Non Toxic advice?

[Lancaster]

Gents, I’m needing some suggestions if possible please?

I’ve slightly come a cropper. I’ve booked a days stalking next week and loaded up a batch of home loads which always takes a bit of time. It turns out that the estate is non toxic only so I’m a tad late in finding this out.

Which of the following brands would you recommend? Purely looking at bushwear because it’s central / handy.

I prefer to use my own rifle from a confidence view but then that changes with new ammo anyway.

I can’t decide whether to grab one of the recommend boxes available and try them out on the target on the day,(seems a bit hectic but difficult to test before then). Or just use the estate rifle.


If anyone can recommend any of the below ammo for reliability,(appreciate no guarantees it’ll shoot well in my particular rifle) I may pick up a box in the hope that I can squeeze a target session in prior to the big day.


Cheers!

Is there no where near home that you can buy some ammunition and try out before you travel?

If not, I would use the estate rifle, put a couple of test shots into the steel stag and be ready to go onto the hill in a relaxed state of mind, instead of frantically trying out different ammunition to see what groups in your rifle then zeroing it before setting off.

 

[cjm1066]

Estate rifle is sadly the only choice, or buy 2-3 boxes and spend 1/2 day on the range.

 

[wildfowler.250]

Personally I would Just use the estate rifle. To turn up and zero with unproved ammunition seems amateur to me. What if the rifle doesnt like your choice of round, if you get them in time?

This was my feeling as well to be honest and I drove past the shop today and decided not to go in. I’d come to the conclusion I will use the estate rifle. There might be scope to have trialled my own one with non tox next next weekend but if the rifle didn’t like your choice of ammo you’re back at square one etc.

The only shot I’ve ever pulled to date was on a roe with a borrowed rifle. Recovered it with a follow up shot but it’s just never the same. Although I have used several hire rifles before. And I will get a shot at the targets before hand. But it’s a bit like driving a hire car , it’s never as smooth as what you’re used to.

Is there no where near home that you can buy some ammunition and try out before you travel?

If not, I would use the estate rifle, put a couple of test shots into the steel stag and be ready to go onto the hill in a relaxed state of mind, instead of frantically trying out different ammunition to see what groups in your rifle then zeroing it before setting off.

I agree bud. There’s scope to zero locally but it’s a bit of a stress. I’ll go for the estate rifle I think but might buy a couple of boxes of non tox for a trial for future ref.

Estate rifle is sadly the only choice, or buy 2-3 boxes and spend 1/2 day on the range.

That was my thinking. You could be £150 on ammo and not even fire a shot on the hill as well. Not that the cost is the concern. Mainly after clean kills on the day.





Cheers for the feedback gents. It’s given me plenty options to look into. I’ll try a couple of boxes for future ref but it’ll be the estate rifle on the day for just general ease and timescale. Thanks!

 

[Bowland blades]

Cheers guys, good to know!

sorry to burst that bubble but the winchester in the silvery white boxes aint expanding . been a problem on an estate i visit and i saw the easte stalker hit a fair stag in behind the shoulder , a perfectly hit stag bleeding out but slowly . it wasnt the only one they had had like that

 

[Dunwaters]

Personally I would Just use the estate rifle. To turn up and zero with unproved ammunition seems amateur to me. What if the rifle doesnt like your choice of round, if you get them in time?

Why not bring your own rifle and give it a go first?
If it doesn’t work the estate rifle is always available.,

 

[Lancaster]

Why not bring your own rifle and give it a go first?
If it doesn’t work the estate rifle is always available.,

I was just about to suggest the same.

 

[wildfowler.250]

Why not bring your own rifle and give it a go first?
If it doesn’t work the estate rifle is always available.,

I was just about to suggest the same.

It had crossed my mind but I was worried it was a bit unprofessional to be honest. I can maybe give a few shots a trial on the weekend before hand if time allows. I’m sure the estate rifle will be grand though!


Out of interest, are many estates going this way now? Stalked the Hebrides last year an lead wasn’t a problem with their gamedealer

 

[wildfowler.250]

sorry to burst that bubble but the winchester in the silvery white boxes aint expanding . been a problem on an estate i visit and i saw the easte stalker hit a fair stag in behind the shoulder , a perfectly hit stag bleeding out but slowly . it wasnt the only one they had had like that

This is why all feedback is appreciated. Nice to hear field reports.

 

[Lancaster]

It had crossed my mind but I was worried it was a bit unprofessional to be honest. I can maybe give a few shots a trial on the weekend before hand if time allows. I’m sure the estate rifle will be grand though!


Out of interest, are many estates going this way now? Stalked the Hebrides last year an lead wasn’t a problem with their gamedealer

If the estate sells carcases to a dealer that is a member of the NGDA most likely it will have had to be shot with lead free.
I reckon the future is now clear, so instead of buying factory LFA I suggest that you buy some lead free bullets and start working up a new load, you may be pleasantly surprised by the results both on paper and on something with a pulse.

 

[User00040]

If the estate sells carcases to a dealer that is a member of the NGDA most likely it will have had to be shot with lead free.
I reckon the future is now clear, so instead of buying factory LFA I suggest that you buy some lead free bullets and start working up a new load, you may be pleasantly surprised by the results both on paper and on something with a pulse.

Some estates have a factory ammo only policy.

After reading some posts on here and Facebook, I'd be inclined to implement the same rule for first time visitors.

 

[wildfowler.250]

If the estate sells carcases to a dealer that is a member of the NGDA most likely it will have had to be shot with lead free.
I reckon the future is now clear, so instead of buying factory LFA I suggest that you buy some lead free bullets and start working up a new load, you may be pleasantly surprised by the results both on paper and on something with a pulse.

Fair enough and at the end of the day, it’s their rules that go. I’m not sure if we are being proactive with the non toxic stalking or just jumping on the bandwagon. I switched to steel for wildfowling as soon as it became a legal requirement and with a bit of fine tuning, now notice no difference,(drop a couple of shot sizes and up the weight of shell a bit). I’m sure copper will work just fine. I just tend to shoot for personal consumption so this is the first time I’ve found the lead use an issue.

Some estates have a factory ammo only policy.

After reading some posts on here and Facebook, I'd be inclined to implement the same rule for first time visitors.

I can understand that. That’s getting very nanny state though. But at the same time, with all the health and safety they must go through I’m not surprised!

 

[Dunwaters]

The ban on hand loads has been around for a while on some estates, the non lead bullets condition only is newer but I suspect it’s going to become standard pretty fast.
My advice ( probably a bit late now ) would be to have a standby proven factory load available “ just in case”.

 

[Heym SR20]

I would speak with the estate concerned and check with them. Pick up a box of S&B. Chances are you will be able to check zero night before, abd chances are that it will be pretty close to your current zero. Three or four shots should be sufficient. Sight it 1 and bit inches high and don’t worry about drops till well past 200.

If it all hoes wrong use the estate rifke, but check that its available and that the stalker is bringing it with him.

 

[wildfowler.250]

The ban on hand loads has been around for a while on some estates, the non lead bullets condition only is newer but I suspect it’s going to become standard pretty fast.
My advice ( probably a bit late now ) would be to have a standby proven factory load available “ just in case”.

I think this is sensible. I don’t do many paid days away, maybe one or two a year. But it looks like it’s going to be handy to have a known back up non tox load.

I would speak with the estate concerned and check with them. Pick up a box of S&B. Chances are you will be able to check zero night before, abd chances are that it will be pretty close to your current zero. Three or four shots should be sufficient. Sight it 1 and bit inches high and don’t worry about drops till well past 200.

If it all hoes wrong use the estate rifke, but check that its available and that the stalker is bringing it with him.

True, I’ll not be any more familiar with the estate rifle drops anyway. And sub 200 you’re right, it’s point and shoot.

I think it’s worthwhile finding a backup for future ref anyway. S&B seems popular in this thread which is a brand I’ve never tried before so glad to know a few folk on here recommend them.


Cheers again for all the feedback!

 

[jall55]

We tried some SandB in a creedmore - after 2 boxes gave up
Back to lead and back to within inch
The copper ones were literally all over with the odd one not even hitting the paper - most odd

 

[Dunwaters]

Rather than change loads depending on where and what I’m shooting I’ve settled on one single does it all game load in both my rifles.
For paper punching the game loads are a bit spendy so if that’s on the menu I use cheaper stuff and re-zero before and after.

 

[DavyG]

I think this is sensible. I don’t do many paid days away, maybe one or two a year. But it looks like it’s going to be handy to have a known back up non tox load.



True, I’ll not be any more familiar with the estate rifle drops anyway. And sub 200 you’re right, it’s point and shoot.

I think it’s worthwhile finding a backup for future ref anyway. S&B seems popular in this thread which is a brand I’ve never tried before so glad to know a few folk on here recommend them.
L

Cheers again for all the feedback!

Not sure what breed your rifle is but I gather it’s a .270.
I’ve done some copper bullet testing in both Sako & Tikka .270’s. I found that factory Federal vital shok which uses a 130gr Barnes TSX bullet performed exceptionally well on the range.
I did try it out in the field and the results were acceptable.
Hope this helps in your quest.
DG

 

[Ranger22]

Winchester extreme, cheap. It does the job but blows great big holes in whatever it hits. I’ve used it in my 270 for Roe, Sika and Red.

 

[wildfowler.250]

We tried some SandB in a creedmore - after 2 boxes gave up
Back to lead and back to within inch
The copper ones were literally all over with the odd one not even hitting the paper - most odd

It’s funny, definitely a trend on here that several folk love one brand and others hate it. Good to get real feedback though!

Rather than change loads depending on where and what I’m shooting I’ve settled on one single does it all game load in both my rifles.
For paper punching the game loads are a bit spendy so if that’s on the menu I use cheaper stuff and re-zero before and after.

I think ultimately one load makes sense, I’ve enough lead to keep me going for the short term and we’ll see how the non toxic legislation pans out.. Frankly I’d be happy if lead stuck but I think the retail / meat market says otherwise.

Not sure what breed your rifle is but I gather it’s a .270.
I’ve done some copper bullet testing in both Sako & Tikka .270’s. I found that factory Federal vital shok which uses a 130gr Barnes TSX bullet performed exceptionally well on the range.
I did try it out in the field and the results were acceptable.
Hope this helps in your quest.
DG

.270 sir. Very helpful. Barney’s TSX certainly seems to be one of the mainstays for non lead. Thanks!

Winchester extreme, cheap. It does the job but blows great big holes in whatever it hits. I’ve used it in my 270 for Roe, Sika and Red.

Handy to know! There’s been several pro Winchester posts and then one negative about slow kills which is rather off putting

 

[The Farmer]

Have you mentioned what your rifle is? That would be first thing I added to be helpful as someone with same rifle can save you a lot of money testing ammunition and just tell you what brand of copper it shoots well