Permissions - The Ongoing Struggle

I’m sure there are members on here with thousands upon thousands of acres of permission to shoot on. I am also sure there are members on here with very small shooting permissions.

Now my question to you all is - How?

I’ve really been struggling recently to find any permissions for any type of shooting. With most replies (if I get any reply at all) being “we already have somone” or the more prevalent one being “we have an old guy that’s been doing it for years, he never really comes but we don’t want to tell him to leave and upset him”

I’m all for everyone having a bit of ground to shoot on - However, it seems to be that a lot of ground, around me at least is taken up by “old boots” for lack of a better phrase.

I always offer to shoot vermin and never ask for permission to shoot deer straight away. But even this is a struggle.

I have over 15 years shooting experience, over 10 years of experience in the military and police (firearms), fully insured and DSC1. I have tried door knocking, calls, emails, letters, business cards, even Facebook adds.

How does everyone do it? For context I live close to High Wycombe

 

[VSS]

A combination of patience and chance encounters.
(Or buy a farm).

 

[GGC96]

Patience.
Or buy a farm.

I’ve been trying for the last 3 years and I keep playing the euro millions with no luck

 

[KimE]

Try northern Sweden, roedeer and small game lease in my area are at ~£ 95/year (20000acres). A day lease are about 20-30£. For 200000£ can you buy a small farm.

 

[Cottis]

How integrated are you in a rural community?

The old saying "it's not what you know, it's who you know" is very relevant in my opinion when it comes to having permission to use firearms on the land of someone.

Ask yourself the question "if I owned land, would I let a stranger shoot firearms on my land?" My family have a farm. Believe me, the answer, unless you are known well to them, is an immediate no.

I don't belive it has much to do with someone currently shooting on there per se although that would make it less likely. There is a widespread belief that farmers suffer constant issues with pests. This is not the case all of the time and although many think they are doing landowners a massive service, the facts are that this is not always the case and they view other people on their land as a potential burden, problem or a source of trouble, that when offset against the questionable/seasonal benefits of their presence, is simply not worth the risk.

So back to the original question, how integrated are you in the local rural community? That is really where and how you will enjoy the most consistent success in realising a situation(s) where you are allowed to use firearms on another person's land. It can often have nothing to do with shooting. I have helped people out finding lost machinery items with a metal detector or even used a metal detector and given all the items (some worth large sums of money) to the owner so they can create and grow a presentation collection for a potted history of land use on their grounds. Or helping horse owners find a new shod but thrown shoe. Other ways of integrating can include but not be limited to helping with work, bringing awareness to loose stock or reporting other beneficial bits of info. It is about doing whatever to broker conversation and relationships. That is how you exchange utility in most walks of life. Then as you become ingrained in the locality, work and other opportunities find you organically. It was ever thus.

There are other ways. I have found opportunities by fishing for example. You get to know the fishery owner and it becomes apparent they have a pest issue. I once had a fishery owner bring me his own air gun as I had said there were a couple of rats running around his bins by the lake and that I wish I had my gun with me. He went and got his and left it with me for hours on end with a handful of pellets. I shot a few and every one was happy. I had however fished his place for a couple of years and had always taken the time to talk to him and ask about his life. Some might not like this but he did. I miss Rob, old boy is dead now but I still see his brother about. They are shooting men and he is one hell of a hedge layer. I don't ask as I have no need for it but I suspect they would immediately grant me access on their land to shoot what I wanted if i asked.

Hopefully some thoughts for you but it is not an easy or instant thing. It can be if you are lucky but I have never knocked on a door. I have never approached someone in an unsolicited manner. I would find that rude and presumptious and it would be put me on guard. That will not be the case for all but i suspect it would for most.

Last idea I hadn't considered, I have a friend who has a pest control business. He is always seeing opportunities on his rounds when doing the more mundane aspects of his work. He has definitely picked up some interesting shooting. Some has not been worth it but others have been really good.

In a nutshell, things like this are always about putting yourself out there indirectly and opportunities find you organically. My guess is that the vast overwhelming majority of people who have permission to shoot somewhere, did not gain that permission by randomly asking a stranger. They know someone, or have made it their business to broker relationships or maybe they pay for access.

 

[Tim.243]

View attachment 382318

I’m sure there are members on here with thousands upon thousands of acres of permission to shoot on. I am also sure there are members on here with very small shooting permissions.

Now my question to you all is - How?

I’ve really been struggling recently to find any permissions for any type of shooting. With most replies (if I get any reply at all) being “we already have somone” or the more prevalent one being “we have an old guy that’s been doing it for years, he never really comes but we don’t want to tell him to leave and upset him”

I’m all for everyone having a bit of ground to shoot on - However, it seems to be that a lot of ground, around me at least is taken up by “old boots” for lack of a better phrase.

I always offer to shoot vermin and never ask for permission to shoot deer straight away. But even this is a struggle.

I have over 15 years shooting experience, over 10 years of experience in the military and police (firearms), fully insured and DSC1. I have tried door knocking, calls, emails, letters, business cards, even Facebook adds.

How does everyone do it? For context I live close to High Wycombe

I built mine up from foxing and pigeons so would watch the fields being drilled and go have a look as they park the trailer with the bags in the gate way, rape is first to go in (some all ready drill and on it's way up) down the road.
Direct drill rape on to stubble means their is the old corn on top with the crop in the ground...

We watch fields when it is due a break crop and if it comes wet then the farms will spin it on top then plough it in..

Watch the fields is key not dropping cards as that is where you need to be not on Facebook.

If you are going to talk to a farmer then you need to know what crop is what and if you don't it will show.

 

[nf-fuse]

I think it's really hard to get permission if you just ask someone out of the blue unless it just by chance is when they are having problems with pests.

The only two permissions I've managed to get are from my opposite neighbour (I have a small Holding). Both are cracking revisions places. Trouble is all my eggs in one basket.

 

[bottletopbill]

You have to wait like the rest of us and lets face the old guy's are able to go out a lot more times per week.

Respect they may pass it on one day to someone they know
But lets not back stab some one to get a perm lots of the old guy's mentor us newbies even us newbies at 67yrs

 

[Stalker62]

Now my question to you all is - How?

What Shoots do you Beat on?

How many Farmers do you know?

How many Gamekeepers do you know?

How far are you willing to travel?

For how many years have you 'helped out' on a local farm/shoot/smallholding?





How many winter's evenings/weekends have you given up, to help build Pens, clear trees, erect fences?

How many years have you spent building up your reputation, to those in a position to help you?

I do not decry your previous Service (I happen to mirror it)...



...but it counts for nought in this game.



How important is your family life?





Worth the sacrifice?

As for 'knocking on doors' (in whatever format), I fear the response will invariable be the same...






Or you could try and 'buy' your way in.

How deep are your pockets?





Time. Trust. Relationships.

 

[B&W FOX]

The problem you have with Wycombe is that Lord Dashwood owns most of the land and they run a very large commercial shoot on the estate, along with EJ Churchill shooting ground.
The National Trust, and Forestry Commission also manage large blocks in the area.
So you may have to look slightly further afield.

 

[Flash G 74]

Hello, You could look for some beating on a game shoot which may lead to some Vermin control

 

[jall55]

Hello, You could look for some beating on a game shoot which may lead to some Vermin control

And beaters days perhaps

 

[Dave_45]

Time
Trust

Eating a lot of sh*t from older shooters

Passing numerous trust based tests
Patience

Think ,would you like it done to you?

If you buy into a place , someone always has more money than you.

 

[KimE]

Young persons under 25y can in our village become a member of the moose hunting team for 0,08£/year.

 

[Jh1986]

Spent a fair while knocking until I just happened to catch a leaseholder mucking out her horses, who had rats under her chickens.

The rats eventually fell through as the actual landowner didn't want it that close to to the horses, but that landowner pointed me to the next landowner.

Only 50 acres but that landowner hadn't seen his existing stalker for nearly a year, and that existing stalker had only shot one deer in the time he was there. Pure luck.

Smallholdings are definitely the easier to get chatting to.

 

[Eddie P]

My last patch was from a student at work, he used to shoot loads of deer and fox, but didn't have his guns at uni.
A farm he'd been working at as a part time job offered him the stalking, and we both go together now, because I've got the guns. All started from a chance conversation.

My other patch was because I knew the farmer's daughter from a voluntary group I was in.

 

[Tim.243]

What Shoots do you Beat on?

How many Farmers do you know?

How many Gamekeepers do you know?

How far are you willing to travel?

For how many years have you 'helped out' on a local farm/shoot/smallholding?

View attachment 382331



How many winter's evenings/weekends have you given up, to help build Pens, clear trees, erect fences?

How many years have you spent building up your reputation, to those in a position to help you?

I do not decry your previous Service (I happen to mirror it)...

View attachment 382333

...but it counts for nought in this game.



How important is your family life?

View attachment 382332



Worth the sacrifice?

As for 'knocking on doors' (in whatever format), I fear the response will invariable be the same...


View attachment 382334



Or you could try and 'buy' your way in.

How deep are your pockets?


View attachment 382330


Time. Trust. Relationships.

The other side of the fence is can you do it?
Permission Requirements for Hill Farm
1 Shoot Foxes
2 Have Kit to Shoot foxes
3 Hand back perm letter if you can't

 

[mudman]

Deer permissions.

First one I helped a keeper out of season as I am lucky enough to get lots of time off with my job. The keeper had the deer (venison money) as a perk, and his hands were knackered with arthritis so he struggled to work a rifle, so I offered to help….wasnt an instant yes, but he me asked to (try to) shoot the occasional deer which were causing trouble in particular places.

Friend in my wildfowling club was in a syndicate in Scotland, a couple of people had dropped out so he asked me if I wanted to join. It was sub let forestry syndicate with very few deer on the ground, and anyway the lease holder lost it on the next renewal. But the person who lived off the approach track to the forest, and who we always spoke to on our way to / from said he had a good friend who owned an estate nearby. And by chance his friend was looking for some one to control the deer….so we as a small syndicate got our own ground..which was a far better place held lots of deer on a mix of woodland, commercial forestry, moorland and fields.

Someone I worked with on the rigs, he shot reds as part of a forestry syndicate in central Scotland, so we often had chats about stalking etc. about two years after I last saw him he messaged me out of the blue, a space was available and was I interested….

Another completely unexpected phone call from an aquaintance of an aquaintance…he was looking for someone to join his stalking syndicate on a very big local estate…..

I was trying to open up a draw for a pack of mink hounds on a local river, lots of landowners to cold call. Didn’t really get anywhere, or at least open up enough of the water. But having a good chat with one lady farmer who owned land next to the river and somehow got onto the subject of deer, she had too many and could I thin a few out?

Finally, loading on an pheasant shoot another loader I was talking to said he was having trouble with deer knocking over his pheasant feeders on his farm, and his stalker had ‘retired’ a couple of years previously, but I didn’t manage to speak to him about it before he left at the end of the shoot day. He wasn’t a regular so I had to make several phone calls before I was able track him down again and talk to him about the problem…This is my best place, only small but sandwiched between two big unstalked estates.

Of these listed I only shoot on a couple now for one reason or another, the local estate syndicate and the final one.

 

[Liveonce]

I feel you pain, i have a few permissions for using rifles and a few more that only allow shotguns.
What gets me is you talk to others, acquaintances say at a clay ground who boast about having lots of ground to shoot over then say too much to get out on regularly. So you offer to help and they immediately come up with an excuse for not accepting your help.

Then passing a crop being hammered by pigeons so phone the farmer to let them know and offer to shoot immediately to protect the crop to get told, already have someone, well they are not here now or doing a very good job are they.
I will phone them. Then you drive by the next day and no different a large number of pigeons still feeding on the crop.
Such is life

 

[bottletopbill]

As you know most places in Kent have folks on there land shooting.
So we all have to wait for a luck to come along and you may get on some places but as i was given the parts the birds seem to miss.
And you are only there to cover that part. But it is a perm so be grateful and it might grow