Help buying new o/u shotgun

[muddy42]

I've used ancient side by side shotguns all my life, but I can no longer justify the cost to keep them in repair. I'm ready for a new over an under now. My requirements are very much from a rough game shooting requirement (not clays):
- proofed for high speed steel.
- 3 inch chamber (I shoot some geese and foreshore)
- I don't like full pistol grips so as classic/straight as possible
- 28 inch or max 30 inch barrels
- adjustable chokes or if fixed not tighter than 1/2
- I guess I'll have to get used to single trigger, but I don't need it to be selective or anything like that.
- functional, don't need fancy wood or engraving.
- Budget <£3k
Currently people are steering me towards Miroku, Beretta or Browning (apparently they are made by Miroku aswell). I'm off the nearest clay ground to try a few, but if anyone has any advice or has recently been through this process, let me know. Thanks in advance.

 

[rocketdogbert]

Before you buy, be aware it’s Beretta’s 500th anniversary in March, so a good chance a bunch of anniversary models will be released.
Might be worth thinking about, or possibly they’ll be decent near new used guns on the Market if people trade in

 

[Scarpa]

I'd say just try them out. I found that a Berretta suited me very well yet Brownings just felt a little awkward in my hands. I shot mostly clays, wirh some game and rough so went for a sporter, my dad preferred a lighter gun and bought a game model. 20 years later my 30" multichoke is still going strong.

 

[enfieldspares]

Try before you buy and beware of people hoisting their prejudices on you. One clay ground I shoot at they are Beretta haters. I ask why and get an explanation. As to 3" chambers I am not so sure as some say that with steel that'll mean that you are then advised to ONLY use cartridges of that case length. But having said that I did have a slab of 3" steel 1 1/8 ounce #5. Which I think were Gamebore?

Good bargains can be had with the 3" model Browning guns as these are too heavy for those wanting a game gun. As to grip I have shot side by side guns for all of my life yet find not difficulty is using a pistol grip or "pistol hand" gun that has an OPEN grip rather than the style that looks like a horse's hoof.

Double trigger guns are cheap as chips and the auction houses don't want them. The old Laurona has such and in some 3" chambers. Choke however will be tight. I did have a Sarriugarte O/U with double triggers, 3" chambers and choked IMP and IMP some six or seven years ago. So a web seaech for Sarriugarte or Laurona might bear fruit? Fabarm also made double trigger guns.

All modern single trigger O/U guns will be selective. The advantage of that is that you can as a live quarry shooter select the TOP barrel to fire first. This means that the easiest barrel to reload is the barrel that gets fired first. So to my mind that outweighs any advantage of a double trigger on an O/U gun as be aware that most double trigger O/U guns will be set up to fire the bottom barrel first and that order cannot be changed.

The Guntrader website has the feature to search O/U guns and then qualify that by maker's name and/or number of triggers. So you can search just 12 GUAGE then add OVER/UNDER then add TWO TRIGGERS. I hope it helps. I have tried to set a link to do that below:

Guns For Sale | New and Used Guns | GunTrader

GunTrader the UK's No.1 marketplace for guns for sale. Buy or sell new and used guns and shooting equipment. Browse shotguns, rifles, air rifles and pistols.

www.guntrader.uk

 

[Flash G 74]

Hello, I would also look at something like the ATA/ Yildiz Sporters , Multi Choke, Steel proof and well made , 30 inch barrel, about 7 llbs

 

[muddy42]

Try before you buy and beware of people hoisting their prejudices on you. One clay ground I shoot at they are Beretta haters. I ask why and get an explanation. As to 3" chambers I am not so sure as some say that with steel that'll mean that you are then advised to ONLY use cartridges of that case length. But having said that I did have a slab of 3" steel 1 1/8 ounce #5. Which I think were Gamebore?

Good bargains can be had with the 3" model Browning guns as these are too heavy for those wanting a game gun. As to grip I have shot side by side guns for all of my life yet find not difficulty is using a pistol grip or "pistol hand" gun that has an OPEN grip rather than the style that looks like a horse's hoof.

Double trigger guns are cheap as chips and the auction houses don't want them. The old Laurona has such and in some 3" chambers. Choke however will be tight. I did have a Sarriugarte O/U with double triggers, 3" chambers and choked IMP and IMP some six or seven years ago. So a web seaech for Sarriugarte or Laurona might bear fruit? Fabarm also made double trigger guns.

All modern single trigger O/U guns will be selective. The advantage of that is that you can as a live quarry shooter select the TOP barrel to fire first. This means that the easiest barrel to reload is the barrel that gets fired first. So to my mind that outweighs any advantage of a double trigger on an O/U gun as be aware that most double trigger O/U guns will be set up to fire the bottom barrel first and that order cannot be changed.

The Guntrader website has the feature to search O/U guns and then qualify that by maker's name and/or number of triggers. So you can search just 12 GUAGE then add OVER/UNDER then add TWO TRIGGERS. I hope it helps. I have tried to set a link to do that below:

Guns For Sale | New and Used Guns | GunTrader

GunTrader the UK's No.1 marketplace for guns for sale. Buy or sell new and used guns and shooting equipment. Browse shotguns, rifles, air rifles and pistols.

www.guntrader.uk

Thanks. loys of useful pointers here.
Thats a new one to me about matching chamber size to cartridge in steel? I thought most new high speed steel proofed guns (certainly miroku, browning and berretta) have 3 inch chambers now. I'll look into this.
Yes its the full pistol grip, horses hoof that I don't like on rifles or shotguns. I find it harder to take a quick mount/shot, which is often necessary for rough shooting.
I'll have a look to see if there are any new(-ish) double triggers available. Its what I am used to and I don't really go in for rapid fire driven days where which barrel fires first matters.

 

[Navarone]

surely for 3k you could get a bloody lovely side by side of some sort which needs no work doing to it AND a semi auto or cheap over under proofed for high speed steel. Giving up the habit of a lifetime seems a bit mad given sXs’s are the best value guns going at the moment…

 

[Smellydog]

Never been a superimposed gun man myself bar a few.
The only one I have at the moment is a Valmet. 3" multi. Bomb proof design. Very impressive. Cheap as chips relatively to your budget.
If you simply must have a high end gun that's fine but there are some tidy bargains out there.
Re Berretta, I'm not a fan, overpriced CNC made guns. At least others had human hands work on them!

 

[Smellydog]

surely for 3k you could get a bloody lovely side by side of some sort which needs no work doing to it AND a semi auto or cheap over under proofed for high speed steel. Giving up the habit of a lifetime seems a bit mad given sXs’s are the best value guns going at the moment…

Very good point.

 

[B&W FOX]

For High Pressure steel, multi choke I'd be looking at a Fabarm

 

[wytonpjs]

There are so many good secondhand shotguns out there at present I wouldn’t buy new as there many a good bargain to be had. I suspect the way things are going more still will be coming to market - it’s definitely a buyers market at present!

 

[muddy42]

surely for 3k you could get a bloody lovely side by side of some sort which needs no work doing to it AND a semi auto or cheap over under proofed for high speed steel. Giving up the habit of a lifetime seems a bit mad given sXs’s are the best value guns going at the moment…

Because I want a gun that is reliable. I live remotely and spending time and money to get guns repaired or having to go with one barrel has got a bit boring. I have and will still have some side by sides left.
I would love a semi auto, but I just don't think its socially acceptable yet to turn up on some days rocking (and racking) a camo semi auto beretta xtrema! Maybe this will change with steel shot.

 

[NoIDeer]

You can't go wrong with the makes you mention. I'm no expert shotgun shooter but my silver pigeon which ticks all your boxes is a lovely pointable gun.

Try before you buy.

 

[Smellydog]

Because I want a gun that is reliable.

What makes you think superimposed are more reliable than a sxs?

 

[NullMac]

Always buy a shotgun with an adj stock

 

[enfieldspares]

Thanks. loys of useful pointers here.
Thats a new one to me about matching chamber size to cartridge in steel? I thought most new high speed steel proofed guns (certainly miroku, browning and berretta) have 3 inch chambers now. I'll look into this.
Yes its the full pistol grip, horses hoof that I don't like on rifles or shotguns. I find it harder to take a quick mount/shot, which is often necessary for rough shooting.
I'll have a look to see if there are any new(-ish) double triggers available. Its what I am used to and I don't really go in for rapid fire driven days where which barrel fires first matters.

The chamber match is something that is referenced in a Hull Cartridge video. As that gap between a 70mm steel cartridge case mouth and the leed into a 76mm chamber supposedly allows the shot column to expand and then immediatel forces it back tight.

The first barrel thing isn't about rapid fire. It is about if only a single shot is taken that it is a lot easier to reload the top barrel than it is the bottom barrel. Even on a slow trickle of birds you will find that it has benefits. I also find that some double trigger O/U guns hit the knuckle of the second finger with the back of the trigger guard when the front trigger is fired.

I find that Browning guns have some of the most open grip shapes.

I've now almost abandoned my search for the "ideal" O/U gun for a confirmed long time S/B/S shooter to use and have gone old school self loader. A Browning A-5 in 16 bore 2 3/4" from 1963 (see image below) and a 1970's Browning "Light Twelve" in 12 bore the usual 2 3/4". Both are open choked and being post-1950's guns have the speedload feature. The 12 bore has the Browning square bottom pistol grip of that era.

The advantage of self loading guns is that you can simply scrap the barrel when it gets worn out and buy another one. Used Browning A-5 at auction are around £200 although for most you'll need when the time comes to have the choke opened.

The other thing with O/U guns is sporting stocks and trap stocks and old school skeet stocks.

The trap stocks will have less drop so made to put a greater percentage of the shot charge above the line of sight. So if you do get a try at a clay club ask to try a trap gun as well as an all around sporting gun. It may be that the trap stock suits you better or suits you worse. But at least you've now foundout that fact before buying!

 

[Smellydog]

As that gap between a 70mm steel cartridge case mouth and the leed into a 76mm chamber supposedly allows the shot column to expand and then immediatel forces it back tight.

I very much doubt that in less than 1/4" there is time for any harm to be caused and not at peak pressure as well.
Peak pressure is most probably just after the cone and we're it an issue chokes would suffer much more than they do due to peak velocity.

 

[McKenzie]

I have a straight hand stocked o/u with double triggers & a messed about stock. I think it’s a Laurona or similar (I’d need to check). It shoots straight & you can have it for a slab of cartridges.

 

[oldhamstocks]

Got the good news today my beloved 1980s Beretta S682X trap that does every discipline way better than my ability will be good with wider chokes for steel in due course. Get a good s/h Beretta, they are just an utter joy.

 

[Dazb1967]

Definitely try before you buy, I shot a Beretta Silver Pigeon terribly for years and just thought it was my bad shooting that made me miss everything.
I tried a standard Browning 525 on a let day and couldn't believe the difference in my shooting so I changed to Browning, I then went onto a slightly heavier Browning 725 which was equally as good as the 525 but a little less harsh on the shoulder, I also know shooters who have went from Browning to Beretta so its definitely a fitting thing, Also when and if you try one out make sure you wear what you will likely be wearing on shooting days to get the right fit