Labradors

[Neoublie1]

Evening all,

I’ve had all types of dogs growing up from a Labrador (as a kid), rescues, to bullmastiff’s but now looking at getting a working dog,
I’d now like to get a SMALL Labrador bitch, to teach and to take out on the farm with me, I know there is different size labs and yes, I’ve had no experience at training one either but very keen to learn and teach!

I’d be great full for any advice form anyone with this who may have small labs or those who have had.
And where would be the best place to get one, kennel club registered etc, I’m no no rush as I’d like to cross all the “T’s” and all the “I’s” before I do anything.
As I said before I’m no expert in this but any advice would be appreciated

Thank you
Barry

 

[Rory]

Just do the basics right really - well established breeder with identifieable blood lines, they should be more than happy for you to view the breed pair or bitch. Hip and elbow scores are a must. Saving a hundred quid or two isn't worth it in the long run. A friend of ours is finding this out the hard way as his otherwise lovely black lab is now picking up problems at age 4.
Hope you find a good one, they are such lovely dogs.

 

[Neoublie1]

Just do the basics right really - well established breeder with identifieable blood lines, they should be more than happy for you to view the breed pair or bitch. Hip and elbow scores are a must. Saving a hundred quid or two isn't worth it in the long run. A friend of ours is finding this out the hard way as his otherwise lovely black lab is now picking up problems at age 4.
Hope you find a good one, they are such lovely dogs.

Thank you

 

[Mossypaw]

OK, personal opinion coming up -
I’ve owned and bred labs for nearly 35 years, I have bought a few, some good some bad. The most expensive, fully
pedigreed, ftch line was the worst lab I’ve owned.
The best workers, family pets and healthiest have come from non KC registered dogs that were kept as worker/pets.
My current bitch was bred from non KC dogs, whelped in a barn along with 60 ewes and lambs.
You can pay £1k plus for a lab these days but you can also pay a quarter of that and get a better dog, spend time with the breeder and find one that is breeding for the bitches benefit not they’re bank balance.

 

[slider]

Do you home work, see the parents. Look work a working strain, lean and athletic.

I currently have a young bitch who is about 17.5kg at 7 month. Don't see her getting much over 20/22 kg

 

[norma 308]

Love this bitch rehomed her at 12 months my best dogs have been rehomed , she took very little training we bonded within a week she’s 7 now
She’ll be rough shooting today stalked yesterday she does formal picking up and beating but primarily deer hound
Plenty of dogs out there !

 

[skywull]

its your choice but what ever you choose your gona have fun with it, try and go for some one that works there labs regularly .ie picking up and not just a coupla times a year ..as was said check hip scores and eye defects ..ie...unaffected by trd gpra cpra hc and then enjoy your puppy labs are amazing and can be trained for almost any work

 

[gixer1]

Its a bit of a lottery to be honest, I have just lost (26th Dec) one of the best Labs that ever walked the earth (in my opinion) he was 15 1/2 years old and the photo attached was 6 months before he died on his 15th birthday, the only thing that gave up in the end were his nerves leading to his back legs. We owned him and his sister (who died at 13 years old) from pup's and they were not expensive for a lab and had a mediocre pedigree at best.....but were fantastic temperament, well behaved and for the small amount of training did what was asked of them. I miss them terribly.

My brother bought a Drakeshead Lab - paid a fortune and it was (to be honest) a weird looking lab that didn't make it to 10......and I've known a few "expensive top pedigree dogs" that follow the same story...

For sure the hip/eyes scores are worth looking at but I would say look at the parents if possible.

Best of luck.

Regards,

Gixer

 

[Neoublie1]

Thank you all for all the advice, some lovely pics too.
Seems to be a few things to keep a lookout for, for sure.
This is all really appreciated.
Barry

 

[kes]

there is a range of videos on how to train a gundog from scratch. I will pass on one if you need it - I have never used it but it was recommended.
The raw material is what makes it worthwhile so choose wisely and dont go for hugely expensive but a pup which comes to you from a working litter - local keeper/gun.
Good luck - PM me if you need the DVD to pass on your address.

 

[Neoublie1]

there is a range of videos on how to train a gundog from scratch. I will pass on one if you need it - I have never used it but it was recommended.
The raw material is what makes it worthwhile so choose wisely and dont go for hugely expensive but a pup which comes to you from a working litter - local keeper/gun.
Good luck - PM me if you need the DVD to pass on your address.

Thank you very much for that.
Pm sent

 

[countrryboy]

Must admit I like my labs to look old skool well built with proper head, tail and coat so can handle cover/brairs and cold.

If I was buying a dog off a complete stranger I would want health Tests done, not so much if I knew the person and dogs how they worked them and were breeding for the right reasons ( ie a pupfor themselves)
Do u not have any friends/contacts in working dog scene? If not beworth asking a local gundgclub.

Just becareful buying pups of some folk, there are plenty of rogues out there, many charging proper money for very poorly bred dogs, even known of a few selling pups when they don't know the parentage, not good when have sires and brothers in the kennel.

My old lab who was a cracking working dog is just about still hanging on althou hips on way out, at 15 yr old and heavily drakeshead bred. A couple off seasons he done around 100 days beating or picking up.
Even at 10 while ypung is still 70 in dog years.

For training, u don't mention wot u want it to do.
Be well worth going on a demo day with a decent trainer, any I've been on talk throu the basics and bring pups and dogs out at different ages to show u how to do it.
Really not hard to tan Alan to an average working standard esp when u've been shown the easy ways and common mistakes most folk make.

 

[Mickeydredd]

Just make sure that if you go for a "small" bitch that you don't look to smaller parents who may have SD2. Most bitches are small when compared to dogs so I wouldn't worry too much about size if it is a bitch you are looking for.
Although you can get perfectly good labs from non-registered stock, I still think it is preferable to look towards well bred, fully tested and registered dogs, and especially where the breeder owns dog and bitch so you can see both parents and the bitch with her pups.
Like Countryboy, I prefer the old school type lab and this photo is our stud dog with two of his boys.

 

[Neoublie1]

Must admit I like my labs to look old skool well built with proper head, tail and coat so can handle cover/brairs and cold.

If I was buying a dog off a complete stranger I would want health Tests done, not so much if I knew the person and dogs how they worked them and were breeding for the right reasons ( ie a pupfor themselves)
Do u not have any friends/contacts in working dog scene? If not beworth asking a local gundgclub.

Just becareful buying pups of some folk, there are plenty of rogues out there, many charging proper money for very poorly bred dogs, even known of a few selling pups when they don't know the parentage, not good when have sires and brothers in the kennel.

My old lab who was a cracking working dog is just about still hanging on althou hips on way out, at 15 yr old and heavily drakeshead bred. A couple off seasons he done around 100 days beating or picking up.
Even at 10 while ypung is still 70 in dog years.

For training, u don't mention wot u want it to do.
Be well worth going on a demo day with a decent trainer, any I've been on talk throu the basics and bring pups and dogs out at different ages to show u how to do it.
Really not hard to tan Alan to an average working standard esp when u've been shown the easy ways and common mistakes most folk make.

Thank you for that, would be using the pup for pigeon shooting, out rabbiting etc..... and most importantly the company would be great too. I do have a couple of friend who do have gun dogs but haven’t fully trained them to be fair. definitely take in mind the idea of a demo day!

 

[Dan Newcombe]

If you can buy something that you have seen the dam working at the least and both parents have health tests and as low hip scores as possible. If I was buying I would want something that the sum of the tests was below 8 probably.

These days the cheap pups are gone, even non reg stock is £500 and up.

Buying the pup is the least expensive part of the whole experience (but probably biggest lump outlay).

There is a lot of shite out there for sale as has been said - a working dog is not proven on 10 days a year stood at a peg on the lead. It is proven hunting and finding game all day (whilst under control importantly) and doing it regularly.

We like (and subsequently breed) a racier type of lab for the work we do. Heavy dogs struggle on the hill especially early grouse And we do so little involving water that the heavy swimmer type dog is not what we need.

There are a lot of lab types so choose wisely, high drive shouldn’t necessarily mean out of control - working dogs should be bred to be easily trained otherwise, often you will find they are better to deal with than show bred which trot around a ring and never prove / are selected for their trainability.

Where about are you based?

 

[Neoublie1]

Just make sure that if you go for a "small" bitch that you don't look to smaller parents who may have SD2. Most bitches are small when compared to dogs so I wouldn't worry too much about size if it is a bitch you are looking for.
Although you can get perfectly good labs from non-registered stock, I still think it is preferable to loo towards well bred, fully tested and registered dogs, and especially where the breeder owns dog and bitch so you can see both parents and the bitch with her pups.
Like Countryboy, I prefer the old school type lab and this photo is our stud dog with two of his boys.

View attachment 147874

Thank you I’ll take that on board, really lovely picture of the trio there!

 

[glasshalffull]

Evening all,

I’ve had all types of dogs growing up from a Labrador (as a kid), rescues, to bullmastiff’s but now looking at getting a working dog,
I’d now like to get a SMALL Labrador bitch, to teach and to take out on the farm with me, I know there is different size labs and yes, I’ve had no experience at training one either but very keen to learn and teach!

I’d be great full for any advice form anyone with this who may have small labs or those who have had.
And where would be the best place to get one, kennel club registered etc, I’m no no rush as I’d like to cross all the “T’s” and all the “I’s” before I do anything.
As I said before I’m no expert in this but any advice would be appreciated

Thank you
Barry

Speaking from experience of training a lab to field trial many years back if you get the right one it'll be a joy to educate and easy to do so too. Make sure you get the puppy from working parents buy a good book follow the basics. Never lifted a hand to my wee lady a stern look was punishment enough when needed. Take the training slow and steady and it'll be a joy. Good luck anyway.

 

[Mossypaw]

Interesting terms being used regarding old/new style labs. I think of old style as the heavily built English/swimmer type with broad head and heavily built, not seen so much in the field more likely at crufts. The new style would be more working/American type, lean and athletic build.
Old type are more show bred, but will still work and be easy to train. New type will work day in day out, little more training needed but they also have more of a drive to learn, and hunt.

 

[countrryboy]

Sorry but I would disagree mossy.

Old type are very dfferent to show type.
I'd say there s more 3 broad types ur show stock, modern sknny FT lnes, and ur 3rd type proper working bred labs which are probably nearer the breed standard than the other 2 types despite them looking down there nose at them and considered poorly bred.

My labs are usually about 30kgs, a show dog could be almost 40kg.
I don't think the modern skinny labs have the coats to handle heavy cover,.I expect my labs to enter any cover brairs/whims if scent/birds in there, I've seen well bred labs with poor coats tip toe round thistles, then sit and shiver on cold days.
My dogs have never struggled with a day on grouse, last few years althou only getting 20 or so in on grouse due to low numbers.

Not all FT dogs are skinny whippets some of the established trainers still have there oldl lines of well built but athletic dgs.

I'd definitely try to get some recommendations rather than just adverts, and just because 'keeper bred' doesn't necessarily mean much, seen some very poor keepers dogs, ( not having a go at all keepers here, but u just need to take each litter/breeder on its own merits.

 

[Dan Newcombe]

Personally, unless I knew and liked the dog I would avoid keeper bred - there are a lot of them who are really nothing special.

Trialling bred are moving away from really small fast stuff because they can’t keep up over walls etc. Look at Denbank Khaki it Cluedo of Wedgenock (both of which we have used) - they are big, rangy and athletic dogs.

There is enough out there to be very picky about your pup so make sure you aren’t rail roaded when you go and see pups.