Vihtavuori with 6.5x55

[Ozalid]

Hi,

I have quite a bit of Viht N150 from loading 30-06, but now having moved to 6.5x55 find that this powder is not appropriate, certainly to achieve 2,450fps MV, according to the manuals I would have to start near the maximum load which clearly is not advisable, so for 130/140gr bullets it looks like I need N550/560, does anyone have any recommendations for powder, or have any 550/560 they would like to exchange? I'll be putting the 150 up for sale shortly.
Cheers
Al

 

[Border]

N160/165 would also be worth trying.

 

[dodgyrog]

I've been using Viht 165 in mine (mainly because I had some). I get good results with it.
Sorry I don't share load details.

 

[sco_tish]

RL 22

 

[enfieldspares]

OZALID I am surprised as N140 and N150 were the "go to" powders for those of us shooting .303 Enfields competitively to gives us the needed 2,450fps with a 174 grain FMJ bullet.

And so I'd query the idea that it cannot do that velocity safely with a 140 grain bullet in the 6.5x55. I am wondering if the manuals are showing safe loads/pressures for the old 1896 Mauser or Krag in 6.5x55 and not loadings up to modern CIP safe pressures?

Here's two quotes...from the internet so take them with caution:

According to the official C.I.P. (Commission Internationale Permanente pour l'Epreuve des Armes à Feu Portatives) rulings the .303 British can handle up to 365.00 MPa (52,939 psi) Pmax piezo pressure.

According to the official C.I.P. rulings the 6.5×55mm can handle up to 380.00 MPa (55,114 psi) Pmax piezo pressure.

The Americans SAAMI still work on the idea that the load must be safe pressure in those old 1896 Mauser or Krag rifles so here's what the internet says:

The SAAMI maximum average pressure (MAP) for this cartridge is 51,000 psi (351.6 MPa) piezo pressure.

Obviously without knowing which manuals you are using I'd maybe look at the Vihtavouri tables? And the pressures given there with the CIP pressures? Are you looking at their figures for the 6.5x55 Swedish or what Vihtavouri call the 6.5x55 SE?

Here's the two tables:

Rifle reloading data | Handloading | Rifle calibers | Centerfire Rifle bullets | Reload your own ammo - Vihtavuori

Vihtavuori offers rifle reloading data for numerous calibers and bullets for match and hunting purposes. Never exceed maximum loads.

www.vihtavuori.com

Rifle reloading data | Handloading | Rifle calibers | Centerfire Rifle bullets | Reload your own ammo - Vihtavuori

Vihtavuori offers rifle reloading data for numerous calibers and bullets for match and hunting purposes. Never exceed maximum loads.

www.vihtavuori.com

 

[ashray]

good morning ,i have used n150 up to 130gr and n165 for 140 upwards. average muzzle velocity was 2640 out of my 20" barrel my rifle does not like n160 and groups much better with the n150 with 120gr nosler b/t.

 

[User00043]

RL 22

 

[Davee]

I think you may find that the chart above is for the older Swede's not for modern rifles. 40.5 grn N150 for 123 Fox at 2807, 40.8grn for 130GK at 2738, 42.6grn for 118VLR4 at 2936, 41.1 for 120Scenar at 2815 all out of 24 inch barrel.

 

[243varmint]

Download the Viht app.
All the load data is on there.

 

[andychas]

Download the Viht app.
All the load data is on there.

Here too

Rifle reloading data | Handloading | Rifle calibers | Centerfire Rifle bullets | Reload your own ammo - Vihtavuori

Vihtavuori offers rifle reloading data for numerous calibers and bullets for match and hunting purposes. Never exceed maximum loads.

www.vihtavuori.com

I used N160 for 140gn Sierra Gameking to good effect, now using RS60 to very good effect with Barnes’s TTSX, both loads from a Sauer 101

 

[Selous]

I too would be absolutely amazed if N150 would not work in the 6.5x55. It would probably be optimal with lighter bullets.
Here is a simulation with 140g bullets

Cartridge : 6.5 x 55 Swedish
Bullet : .264, 140, Sierra SPBT 1730
Useable Case Capaci: 53.581 grain H2O = 3.479 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.150 inch = 80.01 mm
Barrel Length : 22.0 inch = 558.8 mm
Powder : Vihtavuori N150 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-20.0 79 36.64 2308 1656 36812 9190 99.8 1.470
-18.0 81 37.56 2357 1728 39148 9357 99.9 1.426
-16.0 83 38.47 2406 1799 41617 9507 100.0 1.385
-14.0 85 39.39 2454 1872 44225 9648 100.0 1.345
-12.0 86 40.30 2501 1945 46980 9786 100.0 1.307 ! Near Maximum !
-10.0 88 41.22 2548 2018 49893 9922 100.0 1.271 ! Near Maximum !
-08.0 90 42.14 2594 2092 52972 10056 100.0 1.235 ! Near Maximum !
-06.0 92 43.05 2640 2167 56228 10187 100.0 1.202 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-04.0 94 43.97 2686 2242 59673 10316 100.0 1.170 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-02.0 96 44.88 2731 2318 63318 10442 100.0 1.138 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.0 98 45.80 2776 2395 67179 10566 100.0 1.109 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 100 46.72 2820 2473 71269 10686 100.0 1.080 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 102 47.63 2865 2551 75607 10804 100.0 1.052 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0 104 48.55 2909 2630 80210 10919 100.0 1.026 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0 106 49.46 2953 2710 85099 11030 100.0 1.000 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0 108 50.38 2997 2791 90298 11138 100.0 0.975 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 98 45.80 2842 2511 77978 10306 100.0 1.043 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 98 45.80 2676 2227 56129 10942 100.0 1.198 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

 

[Ozalid]

I too would be absolutely amazed if N150 would not work in the 6.5x55. It would probably be optimal with lighter bullets.
Here is a simulation with 140g bullets

It does work, its just not fast enough with 2500fps getting near the maximum load.



Thanks for these contributions, I was starting to regret buying the 6.5, for the record I am using a Sako 85 Finnlight.
Look, I really enjoy reloading it appeals to the pedant in me, but since buying the 6.5 I was first surprised by being unable to accurately calculate the bullet jump with the bullet having to come so far out of the case to meet the lands, then all the conflicting data from the various loading manuals I have, it seems mainly trying to cater for safety in older actions, anyway N160 will be fine according to Viht and I will try this first.

If anyone could please share how they calculate the seating depth/bullet jump I would be very interested to hear about it.

Thanks again all!

 

[zambezi]

my rifle does not like n160

That is also my experience. I tried a very wide charge weight range in my 6.5x55mm and all low charge weights performed poorly. Also I encountered pressure issues a full 6 grains below the Vihtavouri max value.

But Viht N540 has given me a very reliable load at a modest 38.5gr charge weight. That propels a Barnes 120gr ttsx projectile at 2780fps out of my rifle.

6.5x55mm using Barnes ttsx 120gr - good development with Viht N540

VO is only one part of the solution to ballistic problem Magnetospeed are pretty accurate - next to my oehler 35 I get the same VO Zero range data must be absolutely accurate to ascertain reliable drop data to “confirm “ VO Altitude Humidity Atmospheric pressure Scope height above bore...

www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk

 

[Milligan]

I use n150 for 120gr in 6.5x55 very accurate but not the fastest. Have tried n160 and get good velocity but not great accuracy wise.

 

[Ozalid]

I use n150 for 120gr in 6.5x55 very accurate but not the fastest. Have tried n160 and get good velocity but not great accuracy wise.

Well, this is my issue, I have always been very pleased with N150 for my 30-06, but the minimum MV for deer in Scotland is 2450fps, so that is my starting point and seems to rule out N150 unless starting at or near the maximum load.

 

[Davee]

N150 is not so good with the 140grn bullets, you need a slower powder. Try RS62, 10% below max pressure 45Grn will give you 2700+ with a COL of 77.19mm. There are several ways to measure bolt face to the lands, just do a search on here, just be aware that it will be different for every type of bullet. A good place to start is with a calibres width of the shank inside the neck. Remember the Swede has a long throat and loves to jump, everything I've put through mine is jumping +- 100 thou.

 

[sharkbait]

Hi,

I have quite a bit of Viht N150 from loading 30-06, but now having moved to 6.5x55 find that this powder is not appropriate, certainly to achieve 2,450fps MV, according to the manuals I would have to start near the maximum load which clearly is not advisable, so for 130/140gr bullets it looks like I need N550/560, does anyone have any recommendations for powder, or have any 550/560 they would like to exchange? I'll be putting the 150 up for sale shortly.
Cheers
Al

I use n150 in my Swede 36.something grains which your right is at the top end in the lee manual for a 139 grain ppu bullet giving around 2400 to 2500 fps! You could use n160 but I found you use more powder for around the same fps as 150, you do get more play with the n160 powder! How much 150 powder you got and how much you want for it?

 

[Woodlander]

I’m reloading for a 6.5x55 with N150, though using 120gr bullets.
A new calibre for me, so I started cautiously and had an accurate load at 38.5, though cases were very sooty. So taking advice from previous threads on here kept loading .5gr more until reaching 40.5 where sooty cases miraculously stopped and no signs of overpressure. Haven’t chronoed it yet.
Have you thought about changing the bullet weight rather than the powder? I’ve read where some think the 120gr is the better bullet for larger deer, in the Swede

 

[charlieboy-shooter]

Here's two quotes...from the internet so take them with caution:

According to the official C.I.P. (Commission Internationale Permanente pour l'Epreuve des Armes à Feu Portatives) rulings the .303 British can handle up to 365.00 MPa (52,939 psi) Pmax piezo pressure.

According to the official C.I.P. rulings the 6.5×55mm can handle up to 380.00 MPa (55,114 psi) Pmax piezo pressure.

The Americans SAAMI still work on the idea that the load must be safe pressure in those old 1896 Mauser or Krag rifles so here's what the internet says:

The SAAMI maximum average pressure (MAP) for this cartridge is 51,000 psi (351.6 MPa) piezo pressure.

Obviously without knowing which manuals you are using I'd maybe look at the Vihtavouri tables? And the pressures given there with the CIP pressures? Are you looking at their figures for the 6.5x55 Swedish or what Vihtavouri call the 6.5x55 SE?

Here's the two tables:

Rifle reloading data | Handloading | Rifle calibers | Centerfire Rifle bullets | Reload your own ammo - Vihtavuori

Vihtavuori offers rifle reloading data for numerous calibers and bullets for match and hunting purposes. Never exceed maximum loads.

www.vihtavuori.com

Rifle reloading data | Handloading | Rifle calibers | Centerfire Rifle bullets | Reload your own ammo - Vihtavuori

Vihtavuori offers rifle reloading data for numerous calibers and bullets for match and hunting purposes. Never exceed maximum loads.

www.vihtavuori.com

Hi,
Unless I’m reading the tables all wrong ? The 2nd table is for Modern rifles SKAN rated to higher pressure than the old Mauser’s/ Krag rifles. Is that correct ?? But I’ve come across this before and queried this, as others have too. As an example the 2nd table with the 120gr bullet with N160 has a maximum charge of 47.4gr ( all Scenar -L) yet the 1st table with the same bullet weight but the Sierra 120gr has a maximum charge of 50.7gr and this is for the lower pressure Mauser actions ?? ( can see the Scenar-L maximum charge is lower in table 1 than table 2)
Really, what am I missing ?other than bullet shape ? As it seem back to front to me when comparing the Sierra bullet.
I ended up with 49.4gr with the 120gr Sierra Gameking before I could get my Swede (Tikka T3lite , 20” barrel) to not be a complete sooty chimney. But have never progressed to actually use it other than the test loads. So as others have stated not impressed with N160 or the conflicting data. But as said have I been missing something??
I have just acquired some RS62 as just not confident with N160.

 

[Ozalid]

I am going to sell all my N150 and try the Viht N540, I read that the RS62 was designed for heavier Bullets/calibres, it’s a bloody minefield.