Imagine phasing out lead is the start of a joint fieldsports future-proofing strategy...

[Wwm]

Whilst it might come as a surprise to some, PM's SWOT pretty much reflects a recent BASC internal exercise that takes place annually - though we probably had more threats than in PM's post. We are being 'attacked' from an increasing number of directions and the tendency to use the courts and 'lawfare' eats up a large amount of resources. Whether the responses are effective enough time will tell - but it is not for want of trying.

Our continued use of lead shot and single use plastics is to me a threat, as is the lack of a strong game meat market both for feather and fur. As a Council member and as a shooter who is also a pensioner and uses a 1926 Scottish gun in 16 bore, giving up lead shot would be painful, but I believe that in the long term the evidence is against us. I have already found copper ammunition that works in my stalking rifle but it did take time and patience. We have now hopefully got 5 years to encourage the manufaturers to produce ammunition that is cheap and effective enough to persuade me to change. BASC is not promoting a ban and if we engage with the process a more nuanced approach might appear. We know that there is not yet a readily available, suitable, replacement for .22 rimfire or air weapons and unless one appears we may need some lead ammunition in the longer term. But for the future of shooting I am willing to try. The fact that all 9 organisations signed up to a joint approach for me is a huge step forward and I hope it continues in the future.

 

[Roestalker39]

Whilst it might come as a surprise to some, PM's SWOT pretty much reflects a recent BASC internal exercise that takes place annually - though we probably had more threats than in PM's post. We are being 'attacked' from an increasing number of directions and the tendency to use the courts and 'lawfare' eats up a large amount of resources. Whether the responses are effective enough time will tell - but it is not for want of trying.

Our continued use of lead shot and single use plastics is to me a threat, as is the lack of a strong game meat market both for feather and fur. As a Council member and as a shooter who is also a pensioner and uses a 1926 Scottish gun in 16 bore, giving up lead shot would be painful, but I believe that in the long term the evidence is against us. I have already found copper ammunition that works in my stalking rifle but it did take time and patience. We have now hopefully got 5 years to encourage the manufaturers to produce ammunition that is cheap and effective enough to persuade me to change. BASC is not promoting a ban and if we engage with the process a more nuanced approach might appear. We know that there is not yet a readily available, suitable, replacement for .22 rimfire or air weapons and unless one appears we may need some lead ammunition in the longer term. But for the future of shooting I am willing to try. The fact that all 9 organisations signed up to a joint approach for me is a huge step forward and I hope it continues in the future.

we are being attacked from within mainly by you’re beloved basc , your organisation is an utter disgrace and so are the rest for jumping on the bandwagon , we don’t need threats from WJ when we have you

 

[User00035]

Yep. I was right then. There is no "we", only a them and us.

 

[Klenchblaize]

“Activism works.”

K

 

[AGR]

Whilst it might come as a surprise to some, PM's SWOT pretty much reflects a recent BASC internal exercise that takes place annually - though we probably had more threats than in PM's post. We are being 'attacked' from an increasing number of directions and the tendency to use the courts and 'lawfare' eats up a large amount of resources. Whether the responses are effective enough time will tell - but it is not for want of trying.

Our continued use of lead shot and single use plastics is to me a threat, as is the lack of a strong game meat market both for feather and fur. As a Council member and as a shooter who is also a pensioner and uses a 1926 Scottish gun in 16 bore, giving up lead shot would be painful, but I believe that in the long term the evidence is against us. I have already found copper ammunition that works in my stalking rifle but it did take time and patience. We have now hopefully got 5 years to encourage the manufaturers to produce ammunition that is cheap and effective enough to persuade me to change. BASC is not promoting a ban and if we engage with the process a more nuanced approach might appear. We know that there is not yet a readily available, suitable, replacement for .22 rimfire or air weapons and unless one appears we may need some lead ammunition in the longer term. But for the future of shooting I am willing to try. The fact that all 9 organisations signed up to a joint approach for me is a huge step forward and I hope it continues in the future.

I see that if JR get their way, we won't need to have the lead argument at all. We'll be firing arrows with rubber tips instead.

 

[AGR]

I see that if JR get their way, we won't need to have the lead argument at all. We'll be firing arrows with rubber tips instead.

Sorry, Wild Justice! I was multi tasking, or rather wasn't!

 

[Freeforester]

There appears to be something of a dichotomy here though, the media here in Scotland and indeed elsewhere in this green and pleasant land are at pains to 'educate' the masses into believing that there are far too many deer, and something must be done to address this situation - hardly a position of strength for crackpot Cwis & Co to destroy deer stalking as such as a meaningful attempt to address this situation?

As to game shooting, we need more 'fluffy duckling' type initiatives (see below) to be rolled out over the schools and outdoors and conservation-minded or the generally persuadeable public, remember that it is only certain aspects of the media and 'celeb' (-as opposed to 'cereb'-) culture who are dissing the whole fieldsports and conservation success stories, of which there are many, these need to be highlighted and extolled.

The majority of people in this country are happy to see the diversity of wildlife present on keepered estates, and other reserves where man influences the picture for the better for all. The luvvies and inept agencies and charities have no successes to show for their efforts by comparison, but are all talk and no trousers, spin without substance, that is plain to see, but we need to increase efforts to engage with the public and demonstrate that we are putting in for the longer term, not just taking for today. As such, conservation planting of woodlands for wildlife, the duck tube project, and similar good news stories aren't so hard to sell to what is still a reasonably 'willing on success' type of audience, they are looking for the real and tangible benefits to what we do, where we still hold the advantage, as opposed to the smoke and mirror talky brigade. It ain't so hard to win round people who are actually willing on the successes of our endeavours, we just need much better PR people , plus an outlet which is open-minded, and has a balanced view on such matters. This latter ground is presently in need of a cull to re-balance the whole, but Cwis, Craven and the other C's won't be around for ever, and if we go about our business doing deeds rather than spouting words, sooner or later folk will take notice. We all want the same thing, but the lefties have their agenda and 'shining path' to take them there, though it has not done so yet, and we know never will, everything they touch ends up being worse than before, whereas we can show by example and practical deeds how best to improve biodiversity. We should build on these sound foundations - theirs are built on sand, and hollow-ringing sounds, and they need to be called out and corrected on their misinformation and misguided directions.

After all, who doesn't like fluffy ducklings? Let's just make sure it's us promoting their conservation, and not the others...

 

[Hod]

So... in terms of PR... BASC’s approach appears to be to grasp the spade with both hands and keep digging.

 

[Roestalker39]

So... in terms of PR... BASC’s approach appears to be to grasp the spade with both hands and keep digging.

This is priceless !

 

[Hod]

This is priceless !

I actually had to re-read what was written. They have actually said this. Publicly.

 

[Mick Miller]

I suggest we give up shooting. But, ffs, don't buy a rod and licence with the money you get back.

 

[sauer]

“ money you’ll get back “?

Bet my last £ if we end up shooting banned gone you won’t be getting money from anyone in compensation or like

 

[merlin]

So... in terms of PR... BASC’s approach appears to be to grasp the spade with both hands and keep digging.

Did you hear that thud? That was my jaw hitting the floor.....you just couldn't make this stuff up.

 

[EckyP243]

It’s all very well to talk but we need ideas..... and FAST!
We need to actually DO something!
I’ve been saying it for ages: we need to be Proactive NOT Reactive.

We need a UK equivalent of the NRA.

 

[mchughcb]

When somebody says future proofing. Think back on your short life and try to come up with one example of anything that was future proofed. Ie never had to change.

Which is why the concept is a tautology.

 

[User00047]

There appears to be something of a dichotomy here though, the media here in Scotland and indeed elsewhere in this green and pleasant land are at pains to 'educate' the masses into believing that there are far too many deer, and something must be done to address this situation - hardly a position of strength for crackpot Cwis & Co to destroy deer stalking as such as a meaningful attempt to address this situation?

As to game shooting, we need more 'fluffy duckling' type initiatives (see below) to be rolled out over the schools and outdoors and conservation-minded or the generally persuadeable public, remember that it is only certain aspects of the media and 'celeb' (-as opposed to 'cereb'-) culture who are dissing the whole fieldsports and conservation success stories, of which there are many, these need to be highlighted and extolled.

The majority of people in this country are happy to see the diversity of wildlife present on keepered estates, and other reserves where man influences the picture for the better for all. The luvvies and inept agencies and charities have no successes to show for their efforts by comparison, but are all talk and no trousers, spin without substance, that is plain to see, but we need to increase efforts to engage with the public and demonstrate that we are putting in for the longer term, not just taking for today. As such, conservation planting of woodlands for wildlife, the duck tube project, and similar good news stories aren't so hard to sell to what is still a reasonably 'willing on success' type of audience, they are looking for the real and tangible benefits to what we do, where we still hold the advantage, as opposed to the smoke and mirror talky brigade. It ain't so hard to win round people who are actually willing on the successes of our endeavours, we just need much better PR people , plus an outlet which is open-minded, and has a balanced view on such matters. This latter ground is presently in need of a cull to re-balance the whole, but Cwis, Craven and the other C's won't be around for ever, and if we go about our business doing deeds rather than spouting words, sooner or later folk will take notice. We all want the same thing, but the lefties have their agenda and 'shining path' to take them there, though it has not done so yet, and we know never will, everything they touch ends up being worse than before, whereas we can show by example and practical deeds how best to improve biodiversity. We should build on these sound foundations - theirs are built on sand, and hollow-ringing sounds, and they need to be called out and corrected on their misinformation and misguided directions.

After all, who doesn't like fluffy ducklings? Let's just make sure it's us promoting their conservation, and not the others...

That’s a great project there in the video, but it would be easy to criticise it because the very animal they are helping to survive, is the same creature they intend to shoot and eat.
For us to really have the upper hand we need to initiate projects that actually don’t actually benefit us directly like that.

could we do something like this?:

Great Bustard Group

greatbustard.org

 

[Odders]

So... in terms of PR... BASC’s approach appears to be to grasp the spade with both hands and keep digging.

They're f***ing delusional.

 

[Roestalker39]

Did you hear that thud? That was my jaw hitting the floor.....you just couldn't make this stuff up.

Why are you shocked ?

 

[merlin]

Why are you shocked ?

.....at their utter and incomprehensible lack of self-awareness.

But then on reflection after posting, given recent events, I don't suppose I should have been!!

 

[25 Sharps]

Whilst it might come as a surprise to some, PM's SWOT pretty much reflects a recent BASC internal exercise that takes place annually - though we probably had more threats than in PM's post. We are being 'attacked' from an increasing number of directions and the tendency to use the courts and 'lawfare' eats up a large amount of resources. Whether the responses are effective enough time will tell - but it is not for want of trying.

Our continued use of lead shot and single use plastics is to me a threat, as is the lack of a strong game meat market both for feather and fur. As a Council member and as a shooter who is also a pensioner and uses a 1926 Scottish gun in 16 bore, giving up lead shot would be painful, but I believe that in the long term the evidence is against us. I have already found copper ammunition that works in my stalking rifle but it did take time and patience. We have now hopefully got 5 years to encourage the manufaturers to produce ammunition that is cheap and effective enough to persuade me to change. BASC is not promoting a ban and if we engage with the process a more nuanced approach might appear. We know that there is not yet a readily available, suitable, replacement for .22 rimfire or air weapons and unless one appears we may need some lead ammunition in the longer term. But for the future of shooting I am willing to try. The fact that all 9 organisations signed up to a joint approach for me is a huge step forward and I hope it continues in the future.

Or viable comparable BC vermin CF bullets.

The fact that all the org’s got together and made a massive decision without so much as a consultation with shooters or cartridge manufacturers shows how complacent and inept they are