffed, it could be automated. That would eaosly have flushed out this twisted killer.
 
There is Lakeside shooting ground just 30 minutes away by car.

Regardless really, i feel for the chap that sold him the shotgun, he thought everything was legit now having to live with his mistake.

I have often wondered about these shooting's/stabbing's were they this common in the 60's 70's and 80's pre computer games ?
Not to my knowledge.
My feelings exactly. Teenagers in the US used to drive their pick up to school, leave it unlocked with rifles on the gun rack and nothing happened. What's changed since then???? The evolution of shooting computer games - kids are growing up shooting others in a game scenario and there's bound to be some that then think, I wonder what this would be like in real life.
 
plastic cards like a drivers licence with a unique QR code on them that will take anyone who scans it to a web page for the licence holder, firearms owned and available slots...... you could even link it to the passport DB in the same way DVLA now is.....
I agree, some way for a seller to reliably authenticate your ticket. Maybe if they scan it it shows your picture and the expiry dates and FAC numbers and what they can possess. However there will need to be caution to not allow this to backfire and enable criminals to target us FAC owners in some way.

It really pains me as theres absolutely nothing else the seller could have possibly done. I fear we will be dragged over the coals which is wrong. Once again it's the system that failed.
 
Shooting orgs making a stand and issuing statements doesn't do much when the only people who read them are shooters as they are issued on the social media pages theybalready follow.

They need the statements in the papers and on the news. That isn't something you see very often.

In the US, you really do see NRA statements in the news.
 
Hi.
Will any changes to licensing need primary legislation or can the Home Secretary change things at the stroke of a pen?

I am wondering if they may take this opportunity to take shotguns to section 1. Will make no difference with regard to forged certificates but they may just use it as an excuse.
 
Totally agree Morkai we are going to get more trouble for a doggy certificate.
Why do the police forces not have a emergency contact no, so we can double check details on any cert's.

Just blame us legal folk's for everything yet again.
 
Labour is absolutely unhinged when it comes to firearms law. Every change they've made has been pointless or resulted in no linked reductions in crime. The ignorance behind the quotes in the news this week is staggering. The focus all their energy and money on expensive, pointless and ineffective bans, while refusing to do the things that would have a positive, material impact, like mandatory GP involvement in the licensing system and proper resourcing of the police. It's pathetic.
The Tories track record on firearms is about the same.
Ban, ban, ban.
They're all as bad as each other.
 
Presumably the obvious change is doing away with paper - as per dvla and numerous other organisations? Some kind of national online database, with decent encryption, which RFDs can check, showing what we are allowed to hold?
 
Presumably the obvious change is doing away with paper - as per dvla and numerous other organisations? Some kind of national online database, with decent encryption, which RFDs can check, showing what we are allowed to hold?
Allowing a web portal for transfers would be good. Wont need to deal with emails from both parties that way and will all be automated.
 
Allowing a web portal for transfers would be good. Wont need to deal with emails from both parties that way and will all be automated.
The problem with anything public racing and online is that is can be hacked. Look what happened to Guntrader. That would be an utter disaster and you can bet your bottom dollar the government response would be to ban even more things 'just in case', despite it being their fault. I think the best plan is a telephone line you can call, pass the operator the certificate ref in question (as well as your own cert number and key details to confirm you are also legitimate) and they can tell you if the certificate is legitimate and if the holder is entitled to purchase whatever it is they are looking to purchase. Confirmation can be fairly simple and doesn't need to give out personal details. If it was an automated system, it could work 24/7, so this incident would not be able to happen.
 
Should be all shooting organizations making a stand for us all .
Just left BASC but we should not keep knocking Conor from BASC he does work hard for shooter's
Sorry that you left BASC and I respect your decision and thank you for the kind words. And to address some of the other comments in the thread the organisations do work together with a common voice in discussions with the Home Office on matters relating to firearms licensing and legislation via the British Shooting Sports Council (BSSC).

The BSSC members are listed here:

 
Conor thank you yet again you have now informed me that shooting organizations do work together.
This is one of the ways we will have a greater voice to protect our ways'
Keep up the good work you are doing
 
The problem with anything public racing and online is that is can be hacked. Look what happened to Guntrader. That would be an utter disaster and you can bet your bottom dollar the government response would be to ban even more things 'just in case', despite it being their fault. I think the best plan is a telephone line you can call, pass the operator the certificate ref in question (as well as your own cert number and key details to confirm you are also legitimate) and they can tell you if the certificate is legitimate and if the holder is entitled to purchase whatever it is they are looking to purchase. Confirmation can be fairly simple and doesn't need to give out personal details. If it was an automated system, it could work 24/7, so this incident would not be able to happen.
Absolutely spot on, well said Sir.
 
I think they said that they would review the process for obtaining crossbows, but it has gone quiet since.

One consideration to make here is that the perpetrator did consider killing the chap selling him the shotgun. So in that instance, if he had chosen to kill the owner of the shotgun then fake id or not, the gun would have ended up in the hands of a psychopath.

I know it’s a shag and hassle, but completing the transaction in the presence of an rfd would solve the issues and would likely add marginal cost.
If the fake certificate is good enough to convince the seller then what difference would it make if the transaction was completed at an RFD?
 
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