HELP 12b hammer gun with Damascus barrels HELP

[chelsea7513]

Hi guys,
I have recently been given said shotgun, and I would like to know a bit more about it and what steps I can take to clean it up a bit.
I was given to me by a friend who got it handed down to him by his grandfather.

I'm not very knowledgeable with shotguns, especially old ones, so be gentle !

1 - Can anyone tell me a bit about it by looking at the photos and stamp marks ? age, chamber length, choke, price - whether its worth getting it reproofed / re-barrelled etc
2 - How I can give it a good clean up without ruining the markings etc ( being n old gun and damascus barrelled, I'm under the impression its softer than today's steel barrels ? )
3 - The trigger guard has snapped off at the front ( see pictures ) can I get a replacement or will this be a job for a gunsmith to reattach ?
4 - It has a crack around the grip ( see pictures ) what are my options here? I would maybe look at getting the whole stock sanded down and re done but would this be enough to fix the crack ? it feels solid !

Any help or information would be greatly appreciated !

Thank you

Chris

 

[chelsea7513]

more photos

 

[Smellydog]

First check the barrels solder is good. Hold the barrels by resting them on your finger at the hinge lug and gently tap the barrels.
They should ring
If you get a dull sound then it has a loose rib somewhere.

 

[Smellydog]

Next , it looks to be black powder only proof.
You can measure the chamber with a wooden dowel.

 

[chelsea7513]

sound advice thank you ! good starting point

 

[Dogangun]

The Midland Gun Company made the Demon model.

 

[chelsea7513]

The Midland Gun Company made the Demon model.

Ah yes that's all the information I have got !

 

[VSS]

If you sand down the woodwork and refinish it, it'll lose that lovely patina of age that makes it the special gun that it is. Best left alone, imo.
I'm sure the crack could be glued and pinned with only localised refinishing required.
Probably the trigger guard could be brazed.

 

[chelsea7513]

If you sand down the woodwork and refinish it, it'll lose that lovely patina of age that makes it the special gun that it is. Best left alone, imo.
I'm sure the crack could be glued and pinned with only localised refinishing required.
Probably the trigger guard could be brazed.

thank you im gonna give it to my gunsmith to have a look over it and see what magic he can do. As you say re sanding the wood would take away the 'oldness' of the gun to be fair !

 

[deerstalker.308]

I wouldn’t sink a lot of money into it if I were you, very little commercial value in it so whatever you do it won’t add much if anything to it in that regard. But if you just want to hold onto it then so be it but I certainly wouldn’t be throwing money at it if it was mine

 

[McKenzie]

Well I threw money at a hammer gun & I couldn’t be happier with it. Not an investment though but a gun to use.

Post 14

Stalking on cornflakes

Out this morning, -6 but managed this one.

www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk

 

[chelsea7513]

Well I threw money at a hammer gun & I couldn’t be happier with it. Not an investment though but a gun to use.

Post 14

Stalking on cornflakes

Out this morning, -6 but managed this one.

www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk

very nice hammer gun there !

I rarely shoot shotguns now so it was something I was going to try and do up and sell on. but as others has said if its going to cost a lot to make pretty there's probably not much point. I thought they were worth a decent amount being damascus barrels and not being able to find many about other than being like £400+ !
but cleaned up, I might just keep it and use for the odd game day here and there.

 

[Heym SR20]

I would have a good watch of some Mark Novaks videos. Lots of good tips on conserving old guns. Very much not about refinishing, instead about getting the grime of and conserving. One of his videos below. Go to his chanel and have a watch of a few.



Before attacking it though think carefully about what you want to do.

First do the barrels ring nicely. Then is it still reasonably tight on the action. If its dull and rattly lot of work to do. Worth measuring the bores and wall thickness.

Then use some angel **** and soak all the screws. Whilst awaiting for it to work make yourself a set turnscrews that fit the slots.

Strip the action, boil the barrels and all the action parts and card them off with 0000 wire wool. Boiling converts all the rust into blue and stops the rust.

Wood work. Clean it up with a light soap, let it dry. If there is still lots of grime then vodka or a rag and on a tooth will take it off. It won’t take out the original finish.

Then re oil.

Now that it is apart you can make an assessment. Don’t expect to easily get new parts. Mostly these guns were hand made. You might get lucky and find another similar, but mostly it will be down to making new bits. Or paying a gunsmith to do so.

Making bits - start with decent steel stock and get out files and hack saw. Most parts can be made with hand tools.

The Jack Rowe master gunsmith is a very good guide. Fortunately he was recorded making lots of bits and pieces by Midway USA.



Only you can make an assessment on whether it is worth spending the time and money rebuilding. Mostly these are not really economic to do so. And deactivation costs are prohibitive.

If its too far gone- repurpose the woodwork and get an rfd to cut the barrels and then use a forge to make into knives and be creative. Lock plates make a nice desk toy.

 

[tarponhead]

thank you im gonna give it to my gunsmith to have a look over it and see what magic he can do. As you say re sanding the wood would take away the 'oldness' of the gun to be fair !

That is the best idea - give it to someone who knows what they are doing and can tell you if it’s safe to shoot and then cherish it for what it is. Better that than ruin or break it and regret.

 

[paul o']

May have a stock from a midland and pos a trigger guard ?

 

[Pedro]

Those barrels are lovely. Don't re-barrel it. Although depending on the thickness of them, it might need sleeved and re-proofed assuming you are going to use it for it's intended purpose.

Beware though, you could easily spend more money on it than it'll ever be worth.

 

[Heym SR20]

Also Vintage Gun Journal is a mine of information

Non Starters

Some guns are too far gone to restore.

www.vintageguns.co.uk

And

Dealing with broken stocks

Breaks in woodwork are very expensive to put right and hard to spot.

www.vintageguns.co.uk

 

[chelsea7513]

May have a stock from a midland and pos a trigger guard ?

Thanks guys ! I think I'll see what the gunsmith says to start. I love the idea of keeping the gun or re using it as something else !

How much would it be for the stock + trigger guard?? I'd like to keep the wood if the crack isn't anything substantial to be honest but the trigger guard would need replacing / fixing if I go down that route, so it'll give me a rough price in my head depending on what the gunsmith says

 

[paul o']

If I have it Nothing just the cost of the post as i can't 100% say it will fit.

 

[MarinePMI]

It looks a lot like an old Cogswell & Harrison gun.

I hope your smith is familiar with these type of guns, because they can be a bit of a pain to work on. Most of them did not have standardized screw thread pitch diameters.

I had to repair one (years ago) that had a stripped tang screw. Ended up having to make the screw from round stock, leaving the underside proud, and then turning the underside down to time the screw correctly with the gun. Not difficult, but very time consuming.