Yes indeed I do. Had I known that I was being helpful, I wouldn't have replied.Being that helpful you must work for BASC..
My position may well be in jeopardy now.Regards,
DG
Sako 85 vs 75
- Thread starter wildfowler.250
- Start date
My position may well be in jeopardy now.Regards,
DG
Having owned an 85 in .308 and shot a few in differing calibres I also have never experienced this cartridge bouncing off the scope rumour. Never used a 75 - would like to given the cult status - so I couldn't put an argument across in favour of one or another.
I only got rid of the 85 as it was laminate and a good bit heavier than I'd like.
Being that helpful you must work for BASC..
I did apply for a job there once. I was asked to bring my birth certificate along to the initial interview. When the HR manager noticed that my father's details were listed on it, I was told that i wasn't suitable for the post.
Strange......
DG
8x57
Distinguished Member
Like palmer_mike I've never had an issue other than of my own making with my .308win model 85 which I've had for about 13 years either. I've shot both the 75 and 85 and haven't noticed any significant differences between the models.
I have heard however of several issues with quality control on the 85 in the past mostly relating to assembly and inspection. Some of those reports may be suspect, but one reliable report about a 85 stainless that was used by a forestry ranger and that was returned to GMK after only 1500 rounds with a worn out barrel comes from a totally reliable source. Personally I would definitely buy another one.
devon deer stalker
Well-Known Member
I have no experience of a Sako 85, but I have had trouble free shooting with my .243 Sako 75 and I have never heard a bad word said about the Sako 75, but I have been made aware some people have had issues with the 85.
I guess the Sako 75 is becoming a bit legendary, akin to the Sage XP fly rod, would you agree @dartmoordog ?
Cheers
Richard
I guess the Sako 75 is becoming a bit legendary, akin to the Sage XP fly rod, would you agree @dartmoordog ?
Cheers
Richard
There is a huge difference in the bedding between the 75 and the 85.
Very simply, the 75 has a traditional recoil lug machined into the receiver (though it is a funny shape). The 85 does not. It has a weird little floating L shaped plate that engages with the boss of one of the action screw holes. It does have a slot machines into the underside of the receiver, as if they intended to use a design similar to the T3, but then decided not to.
This arrangement can be unstable, and can give rise to chronic and incurable accuracy problems.
Very simply, the 75 has a traditional recoil lug machined into the receiver (though it is a funny shape). The 85 does not. It has a weird little floating L shaped plate that engages with the boss of one of the action screw holes. It does have a slot machines into the underside of the receiver, as if they intended to use a design similar to the T3, but then decided not to.
This arrangement can be unstable, and can give rise to chronic and incurable accuracy problems.
Sako 75 recoil lug:
Sako 85 recoil 'lug':
The 85 recoil lug appears to cause a number of problems. The most common is the 'tuning fork' effect that Edi mentioned: it vibrates between the stock and the receiver, leading to double or triple grouping, with an overall group size of upwards of 6" at 100m.
It's important to note that this is not a universal problem, and it even when it ocurrs, it can still produce tolerable stalking groups (1.5 to 2" at 100). But it is a real problem, and well documented. It was the main reason I never got one.
Sako 85 recoil 'lug':
The 85 recoil lug appears to cause a number of problems. The most common is the 'tuning fork' effect that Edi mentioned: it vibrates between the stock and the receiver, leading to double or triple grouping, with an overall group size of upwards of 6" at 100m.
It's important to note that this is not a universal problem, and it even when it ocurrs, it can still produce tolerable stalking groups (1.5 to 2" at 100). But it is a real problem, and well documented. It was the main reason I never got one.
I. Farticus
Well-Known Member
The biggest difference is if you lose a magazine
Norfolk Horn
Well-Known Member
Thanks for putting those two pictures up, as they say a picture is worth a thousand words
I have both a 75 & an 85. Externally there's not a lot of difference other than the catch on the magazine. The 75 does seem to be a bit more solidly built but the difference is marginal in use. Both are fine rifles.
On the 85, there are two types of front bedding block. One for the plastic stock & another for the wooden & laminate options. It is necessary to buy the wooden style block if you want to put an aftermarket laminate stock (eg KKC) onto a rifle that has a synthetic one.
Any new rifle that won't shoot smaller groups than 6" at 100 yards should be returned to the manufacturer as unfit for purpose. If there are problems with a used rifle with the alleged tuning fork problems it can be bedded to make it a tack driver.
Neither of my rifles are bedded & they shoot tight groups.
Ian
On the 85, there are two types of front bedding block. One for the plastic stock & another for the wooden & laminate options. It is necessary to buy the wooden style block if you want to put an aftermarket laminate stock (eg KKC) onto a rifle that has a synthetic one.
Any new rifle that won't shoot smaller groups than 6" at 100 yards should be returned to the manufacturer as unfit for purpose. If there are problems with a used rifle with the alleged tuning fork problems it can be bedded to make it a tack driver.
Neither of my rifles are bedded & they shoot tight groups.
Ian
Sako 85 epoxy bedded with a T3 recoil lug instead of the L shaped piece.
edi
Which really makes you wonder why they didn’t just go with this from the start, given that the slot is there in the receiver!
It is an odd rifle overall. The pseudo control feed is another weird one: not real Mauser-style, but just a slot cut in the bolt face.
I think it is because they needed to make it different to the T3 for the class branding. It was the same with the stocks. The first 85's had a straight classic stock, a departure from the more characteristic SAKO monte carlo offering. I quite liked it, however it wasn't long before a small monte carlo appeared on later models, again maybe because the stock shape resembled a T3 too much? The classic stock reappeared again later in the 85 classic model.
I've had two 75s and still have an 85. Overall I prefer the 85 but there's very little in it.
The 85 does have an unusual bedding arrangement, but I've had no problems. The synthetic stocks use a detachable L shape lug, as shown above, which is the same as the Tikka 59x and 69x series which are well regarded. The bedding on the 85 wooden stocks is very Heath Robinson and I bet they were the source of the reported 85 bedding issues.
My 85 is an M action 6.5x55, and ejected cases do not get dinged into the scope, which is on Sako extra low ringmounts.
The 85 does have an unusual bedding arrangement, but I've had no problems. The synthetic stocks use a detachable L shape lug, as shown above, which is the same as the Tikka 59x and 69x series which are well regarded. The bedding on the 85 wooden stocks is very Heath Robinson and I bet they were the source of the reported 85 bedding issues.
My 85 is an M action 6.5x55, and ejected cases do not get dinged into the scope, which is on Sako extra low ringmounts.
No myth. Too many of us have same experience. My 85 in 30.06 during normal bolt cycling would always throw spent case in a near vertical ejection arc that always struck the tiny Zeiss Duralyt windage turret. One in five ejections would fail to clear the rifle with the case settling in the action on top of the magazine. Others have experienced same. Even a cursory search on YT will find video evidence.
The primary reason why the 85 ejects more vertically is because the case ram rides in a slot machined between the lower two lugs in the 6 o'clock position. Sideways ejection is better garanteed by the ram being placed at an 8 o'clock position opposite the ejection port.
Why some 85s are worse than other? I have a theory based on observations of my rifle: when the spent case is being extracted, the case mouth hangs lower than the head and trails along the top of the magazine. I.e. the claw does not mate the case head to the bolt face but rather allows it to hang off it. That is because the boltface to claw distance far exceeds the width of the case rim. The net effect is that the case hangs off the bolt like a fag from Bogart's lip. As the bolt is drawn back the ejection ram strikes the case at 6 o'clock and thus causes the case to pivot about the only point of contact the claw is making which is close to 1 o'clock.
The net effect is that as the bolt is pulled backwards, the case first rises in a near vertical arc. A very short time later in the bolt retraction cycle, once the case is passes through the same axis as the bolt, the case rim also engages the lower part of the extraction claw. At this point, the sum of the reaction from the totality of the claw face is to try and throw the case more sideways.
Whether your 85 has a penchant for ejection that looks more like a moon shot than a frisbee chuck probably hinges on how loosely the case is held by the claw. I.e. how much vertical momentum is imparted before the sideways effect commences.
wildfowler.250
Well-Known Member
Thanks guys, very informative! Far more info in this than the usual ‘cult’ 75 is better than the 85 posts you see!
The S20 looks interesting but the stock looks very ‘plasticy’.The 75 stainless stock I have had a much more blue/rubber appearance than hard black plastic. I keep seeing that sako have an announcement on the 23/03 but no ideas if it’s as exciting as a mother product announcement or not..
The S20 looks interesting but the stock looks very ‘plasticy’.The 75 stainless stock I have had a much more blue/rubber appearance than hard black plastic. I keep seeing that sako have an announcement on the 23/03 but no ideas if it’s as exciting as a mother product announcement or not..
And there you go - this problem created by the half assed attempt to turn the Sako 75 bolt into a controlled feed by cutting a slot in it, thereby allowing the round to dangle as illustrated.
Are they stopping production of the 85 now that the S20 has arrived?
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