Sell them, sell them now or better still destroy it!

[zambezi]

UK and EU...they want to spend unlimited resources on trashing their economies and making their populations poorer as well.

Spoken in jest, but it is the only explanation that fits the data.

So...why would that be the case? If we are made poorer, we become less independent. We become more governable.

The NetZero construct could deliver that new political paradigm if all leaders maintain their spirit of dialogue in pursuit of that outcome.

 

[Apthorpe]

Isn't it over 2 trillion per year and in one period of this year it was over 1 trillion in 71 days.
I thought I read the interest payments were set to exceed 1 trillion a year.

Europe managed over a trillion in just one quarter last year.
Europe's in the same boat as the US, but with no engine, no charts.

 

[Apthorpe]

Better start saving your pennies now then.

Utterly futile. Much better to just elect a party which isn't part of this monumental idiocy.

Renewable power hasn't provided the environmental effect it promised, it hasn't provided the power it promised, nor the prices promised, nor created the jobs it promised. Time to alter the plan and return to a morally defensible model of governance.

 

[Spear Chucker]

I can't think why anyone would put their family in a vehicle that the emergency services are forbidden to touch (i.e. not cut you out of the wreckage or administer first aid) following a crash. Just doesn't seem sensible somehow.

 

[countrryboy]

It looks like there will be at least twice as many wind turbines as there are now within the next few years. Older turbines are upgraded to give them a longer life and improved efficiency. I'm not sure if the government can achieve their goal of being 100% renewable ever, let alone 2030 as there will always be problems with dunkelflaute (love that word but not what it means) and solar panels don't give much in winter. They will also have to invest in storage of some sort for those dark dead days.

Cheers.
Funny i always remeber that argument from the antis.
Possibly it was entirely made up?
I assume Norway and Sweeden will both have similar policies on wind turbines?
Possibly i have mistaken which country it was, was a lot of debate about them way back then.

I dont mind them really.
I just wish the numbers behind it all were more honest.

The locals are up in arms about a new proposed battery storage site.
16ha only 1/2 mile from town centre.
In their infinite wisdom building it on the nice flat bit of land beside the river.
The fcuking flood plain!!!
U cannae make it up.
Must admit it will be an eyesore.
And ZERO local jobs.

I do think they need a far more realistic and sensible approach to power.
Esp if the Uk wants to be involved with all this new AI stuff, the power a big data centre takes is mental.
Just about need a wee power station just for it.

Is their a reason why solar panels cant be erected over supermarket carparks?
Or supermarket or factory roofs, make far more sense than agri land

But even electric cars and house solar panels u really need batteries the same size as ur car in ur house.
As charging a car at night is all coming off the grid.

Must admit im hoping to get my house completely off grid next year with a bit off luck
Still need to do some sums to work out voltage drops for the cables etc.
Im hoping get enough power from solar on the ground ( roof faces wrong direction) and rigging up a hilly billy hydro scheme for winter.
I dont use that much power, so dont need a lot of battery storage but again i wont save much money

 

[BryanDC]

Europe managed over a trillion in just one quarter last year.
Europe's in the same boat as the US, but with no engine, no charts.

Do you mean Europe as a whole or the EU

 

[Apthorpe]

Do you mean Europe as a whole or the EU

I dare say I meant what I wrote.

The EU of course is absolutely fine because it's mainly a eurozone and is a rule-based system and the rule is that debt can't exceed 60% of GDP and deficits can't exceed 3% of GDP.
The reality, that the most impirtant foundational rule underlying the euro-project is in tatters is no cause for alarm to europhile ostriches. Those aware of the astronomic and rising level of off-balance sheet liabilities in the EU, react by simply obfuscating them, so they are not reported collectively. They exceed 400% of GDP in several instances.
The reality of this is that the less irresponsible nations will have to fund this. Denmark is a notably well-run country economically, except for the single and critical error that they have bound themselves to a collection if badly run countries which have run up grossly unsustainable levels of debts which Denmark, inter alia, will have to pay up for.
Spain's liabilities exceed 600% of GDP andnonly Denmark's and Iceland's are under 100% of GDP. Dexit or ruin will surely follow.

 

[BryanDC]

I dare say I meant what I wrote.

The EU of course is absolutely fine because it's mainly a eurozone and is a rule-based system and the rule is that debt can't exceed 60% of GDP and deficits can't exceed 3% of GDP.
The reality, that the most impirtant foundational rule underlying the euro-project is in tatters is no cause for alarm to europhile ostriches. Those aware of the astronomic and rising level of off-balance sheet liabilities in the EU, react by simply obfuscating them, so they are not reported collectively. They exceed 400% of GDP in several instances.
The reality of this is that the less irresponsible nations will have to fund this. Denmark is a notably well-run country economically, except for the single and critical error that they have bound themselves to a collection if badly run countries which have run up grossly unsustainable levels of debts which Denmark, inter alia, will have to pay up for.
Spain's liabilities exceed 600% of GDP andnonly Denmark's and Iceland's are under 100% of GDP. Dexit or ruin will surely follow.

So you included all the Balkan states? Russia? UK?
Can you post your credible links to things like the 400% of gdp claim and spain's 600% of gdp and the claim that only Iceland and Denmark have a debt to gdp of under 100%.
Whilst there are some people that would like a Dexit as you put it. Recent polls suggest it is only between 8 and 14% that would like to leave. With over 60% saying they would like to remain.
Excluding being a part of the IMF, why exactly would Denmark have to fund eurozone debt? They didn't with Greece for example.

 

[Apthorpe]

So you included all the Balkan states? Russia? UK?
Can you post your credible links to things like the 400% of gdp claim and spain's 600% of gdp and the claim that only Iceland and Denmark have a debt to gdp of under 100%.

My source was Eurostat. It's a matter of opinion whether you find the EU's own statistics body credible.

Whilst there are some people that would like a Dexit as you put it. Recent polls suggest it is only between 8 and 14% that would like to leave. With over 60% saying they would like to remain.

I'm not in the least surprised by those numbers. Most people are extremely ill-informed. Separately, most people are also beneficiaries of the unsustainable, unfunded promises of euro-welfarism.

Excluding being a part of the IMF, why exactly would Denmark have to fund eurozone debt? They didn't with Greece for example.

1. Greece is a small economy and it was considered OK for the EU to depose its government (as it did in 8or 9 other cases). The rest of the EU is rather larger.
2. In the past 15 years, continued integration has changed the rules of the game.
3. At a purely practical level, what alternative do you have? You are part of the same entity - 90%+ of members/population will outvote you. Either you contribute to keep it alive, or it fails and you're shackled to a corpse.

 

[GlennUK]

It is possible to embrace the new tech and reduce your energy bills to virtually zero.
A pal has completed a single story barn conversion. It's super insulated, with underfloor heating, an air source heat pump, and panels on the roof space, triple glazed windows...
He is a clever bugger... a qualified electrician and plumber, with his own small renewables business, but he's achieved his goals, no domestic heating oil bills, no electricity bills,
And wait for it... the family run an EV for next to nothing as well

out of curiosity what was the cap ex to get zero bills? FWIW we spent best part of £50k for GSHP/Solar PV in 2018.

Solar paid for itself after 6-7years due in part to the rising cost of electrciity.

The GSHP which was the lions share of the cap ex will never pay for itself, despite the subsidies which wil return c.50% of the capex IIRC and when combined with the rising cost of electricity, is probably effectviely cost neutral over gas in terms of running costs.

 

[BryanDC]

My source was Eurostat. It's a matter of opinion whether you find the EU's own statistics body credible.

Can't find anything like those numbers in Eurostat. Do you have a specific link?

I'm not in the least surprised by those numbers. Most people are extremely ill-informed. Separately, most people are also beneficiaries of the unsustainable, unfunded promises of euro-welfarism.

Or quite well informed with their own opinions.

1. Greece is a small economy and it was considered OK for the EU to depose its government (as it did in 8or 9 other cases). The rest of the EU is rather larger.
2. In the past 15 years, continued integration has changed the rules of the game.
3. At a purely practical level, what alternative do you have? You are part of the same entity - 90%+ of members/population will outvote you. Either you contribute to keep it alive, or it fails and you're shackled to a corpse.

Well we are doing quite well. Inflation is coming down, interest rates are coming down, employment keeps going up, debt to GDP is tiny, spending more on defence, free education, a high level of care for the elderly, (not at the extortionate rates that people have to pay in the UK). A good (not perfect) healthcare system, roads you can drive on without losing you teeth, very little anti hunting activity, an effective hunting organisation with around 800 local hunting associations, affordable housing ( in most places), high salaries (also high tax rates), very limited poverty and homelessness, low crime rates, low levels of illegal immigration, good integration of immigrants, fantastic beaches.
I don't feel I need an alternative. Life is good.

 

[Bo Diddley]

out of curiosity what was the cap ex to get zero bills? FWIW we spent best part of £50k for GSHP/Solar PV in 2018.

Solar paid for itself after 6-7years due in part to the rising cost of electrciity.

The GSHP which was the lions share of the cap ex will never pay for itself, despite the subsidies which wil return c.50% of the capex IIRC and when combined with the rising cost of electricity, is probably effectviely cost neutral over gas in terms of running costs.

I'll ask Phil when he comes to do an electrical test on a rental for me in a couple of weeks.

 

[Freeforester]

France will be the next Bond crisis provider, and pose a far greater existential threat to the Eurozone than Greece ever did.



Air to air heating seems to be a rather more cost-effective (albeit unsubsidised) heating technology, in no small part unsupported because it can be run in reverse in summertime, as a cooling system.

 

[Apthorpe]

out of curiosity what was the cap ex to get zero bills? FWIW we spent best part of £50k for GSHP/Solar PV in 2018.

Solar paid for itself after 6-7years due in part to the rising cost of electrciity.

The GSHP which was the lions share of the cap ex will never pay for itself, despite the subsidies which wil return c.50% of the capex IIRC and when combined with the rising cost of electricity, is probably effectviely cost neutral over gas in terms of running costs.

Good question, and obviously one should consider the opportunity cost.
If someone spends e.g £50k to avoid e.g. £2k bills, that compares unfavourably with keeping the £50k invested elsewhere, paying the bills from the income it generates and having the probability of not only still having the money but of capital appreciation.

 

[Apthorpe]

Can't find anything like those numbers in Eurostat. Do you have a specific link?

Yes I do.

Or quite well informed with their own opinions.

Perhaps, but see your previous sentence.

Well we are doing quite well. Inflation is coming down, interest rates are coming down, employment keeps going up, debt to GDP is tiny,

Danish debt to GDP, not unfunded EU liabilities. What do you think is going to happen when these liabilities come due? Do you imagine that all these people are simply going to write off the sums they will be owed and starve because they don't want to pop the fantasy bubble inhabited by the wealthiest members of their society?

spending more on defence, free education, a high level of care for the elderly, (not at the extortionate rates that people have to pay in the UK). A good (not perfect) healthcare system, roads you can drive on without losing you teeth, very little anti hunting activity, an effective hunting organisation with around 800 local hunting associations, affordable housing ( in most places), high salaries (also high tax rates), very limited poverty and homelessness, low crime rates, low levels of illegal immigration, good integration of immigrants, fantastic beaches.
I don't feel I need an alternative.

Did I mention a 'bubble'?

Life is good.

Make the most of it, because it's not sustainable. It might outlast you depending on your antiquity, but it has stuffed future taxpayers, because their real debt to GDP is colossal.

 

[Freeforester]

Today’s state of the ‘Onion’address by Belgian PM Bart de Wever. Energy cost are prominent in the collective opinion.

 

[BryanDC]

Yes I do.

So do me the courtesy of posting it.

Perhaps, but see your previous sentence.

Danish debt to GDP, not unfunded EU liabilities. What do you think is going to happen when these liabilities come due? Do you imagine that all these people are simply going to write off the sums they will be owed and starve because they don't want to pop the fantasy bubble inhabited by the wealthiest members of their society?

Did I mention a 'bubble'?

Make the most of it, because it's not sustainable. It might outlast you depending on your antiquity, but it has stuffed future taxpayers, because their real debt to GDP is colossal.

Yes you are right. There will have to be some changes especially in pension funding as almost every western nation is facing an aging population and reduced birth rate. My children may not get a state pension so I have tried to push them in the direction of taking care of themselves.

I forgot to mention. Always one of the world's happiest countries. Life is good.

 

[MarinePMI]

out of curiosity what was the cap ex to get zero bills? FWIW we spent best part of £50k for GSHP/Solar PV in 2018.

Solar paid for itself after 6-7years due in part to the rising cost of electrciity.

The GSHP which was the lions share of the cap ex will never pay for itself, despite the subsidies which wil return c.50% of the capex IIRC and when combined with the rising cost of electricity, is probably effectviely cost neutral over gas in terms of running costs.

"See! A ponzi scheme does work!"

 

[Apthorpe]

So do me the courtesy of posting it.

<span class="mw-page-title-main">Pensions in national accounts - statistics</span>

description

ec.europa.eu

AT this stage I must admit to an error because these figures exclude various other debts and liabilities not properly reported, and I had assumed it included them because I didn't read it properly. Actually the overall picture is worse than I painted.

Yes you are right. There will have to be some changes especially in pension funding as almost every western nation is facing an aging population and reduced birth rate. My children may not get a state pension so I have tried to push them in the direction of taking care of themselves.

An elegant understatement on a pretty epic scale.
It is of course, possible that the EU will not arrange a pooling of liabilities, in which case you will have a total collapse of the majority of the EU, and therefore Denmark - whether directly financially, or via the influx of, conservatively, tens of millions of European migrants.

I forgot to mention. Always one of the world's happiest countries. Life is good.

I'd forgotten the phrase but read it again today....'a fool's paradise'.

 

[BryanDC]

<span class="mw-page-title-main">Pensions in national accounts - statistics</span>

description

ec.europa.eu

AT this stage I must admit to an error because these figures exclude various other debts and liabilities not properly reported, and I had assumed it included them because I didn't read it properly. Actually the overall picture is worse than I painted.

An elegant understatement on a pretty epic scale.
It is of course, possible that the EU will not arrange a pooling of liabilities, in which case you will have a total collapse of the majority of the EU, and therefore Denmark -

If it happens it happens. I'm not sure that, that would spell the end of any individual country.

whether directly financially, or via the influx of, conservatively, tens of millions of European migrants.

I think like many you misunderstand that the free movement of people within the EU comes without conditions. As a citizen of another EU country I was entitled to be here for 3 months. If I could prove I was actively looking for work then that extended the period. I was not entitled to anything from the state other than necessary healthcare without having a job and that healthcare would be reimbursed to Denmark by the UK. These are exactly the same rules as there was in the UK when they were a member state. A citizen of another EU country cannot just turn up and expect to be paid a pension for example. As with the UK you have to work for a specific period. So what exactly would these tens of millions of european migrants get out of moving here. No house, no money, no pension. Doesn't seem much point to moving here then.

I'd forgotten the phrase but read it again today....'a fool's paradise'.

No not a fool's paradise. Just a really good place to live. Something has had we wondering today. I wonder about your state of happiness. You complain and complain and complain about everything. Almost every thread you post on your comments are aggressive, confrontational and quite often just depressing. I'm genuinely interested, is there anything in your life that makes you happy? Wife, kids, pets, your job, a nice glass of your favourite tipple, anything?