BASC Say that TVP has recruited more FEOs and people to work in the department but that it will be a while until benefits are seen because of time taken to get them up to speed
UPDATE: TVP FAC/SGC Renewals
- Thread starter I. Farticus
- Start date
kennyc
Well-Known Member
seems strange they took the step of reducing staffing levels and now are increasing them? Management not keeping up with demands ?
There has certainly been at least one retirement of a senior FEO over the last year but you do wonder they don't get things in place for retirement rather than sorting it after the event
Apart from the 'normal' problems, it would also seem a possibility that the larger, more urban forces are conducting a thorough review years on from DB in Cumbria, doing this and not staffing up for the extra work would result in much of what we see. GM are another force with the problems TVP has ?
Just a suggestion but still cause for complaint.
Just a suggestion but still cause for complaint.
kennyc
Well-Known Member
I was told a 30% drop in staff+around 5 unfilled vacancies! and this at a time of cyclically high demand (that they have known about for the last 5 years) hard to see where they would struggle isn't it?
I. Farticus
Well-Known Member
I lost my 3rd FEO in a year 2 months ago, and he didn't know when they were going to replace him. Good news if they are now hiring, but as been said, how was all this such a colossal surprise???
I suppose it's just an easy money saving tactic isn't it - you build in a 3-6 month recruitment process post retirement and you've immediately saved a significant sum of money in salaries and NI. Human resources probably aren't that concerned by the service being delivered but probably are easily manipulated by higher people asking them to save money. This was certainly the case when I worked in the hospital on a gap year a couple of years back.
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Orion
Well-Known Member
Perhaps the TVP PCC can also find a spare £39k to help out? 
https://ukshootingnews.wordpress.co...romises-action-on-firearms-licensing-backlog/
https://ukshootingnews.wordpress.co...romises-action-on-firearms-licensing-backlog/
There were 6,608 "live" FAC in Thames Valley in March 2015 (Source: https://www.gov.uk/government/stati...-financial-year-ending-march-2015-data-tables)
To make arithmetic easy, assume that 1,300 (around 20%) are granted/renewed each year. Adding £30 to the grant/renewal cost of each would raise £39k.
To make arithmetic easy, assume that 1,300 (around 20%) are granted/renewed each year. Adding £30 to the grant/renewal cost of each would raise £39k.
Orion
Well-Known Member
As the current post-increase fees already "cover the full cost of running the firearms licensing service once eCommerce, an online system currently being developed by the police, becomes operational in due course" one can only say that the situation is entirely of their own making. Why pay more for their inefficiencies, failure to use IT, and the lack of current investment and support for the licensing functions they are required to undertake?
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/home-office-announces-increase-in-firearms-licensing-fees
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/home-office-announces-increase-in-firearms-licensing-fees
oxfordfowler
Well-Known Member
Well would you believe it my new SGC arrived in the post on Friday. That's 2 days short of 10 months for a renewal with TVP.
A friend also received his on the same day - only took 9 months.
I have also received an email from the Firearms manager at TVP which is attached for your info/interest.
[FONT="]"The Firearms Licensing Department has performed well for a number of years and the turnaround times for dealing with applications has been good. The department has had a service level agreement of dealing with applications within 60 working days and usually completed these within 30 - 40 working days. The department has, however, faced a number of challenges during the last year creating a backlog and delays in processing applications of up to 5 months.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]The volume of work this year has increased because of the peak renewal period resulting from the changes some years ago in the length of time certificates remained valid. The department was resourced to meet the demands during this peak renewal period before the occurrence of unforeseen factors.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]There was an extensive flood in the department and although a business continuity plan was implemented and worked reasonably well, overall productivity was reduced with staff working from alternative sites. Water damage also necessitated some completed work to be redone.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]In addition, the system used to manage firearms licensing, the National Firearms Licensing Management System is near end of life and its use in this Force has been slow and unstable. This has been resolved but also contributed to an accumulation of outstanding work. Thames Valley Police together with other forces are contributing to the design of a new system and we have offered to be an early adopter to assist in its implementation and roll out.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]The department is also dealing with a significant increase in public safety work often involving certificate holders being involved in domestic abuse incidents. Every public safety incident is fully investigated and certificate holders’ continued suitability to hold a certificate or have one issued is fully reviewed. Last year there were 223 revocations and refusals resulting in 26 appeals to the Crown Court; this year the current revocation/refusal figure stands at 138 with 16 ongoing appeals. The critical nature of this work has required the diversion of some resources from dealing with the processing of applications.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]The Chief Constables Management Team has reviewed the demand that is currently placed on the firearms licensing department and has authorised two additional temporary members of staff to assist in processing the backlog. This was a difficult but necessary decision particularly in these times of austerity; however, these members of staff have now been recruited and are already having a positive impact. [/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]I have also met with PCC Stansfeld regarding concerns raised by the shooting community. He is fully supportive of the department and committed to ensuring that the administration of firearms licensing within the Thames Valley Police area is efficient and in accordance with Home Office Guidance.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]I’m pleased to inform you that your shot gun certificate was posted to you on 16 June 2016 - these are sent out via second class post so you should hopefully receive it this week. Please accept my apologies for the delay in processing your application; my staff are working extremely hard to improve the service that we provide to the whole shooting community.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]Please do not hesitate to contact me if you require further assistance in this matter.[/FONT][FONT="]
Kind regards"[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Zoey Evans I Firearms Licensing Manager I Firearms & Explosives Licensing Department I
[FONT="]Tel: 01865 846566 I Fax: 01865 293826 I Email: zoey.evans@thamesvalley.pnn.police.uk I[/FONT]
[FONT="]Address: Thames Valley Police HQ, Oxford Road, Kidlington, OX5 2NX[/FONT]
[/FONT]
A friend also received his on the same day - only took 9 months.
I have also received an email from the Firearms manager at TVP which is attached for your info/interest.
[FONT="]"The Firearms Licensing Department has performed well for a number of years and the turnaround times for dealing with applications has been good. The department has had a service level agreement of dealing with applications within 60 working days and usually completed these within 30 - 40 working days. The department has, however, faced a number of challenges during the last year creating a backlog and delays in processing applications of up to 5 months.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]The volume of work this year has increased because of the peak renewal period resulting from the changes some years ago in the length of time certificates remained valid. The department was resourced to meet the demands during this peak renewal period before the occurrence of unforeseen factors.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]There was an extensive flood in the department and although a business continuity plan was implemented and worked reasonably well, overall productivity was reduced with staff working from alternative sites. Water damage also necessitated some completed work to be redone.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]In addition, the system used to manage firearms licensing, the National Firearms Licensing Management System is near end of life and its use in this Force has been slow and unstable. This has been resolved but also contributed to an accumulation of outstanding work. Thames Valley Police together with other forces are contributing to the design of a new system and we have offered to be an early adopter to assist in its implementation and roll out.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]The department is also dealing with a significant increase in public safety work often involving certificate holders being involved in domestic abuse incidents. Every public safety incident is fully investigated and certificate holders’ continued suitability to hold a certificate or have one issued is fully reviewed. Last year there were 223 revocations and refusals resulting in 26 appeals to the Crown Court; this year the current revocation/refusal figure stands at 138 with 16 ongoing appeals. The critical nature of this work has required the diversion of some resources from dealing with the processing of applications.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]The Chief Constables Management Team has reviewed the demand that is currently placed on the firearms licensing department and has authorised two additional temporary members of staff to assist in processing the backlog. This was a difficult but necessary decision particularly in these times of austerity; however, these members of staff have now been recruited and are already having a positive impact. [/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]I have also met with PCC Stansfeld regarding concerns raised by the shooting community. He is fully supportive of the department and committed to ensuring that the administration of firearms licensing within the Thames Valley Police area is efficient and in accordance with Home Office Guidance.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]I’m pleased to inform you that your shot gun certificate was posted to you on 16 June 2016 - these are sent out via second class post so you should hopefully receive it this week. Please accept my apologies for the delay in processing your application; my staff are working extremely hard to improve the service that we provide to the whole shooting community.[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]Please do not hesitate to contact me if you require further assistance in this matter.[/FONT][FONT="]
Kind regards"[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT]
[FONT="]Zoey Evans I Firearms Licensing Manager I Firearms & Explosives Licensing Department I
[FONT="]Tel: 01865 846566 I Fax: 01865 293826 I Email: zoey.evans@thamesvalley.pnn.police.uk I[/FONT]
[FONT="]Address: Thames Valley Police HQ, Oxford Road, Kidlington, OX5 2NX[/FONT]
[/FONT]
TVP Variation
I applied for a FAC Variation on the 5th May 2016 for two more additional rifles and necessary ammunition. I didn't send my current FAC in due to the current back log as I wanted to hang onto it for as long as possible for ammunition purchases, so just sent in a photocopy so the could at least start the variation process.
On the 24th June- (6 weeks later ) I received an email from the licensing department requesting my FAC.
I went down to my local gun shop today and purchased the additional ammunition needed to bring me up to my limit on all calibre's I own, as I'm not sure how long this variation process is going to take them.
But I will of course keep all you lot informed.......6 weeks so far.
I've been putting this variation off for months due to some of the horror stories on here.
So lets see if the service has got any better now they've employed two part time members of staff to help out.
I applied for a FAC Variation on the 5th May 2016 for two more additional rifles and necessary ammunition. I didn't send my current FAC in due to the current back log as I wanted to hang onto it for as long as possible for ammunition purchases, so just sent in a photocopy so the could at least start the variation process.
On the 24th June- (6 weeks later ) I received an email from the licensing department requesting my FAC.
I went down to my local gun shop today and purchased the additional ammunition needed to bring me up to my limit on all calibre's I own, as I'm not sure how long this variation process is going to take them.
But I will of course keep all you lot informed.......6 weeks so far.
I've been putting this variation off for months due to some of the horror stories on here.
So lets see if the service has got any better now they've employed two part time members of staff to help out.
kennyc
Well-Known Member
spartan7510
Well-Known Member
PEOPLE NEED TO COMPLAIN. I spoke to NRA legal about TVP - send a complaint to the POLICE and CRIME Commissioner as first point of call. If there is no cation take it to the IPCC. Service delivery out of TVP is appalling. If you dont complain , nothing will change. I just sent across my complaint today.
I. Farticus
Well-Known Member
I've just had an email from TVP about a live online "Ask the Chief Constable" event on Weds 20th July 19:00-21:00... #askthechief
Go to the following URL to log your interest/set a reminder:
http://thamesvp.coverpage.coveritli.../altcast_code=ce4f370f42/width=700/height=550
The emailed blurb is as follows:
Thames Valley Police Chief Constable Francis Habgood will be taking questions from the public in a live online session on Wednesday (20/7).
CC Habgood is hosting the public chat following the publication of his open letter to members of the public about the Force’s new commitment.
CC Habgood said: “Last week I wrote an open letter to the residents of Thames Valley which I hope that you have had a chance to read. As we find ourselves in increasingly changing times both within policing and society in general, it is crucial that we provide a modern police service which meets the needs of the public we serve. Our commitment outlines how we will do that.
CC Habgood said: “We will continue to work tirelessly, and importantly, together, to make our communities safer. Communication is a vital part of working together and I hope that we can have that dialogue on Wednesday evening.”
The Ask the Chief online discussion takes place between 7pm and 9pm on Wednesday 20 July. To join the session, go to http://bit.ly/29xXvhX - you can also set a reminder for the event
Go to the following URL to log your interest/set a reminder:
http://thamesvp.coverpage.coveritli.../altcast_code=ce4f370f42/width=700/height=550
The emailed blurb is as follows:
Thames Valley Police Chief Constable Francis Habgood will be taking questions from the public in a live online session on Wednesday (20/7).
CC Habgood is hosting the public chat following the publication of his open letter to members of the public about the Force’s new commitment.
CC Habgood said: “Last week I wrote an open letter to the residents of Thames Valley which I hope that you have had a chance to read. As we find ourselves in increasingly changing times both within policing and society in general, it is crucial that we provide a modern police service which meets the needs of the public we serve. Our commitment outlines how we will do that.
CC Habgood said: “We will continue to work tirelessly, and importantly, together, to make our communities safer. Communication is a vital part of working together and I hope that we can have that dialogue on Wednesday evening.”
The Ask the Chief online discussion takes place between 7pm and 9pm on Wednesday 20 July. To join the session, go to http://bit.ly/29xXvhX - you can also set a reminder for the event
I. Farticus
Well-Known Member
The live Q&A session with Chief Constable Francis Habgood is underway, and I have posed my question:
Good evening Chief Constable. TVP is experiencing well publicised delays in FAC & SGC renewals and grants. The PCC has bolstered the team with a couple of new members, but what else is being done to catch up the rest of the country, where turnaround is being measured in days, not weeks, let alone months? With thanks
Let's see what, if anything, comes back in response...
And here's the earth shattering, stop press, new news update:
"Hi Iain. I'm sorry for the delays in the licensing renewals and grants for firearms and shotguns.
Unfortunately we had a flood in the office and some staffing issues which caused the delays. I
put a couple of extra members of staff in there to deal with the backlog and hope to be back on
track by the end of the year."
So, nothing new to report I'm afraid folks, sorry
Good evening Chief Constable. TVP is experiencing well publicised delays in FAC & SGC renewals and grants. The PCC has bolstered the team with a couple of new members, but what else is being done to catch up the rest of the country, where turnaround is being measured in days, not weeks, let alone months? With thanks
Let's see what, if anything, comes back in response...
And here's the earth shattering, stop press, new news update:
"Hi Iain. I'm sorry for the delays in the licensing renewals and grants for firearms and shotguns.
Unfortunately we had a flood in the office and some staffing issues which caused the delays. I
put a couple of extra members of staff in there to deal with the backlog and hope to be back on
track by the end of the year."
So, nothing new to report I'm afraid folks, sorry
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I. Farticus
Well-Known Member
I'm still watching this live event, and one person just asked a question using their full name, and then put the name and address of the person that they have a grievance against...
She says that the bloke is dealing 19:00-02:00 every night, so all he needs is someone that knows him to be on the event, and she's deep in the doodoo!!!!
We might have a winner of The Darwin Awards folks
She says that the bloke is dealing 19:00-02:00 every night, so all he needs is someone that knows him to be on the event, and she's deep in the doodoo!!!!
We might have a winner of The Darwin Awards folks
Orion
Well-Known Member
All very well and good that the politicos are trying to get down with the kids by adopting the new (sic) technology, but shouldn't there be some kind of filter in place to protect the hard of thinking from their own actions? Even morons deserve a duty of care being exercised for their own safety.
I've now received my ticket.
The whole process has taken 11 weeks, which in the current climate is just about bearable but its still not good, just for a variation.
If they could turn round renewals in this period of time they wouldn't be having so many complaints about poor service.
Now lets go and spend some money !! May just happen to see something at next weekend's game fare.
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