Tikka T3X Lite Stainless, 20 inch 6.5CM - Copper Ammo - 1st hand experience?

[MAJ]

Hi all,

Looking for 1st hand experience of COPPER ammo in the above rifle. (which I have)

This version of the T3X rifle seem common at the moment, so I figured people will have found rounds that work well in it.

Personally I am struggling to find a round that group well and consistently in it.

I have settled on Norma TipStrike (lead) for now because only that, or Norma EvoStrike (tin) will group sensibly. I have tried around 8 boxes of factory ammo so far, 5 of which copper, and none of them are inspiring confidence...The above mentioned Norma rounds are ok though (which makes me believe it's not user error) ... but ultimately I'd like to use copper.

Wondering what people are using. The Sako Blades and Powerhead 2's are both particularly terrible through it.

Some limited success with S+B blue, and Hornady Superperormance CX, but still not great. Compared to the Norma.

A common feature seems to be a triangular group where the 1st shot goes by itself, then the 2nd and 3rd go together somewhere else. (Less so with Norma)

I am cleaning the barrel with a Jakele pull-through with Brunox orange after use, and boretec eliminator followed by dry patches before use

Any advice welcome, apart from Creedmoor bashing

 

[Utectok]

So the general accept position is you need to do a bare metal clean before shooting copper. This is not required going the other way ie from copper to lead. So to do a proper bare metal clean you really need a borescope and some light abrasive paste like jb bore paste. It takes about 20mins usually. If you don’t have a borescope to inspect get it as clean as you can and then try again. Please don’t clean with a boresnake, useful if the bore is damp but otherwise use a proper cleaning rod.
Finally statistically 3 shot groups will almost always have two close together and one apart. That’s normal. I advise 10 shot groups even that doesn’t tell you a lot

 

[baguio]

As above, you cannot mix lead and copper. Don’t know why but you just can’t.
I have a Sako Finnlight 2 in 6.5 Creedmoor and 20” barrel but I reload so have tuned the jump to lands which is the most important bit IMO. In fact I’m lead to believe that any factory ammo can be made to shoot if you get the jump correct.

 

[MAJ]

Ok, thanks for the advice so far. I will take that on board. I have been testing a box at a time though, with a rodded barrel beforehand.

When the Powerhead 2's came out with a 100mm spread at 80 metres, I was happy to write them off straight away. Compared with Hornady copper for eg with a 40-50mm spread (still not great). Norma more what I'm after with <30mm groups...but they're not copper.

Still keen to hear of someone who uses this rifle and has found a copper round that groups well from it.

There is a niggling thought that for a rifle that is notorious for "shooting accurately straight out of the box", I wonder if I've got the only duff one out there as I wouldn't describe my experience as the above.

I've also bought a T1X 17hmr at the same time, and that was laser accurate with the first box of ammo, so I don't think there's any major user error, hopefully!

 

[Utectok]

If the rifle is new I’m sure it will shoot most ammunition well. I would say most people think they have a clean barrel when really they don’t. My bet is if you actually clean your barrel back to metal and observe its clean with a borescope it will shoot copper just fine. Or just shoot yew tree homeloads which are almost certain to shoot brilliantly with almost no load development.

 

[Edinburgh Rifles]

Balls….

You can mix “copper” and jacketed lead bullets
Its the same ****ing metal in contact with the bore!!

We developed all our Fox Classic Hunter and Peregrine Factory loads in used factory rifles, predominantly 20” standard twist rifles
Not one was “thoroughly cleaned” before…

The Fox 100gr and 123gr was developed in a 20” tikka and shoots 1/2”

 

[Utectok]

Balls….

You can mix “copper” and jacketed lead bullets
Its the same ****ing metal in contact with the bore!!

We developed all our Fox Classic Hunter and Peregrine Factory loads in used factory rifles, predominantly 20” standard twist rifles
Not one was “thoroughly cleaned” before…

The Fox 100gr and 123gr was developed in a 20” tikka and shoots 1/2”

I agree this can happen equally often they need a clean rifle. It all depends. And no they are not the same metal although they are similar composition.
This is not made up this is from personal experience, obviously you have had different experiences with different bullets but just because you have one experience doesn’t mean others have can’t have a different one in different circumstances.

 

[Cotswold Sporting]

Hi all,

Looking for 1st hand experience of COPPER ammo in the above rifle. (which I have)

This version of the T3X rifle seem common at the moment, so I figured people will have found rounds that work well in it.

Personally I am struggling to find a round that group well and consistently in it.

I have settled on Norma TipStrike (lead) for now because only that, or Norma EvoStrike (tin) will group sensibly. I have tried around 8 boxes of factory ammo so far, 5 of which copper, and none of them are inspiring confidence...The above mentioned Norma rounds are ok though (which makes me believe it's not user error) ... but ultimately I'd like to use copper.

Wondering what people are using. The Sako Blades and Powerhead 2's are both particularly terrible through it.

Some limited success with S+B blue, and Hornady Superperormance CX, but still not great. Compared to the Norma.

A common feature seems to be a triangular group where the 1st shot goes by itself, then the 2nd and 3rd go together somewhere else. (Less so with Norma)

I am cleaning the barrel with a Jakele pull-through with Brunox orange after use, and boretec eliminator followed by dry patches before use

Any advice welcome, apart from Creedmoor bashing

I would suggest that it’s odd for a Tikka T3X to not shoot the majority of decent factory ammo 1” or less. I have certainly used all of the ones you mentioned above and had good results through several rifles. Acton screws tight? Barrel free floating? Rail nice and tight? Rings done up correct etc? I would certainly hope you would have tried all these things before going too mad on buying £50+ a box ammo.

 

[Utectok]

I would suggest that it’s odd for a Tikka T3X to not shoot the majority of decent factory ammo 1” or less. I have certainly used all of the ones you mentioned above and had good results through several rifles. Acton screws tight? Barrel free floating? Rail nice and tight? Rings done up correct etc? I would certainly hope you would have tried all these things before going too mad on buying £50+ a box ammo.

Good advice

 

[Edinburgh Rifles]

I agree this can happen equally often they need a clean rifle. It all depends. And no they are not the same metal although they are similar composition.
This is not made up this is from personal experience, obviously you have had different experiences with different bullets but just because you have one experience doesn’t mean others have can’t have a different one in different circumstances.

No but…
It does mean that the wider spectrum of having developed 17 factory cartridges in two separate brands, as well as numerous custom loads for customers from 17 hornet to 6.5x47, .300nm, .328lm, 375H&H, 240H&H flanged, .303, etc

Not once have I prepared the rifles in advance to remove jacketed lead residue

I am not basing my observations on one or two rifle

Its much more likely that any inconsistencies in accuracy or issues with loads are based on some other variable


And on the whole the metal in the jacket is not pure copper but an allow of copper and zinc
Almost exclusively the same metals used in almost all non lead offerings.
brass, or more commonly know as guilding metal, hence Hornady calling their offering “GMX”, Guilding Metal expanding )

I agree not always the same proportion of metal in the alloys hut nether are the jackets in factory lead bullets

 

[Utectok]

No but…
It does mean that the wider spectrum of having developed 17 factory cartridges in two separate brands, as well as numerous custom loads for customers from 17 hornet to 6.5x47, .300nm, .328lm, 375H&H, 240H&H flanged, .303, etc

Not once have I prepared the rifles in advance to remove jacketed lead residue

I am not basing my observations on one or two rifle

Its much more likely that any inconsistencies in accuracy or issues with loads are based on some other variable


And on the whole the metal in the jacket is not pure copper but an allow of copper and zinc
Almost exclusively the same metals used in almost all non lead offerings.
brass, or more commonly know as guilding metal, hence Hornady calling their offering “GMX”, Guilding Metal expanding )

I agree not always the same proportion of metal in the alloys hut nether are the jackets in factory lead bullets

Whilst I acknowledge the above it still doesn’t mean in certain circumstances a clean barrel is required, granted you have not experienced that but it is possible some circumstance may fall outside your experience and as an open minded gentleman I’m sure you would accept that

 

[baguio]

Balls….

You can mix “copper” and jacketed lead bullets
Its the same ****ing metal in contact with the bore!!

We developed all our Fox Classic Hunter and Peregrine Factory loads in used factory rifles, predominantly 20” standard twist rifles
Not one was “thoroughly cleaned” before…

The Fox 100gr and 123gr was developed in a 20” tikka and shoots 1/2”

Really Ed? Try watching this . Clearly Backfire and Ron Spomer are talking rubbish? After all, what does that Ron Spomer know anyway?

 

[MAJ]

Balls….

You can mix “copper” and jacketed lead bullets
Its the same ****ing metal in contact with the bore!!

We developed all our Fox Classic Hunter and Peregrine Factory loads in used factory rifles, predominantly 20” standard twist rifles
Not one was “thoroughly cleaned” before…

The Fox 100gr and 123gr was developed in a 20” tikka and shoots 1/2”

Interesting about the Fox being developed in that barrel...I'll see if I can find any near me

 

[MAJ]

I would suggest that it’s odd for a Tikka T3X to not shoot the majority of decent factory ammo 1” or less. I have certainly used all of the ones you mentioned above and had good results through several rifles. Acton screws tight? Barrel free floating? Rail nice and tight? Rings done up correct etc? I would certainly hope you would have tried all these things before going too mad on buying £50+ a box ammo.

Yea its all torqued up, and have had another very experienced person cast their eyes over the setup, and they recieved similar issues with the grouping

 

[Utectok]

Yea its all torqued up, and have had another very experienced person cast their eyes over the setup, and they recieved similar issues with the grouping

Is it a new rifle or a second hand one

 

[MAJ]

Is it a new rifle or a second hand one

New. Had it a couple of months. The Norma Tipstrike lead are useable, so I'm not too stressed....I've been out shooting with enough confidence in them for relatively close h+l which is fine for now.

But I wasn't expecting it to be as fussy and tricky to find decently grouping copper ammo, which makes me slightly concerned somethings not right.

I've chucked a fair bit of money at it so far, not to mention been through the options of what the shops have to offer locally. Which is what lead me to ask what experience others are having.

 

[Utectok]

New. Had it a couple of months. The Norma Tipstrike lead are useable, so I'm not too stressed....I've been out shooting with enough confidence in them for relatively close h+l which is fine for now.

But I wasn't expecting it to be as fussy and tricky to find decently grouping copper ammo, which makes me slightly concerned somethings not right.

I've chucked a fair bit of money at it so far, not to mention been through the options of what the shops have to offer locally. Which is what lead me to ask what experience others are having.

It really should be pretty straightforward as you suggest with a new rifle I’ve never shot a tikka that wasn’t ok with most ammunition and usually sub moa. I’d be checking free float first the trying a different scope maybe? Moderators can also be a problem?? Lose of badly made?? Lots of things but it should be a good rifle

 

[MAJ]

It really should be pretty straightforward as you suggest with a new rifle I’ve never shot a tikka that wasn’t ok with most ammunition and usually sub moa. I’d be checking free float first the trying a different scope maybe? Moderators can also be a problem?? Lose of badly made?? Lots of things but it should be a good rifle

Ok cheers, yea I'll double check everything...trying a different scope is a good idea

 

[Utectok]

Ok cheers, yea I'll double check everything...trying a different scope is a good idea

Try mod on and off too

 

[the_greenman]

Not sure what your rifle twist is but I have a 20" ctr in 6.5cm and by far the most accurate I've found so far (even more than factory lead loads) are Fox 123gr (hand loads)