Lead free (copper) bullets
- Thread starter Irish Bob
- Start date
blunderbust
Well-Known Member
I have used the Hornady 80 gr GMX and found them to be very accurate in my 243, I also use the Barnes 180gr TTSX in my 300 win mag and again very accurate, but with both I found the ricochet to be quite bad and stopped using both of them because of this. I will continue to keep a box of 50 of the 180gr TTSX as they are great on the driven Boar.
I have used Nosler Partition100 grain in a 6mm Remington. They are not lead free but, because of the partition they are long for calibre. I'd assume that all copper 6mm bullets of 100 grain would be even longer. My rifle that has the typical 1 in 9" twist used by Parker Hale would not stabilise them with loads that I considered were within safe pressure.
So I would assume that copper 100 grain 6mm bullets will be worse and that the reason they are not offered is because they cannot be gotten to work in any or most 243 Winchester or 6mm Remington rifles that use the "common" 1 in 9" twist that most seem to be made in.
So I would assume that copper 100 grain 6mm bullets will be worse and that the reason they are not offered is because they cannot be gotten to work in any or most 243 Winchester or 6mm Remington rifles that use the "common" 1 in 9" twist that most seem to be made in.
Ronin
Distinguished Member
Ive been using Barnes TSX for a few years - they just plain work, but differ in accuracy lot to lot….
Ive found the need to fine tune my load every 50
Ive got some GS Custom bullets on order from the Netherlands - hopefully these will out perform the Barnes as the GS's are far better finished that the TSX..
Having used both copper and lead(jacketed) bullets extensively - I have to say I prefer copper solids...
Ive found the need to fine tune my load every 50
Ive got some GS Custom bullets on order from the Netherlands - hopefully these will out perform the Barnes as the GS's are far better finished that the TSX..
Having used both copper and lead(jacketed) bullets extensively - I have to say I prefer copper solids...
I got mine from Gregor at McLeods of Tain. I think they usually hold them in stock.
Ian
Ranger22
Well-Known Member
I've only ever used copper bullets in my 270, they are more accurate than soft points. Knock the deer over much better than soft points. From what I have seen they dump all their energy into the beast, I have found several bullets lying on the ground just behind the shot deer. I have never had a richocet. I will have used somewhere between 1500 and 2000 rounds, the downside is the price
Al
Al
tikkathreebarrels
Well-Known Member
And here am I just starting to think about a lead-free load for my 7WSM so I'm going to ask what bullet this is please?
Ok here’s a question.
In Scotland for deer it’s a minimum of 100grains, correct? (Apart from roe)
So lead being a dense material means that other metals will have a larger volume to maintain the 100grains legal requirements.
Now I believe that there might be a stability issue with the larger bullet.
If that’s so then the forestry commission or whatever they are known as will surely have to change their rifles.
What do others think?
In Scotland for deer it’s a minimum of 100grains, correct? (Apart from roe)
So lead being a dense material means that other metals will have a larger volume to maintain the 100grains legal requirements.
Now I believe that there might be a stability issue with the larger bullet.
If that’s so then the forestry commission or whatever they are known as will surely have to change their rifles.
What do others think?
Ranger22
Well-Known Member
I don’t know of any 243 being used by Rangers. Predominantly 270 and they shoot copper ammo brilliantly
Yes, 243 might be problematic unless the rules are changed. I would personally not at this time suggest buying a 243 rifle for deer. 6.5mm plus is a better bet
long_range_rob
Well-Known Member
100gr and 1,750 foot pounds (min muzzle velocity 2,450 feet per second).
Yes a 100gr lead bullet is shorter than a 100gr monolithic.
There 'can' be a stability issue if the twist rate is slow/long. There is a lot of discussion about this at the moment the consensus being that you need around a 1:9" for 100gr (non-lead), because they are longer.
Commonly .243 barrels are 1:10, some rifles are OK, most are not, some bullets group others tumble. ie a 1:10 is marginal for a 100gr non-lead bullet in a .243
.243 chamberings are considered too small for deer (as @Ranger22 and @srvet advise).
Firing a larger caliber moves the instability up the curve. ie with a 1:10 twist in a .25-06 cal barrel 120gr non-lead (and some tipped boat tail designs) get marginal. 100gr is perfectly stable and also offer 2300ft/lb at 3200fps so are well above the legal limit for deer. 6.5mm (.264) can cope with non-lead bullets up to 140gr and lead to 160gr
Here is a linky to a site with info regarding twist rates. Most 6.5cal have a 1:210mm (slightly less than 1:9) twist.
Here is a linky relating to Gyroscopic and Dynamic stability
So both seem to work!
Tom D
Well-Known Member
I've been considering a switch to copper for a wee while, they are expensive apart from Lehigh Defense who sell by the hundred as opposed to 50 and seem to offer better value. I'll probably try these at some point although sourcing them in the UK will likely be a PITA.
They will drift in the wind more than the ELDX that I use right now but realistically I don't tend to shoot deer out all that far and I can always use the high BC lead ones for plinking if I want anyway.
They will drift in the wind more than the ELDX that I use right now but realistically I don't tend to shoot deer out all that far and I can always use the high BC lead ones for plinking if I want anyway.
long_range_rob
Well-Known Member
For me the fascinating part of the experiment was seeing how many tiny fragments of lead you found in the wound channel. Bit of an eye opener.
That said I still use ballistic tips.
That said I still use ballistic tips.
Have just with .270 Winchester load development.
Took notes off @takbok who has good experience with a wide range of copper bullets, at the moment I am trying to mimic the Sako Powerhead 2 load but get a little bit better performance and accuracy.
When I first started loading my own I was under the impression that the primary reason was to save money.
Having done a little bit of load development with both shotgun and rifle I now have a better understanding of ballistics and bullet/load choice.
At the end of the day we owe it to our quarry that it is humanely taken and with minimal meat damage if it is to be put into the food chain.
I doubt I will be buying any factory loaded rounds (apart from 22LR!) in the future, unless they are going cheap. Even then I will just use them for practise and keep the brass.
@Irish Bob, I would talk to @Yorric about non-lead loading for the .243, might require a faster twist rate to work well with 100 grain bullets.
Took notes off @takbok who has good experience with a wide range of copper bullets, at the moment I am trying to mimic the Sako Powerhead 2 load but get a little bit better performance and accuracy.
When I first started loading my own I was under the impression that the primary reason was to save money.
Having done a little bit of load development with both shotgun and rifle I now have a better understanding of ballistics and bullet/load choice.
At the end of the day we owe it to our quarry that it is humanely taken and with minimal meat damage if it is to be put into the food chain.
I doubt I will be buying any factory loaded rounds (apart from 22LR!) in the future, unless they are going cheap. Even then I will just use them for practise and keep the brass.
@Irish Bob, I would talk to @Yorric about non-lead loading for the .243, might require a faster twist rate to work well with 100 grain bullets.
tikkathreebarrels
Well-Known Member
Your conversation about 243 and 100 grainers: would you mind sharing?
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