PACKHAM SEEKS A TRUCE

We'll agree to differ on that one! There are some things that BASC are very good at that goes on behind the scenes without necessarily much in the way of publicity, on the other hand they do need to consult with the membership and most importantly get their consent before policy changes. The great thing is that being a BASC member is entirely voluntary so I'm not sure why non-members are complaining so much about them?
As a member of BASC, it takes little imagination to work out that the reason people who aren't members complain about BASC's (in)activities is that they have assigned to themselves the status of "the voice of shooting", presuming to speak on behalf of the large majority of shooters who aren't members of BASC. They then promote themselves to the media and various arms of government as the best representative of shooters.

Recently, matters haven't been helped by a tendency of some BASC staff to publicly berate shooters who disagree with their more controversial opinions - although these usually have the tone of having been written by those staff "having taken drink".
 
It has always and will always be true that those who love shooting (I class myself as one amongst many) will always work towards the continuation and improvement of what they do. In my case its putting a bit back into the environment I have enjoyed whilst out. The farmer 400yds away has been putting grey partridge down for 20 odd years there are a number about and he has a fair area of cover crops which have spin - off benefits. His friend also conserves the environment of 30% of his farm for wildlife. They jointly shoot a few pheasants, no partridge, and host a few friends in doing so. He has swathes of cowlslips and primroses he protects, as do I, insecticides are not used anywhere.

So, it can be particularly disappointing when those you expect to know and feel the same as you, and are your 'voice' as much as their members (The Voice of Shooting), waste resources, do not openly consult, care little for those who leave and their opinion, preferring to accumulate more members, make a series of mistakes and finally, after having said they never ever would, without proof, voluntarily remove the most effective ammunition and instantly remove value from guns and traduce the most important maxim, "first last and always, a clean kill" actually do it.
Medicals and so on, add costs to a sport where those with little money have also had and should retain an important stake.
Anyone who does this and sees no fault in doing so, isn't doing anything but ending shooting by a thousand cuts. Members who, without thought, renew, perpetuate a failing voice, certainly in my eyes and experience. I would simply advocate a thorough assessment of what Members do on renewal because the organisation that represents them is failing all of us and over quite a period of time, lost ground is never recovered.
This can be proved and you should perhaps acknowledge that and do what you want but please don't try and rub noses in it.
 
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Whether we like the guy or not, Birdwatchers Conservationists & Shooters should have lots of common ground, & a coming together would be beneficial to all, it would also improve conditions in the UK. Surely what we all want to see is a biodiverse & species rich countryside, management is the key to this, as the RSPCA have found out, most apex predators are not limited by their prey species, unless they are specialists like the Sparrowhawk, & a country side with no Sparrowhawks would have no small birds in it. Chris Packham doesn't seem to understand this, & as such he is not a conservationist, he is an activist. How could I trust a man who wants to stop me controlling pigeons & magpies on my farm, but we do need to come together. United we stand, divided we fall.
 
Is anything stopping any of the other uk organisations actively approaching the appropriate government bodies to get a change to subjects such as medical/licence issues, 10year certs etc. etc...
As I see it nothing seems to be stopping them representing THEIR MEMBERS on these topics..
Or am I wrong ?
I've said it till I'm blue in the face, in my book standing still is as bad going backwards, we need to move forwards not dig our heads in the sand...
Sorry a tad away from the title post.. But sick of all the other organisations sitting with fingers in ears and getting championed for it..
 
Is anything stopping any of the other uk organisations actively approaching the appropriate government bodies to get a change to subjects such as medical/licence issues, 10year certs etc. etc...
As I see it nothing seems to be stopping them representing THEIR MEMBERS on these topics..
Or am I wrong ?
I've said it till I'm blue in the face, in my book standing still is as bad going backwards, we need to move forwards not dig our heads in the sand...
Sorry a tad away from the title post.. But sick of all the other organisations sitting with fingers in ears and getting championed for it..
The only championing I have done is a couple of issues the CA's Tim Bonner was necessarily outspoken about, the action taken by the NGO over NE's failure to approve a buzzard cull which they won. If e.g. BASC were a little more humble about what they have achieved - well you know my feelings. I am however very fairly contemptuous of all of them in the manner in which we were betrayed over lead and, in fairness, none of the org's other than BASC said, " no Sound Evidence - No Change" following Swifts betrayal of everyone. He's still there Chairing their conservation trust, is that right ?
 
Generally people seek a truce if they are trying to con you or they perceive their position is weakening.

I don't think Packham's position is weakening ergo.........
 
The only championing I have done is a couple of issues the CA's Tim Bonner was necessarily outspoken about, the action taken by the NGO over NE's failure to approve a buzzard cull which they won. If e.g. BASC were a little more humble about what they have achieved - well you know my feelings. I am however very fairly contemptuous of all of them in the manner in which we were betrayed over lead and, in fairness, none of the org's other than BASC said, " no Sound Evidence - No Change" following Swifts betrayal of everyone. He's still there Chairing their conservation trust, is that right ?
Fair dos....
What's stopping the others going for it Kes? Surely if one of the other organisations had a gram of common they'd be thinking...

Oh hang on a minute, if we get our fingers out here we can gain some serious membership numbers..

But nar don't seem to be that way, more of a keep ya heads down lads and let them take the flack..
 
Fair dos....
What's stopping the others going for it Kes? Surely if one of the other organisations had a gram of common they'd be thinking...

Oh hang on a minute, if we get our fingers out here we can gain some serious membership numbers..,

But nar don't seem to be that way, more of a keep ya heads down lads and let them take the flack..
Quite simply I dont know.
Given they all conspired on lead (rather than consulted) why dont we see the same level of effort here ? The benefits to wildlife could be huge and the damage to CP et al, unrecoverable.
I hope BASC or CA/NGO/GWCT/etc are on the phone as we speak. How many 'Conservations' in their names does it take to make this happen ?
 
Sadly, I think it would take a large proportion of the shooting community (580,000+) to join the RSPB, take the financial hit as part of a pheasant day and then start voting to get the results we would want to see.

The protection of birds, not all birds at all times. Pheasant are a crop. Do they get involved with chicken farmers?
 
If this is correct then I think he is using it to his advantage, he knows that no one will trust him then he can say that the shooting fraternity are the ones that won't come to the table and work together on common a ground of cooperation. I guarantee there will be a "well I wanted to work together and they won't" comment coming....
 
We'll agree to differ on that one! There are some things that BASC are very good at that goes on behind the scenes without necessarily much in the way of publicity, on the other hand they do need to consult with the membership and most importantly get their consent before policy changes. The great thing is that being a BASC member is entirely voluntary so I'm not sure why non-members are complaining so much about them?

Because non members and ex members are affected by BASC capitulation just the same as current members.
 
It's hard to fathom CP out, and I have come to the conclusion that his rantings are done for a purpose, and I don't think it's anything to do with Birds or animals, he is more out to impress people, and obviously one way to do this, like so many other Z Listers, is to come out with dubious remarks that get people listening, a bit like these people who have a book coming out, get people interested by giving them a taster etc, it's all good for business, especially if you can get people emotionally involved, and of course once you start on this path, it's very hard to come off it, and remember this is the man who said he would rather eat the last Panda than waste money trying to save it from extinction, and he realises he has dropped a few clangers on the way, that has lost him credibility, so I think he is now on the path to try and correct these clangers..

Now when you think about it, CP in my opinion sees himself as the successor to Attenborough at the BBC, now the one thing that would have stopped him, is if he was against hunting, herd management, etc because Attenborough and his worldwide jaunts, on many occasions has used hunters and trackers to help him get the films he needed., and I think Attenborough seen the importance of culling to strengthen the herd, etc.
Look at the people CP has been associated with as of late, Mrs Clown at No.10. Prince Charles, and various other Organisations, anything to stay in the news, a bit like others, they always have to be noticed, and lets face it if he ends up in a position such as Attenborough holds, well all I can say is the end is nigh,
I think colluding with him will just make him stronger, and that's the last thing you need.
 
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