Zeroing at 1” high question

If you shoot over high & open ground I guess an elevated zero can be useful, but for lowland woodland stalking I'd stick with 100 yards.

All my centrefire rifles are zeroed to 100 yards which may disappointment the SD and Bisley long-range cognoscenti but so be it.

K
 
Me too
That's interesting, as I've found the manufacturers data on the boxes (or online) for the three types of ammo I use to be pretty accurate with regards to bullet drops.
Me too, and again given "field accuracy" it gives you a broad idea. Obviously better to try live at range if you can.
 
Just reading this thread while searching on the forum. Can someone clarify what is probably a stupid question!

You're zeroed 1inch high at 100yards. With your chosen bullet (EG: 243 100gr sako gamehead) you're flat out to 150yards. The drop at 200yards is 2.75 inches. Assuming 1/4 moa per click you add 4 clicks (6 clicks - 2 clicks for the 1inch high zero). I think I understand that if you were dead on at 100yards it would be 6 clicks but I'm struggling to be sure of how I account for that initial inch high at 100 in terms of MOA clicks. I'm thinking 2 clicks of 1/4 at 200yards being 1 inch?
For those hitting an inch high at 100 or 1.5” or 2” whatever suits there needs and cartridge trajectory the idea is know it’s hitting an inch high at 100 means no dialling. Aim and squeeze out to 200 and the impact should be in the kill zone.

It’s about keeping it simple and those methods are all rule of thumb. But they all work.

If you are dead on at 100m the trajectory of a given load and projectile path may well go higher past that point before it drops again and after 200 the rate of drop increases .

At point is it flat. So I’m saying it’s not flat at 150. It may be impacting on the mark at 150 but flat does not come into it.

To me up another 1.75 inches at 100 would be 7 clicks. (11 clicks to 2.75”) Now you are 2.75inches high at 100. If 2.75” high at 100 gets you on at 200 great. It will vary between rifles and the actual group size will theoretically the group size will be double the group you are getting at 100. So a 1” group becomes about 2” at 200 and increase again over distance so 300 yards results in a 3” group and that is not taking in environmental factors it is just how the level of accuracy Decreases with distance. That’s why competition targets increase in size or steel plates are larger at distance because even a good rifle and load that shoots less than one inch at 100 will increase the group size over distance. Look into understanding MOA ( minute of angle)

Mil Radians is another angular measurement in target scopes that uses an angular measurement of 1/3600th of a circle It’s by coincidence that it is used in multiples of tenths that make it simple for those who use the metric system and decimals. And some European hunting scopes click adjustment values are 1cm at 100m. That equals 0.1 of a mil radian.

Thaw Answer,

So if you start at 100 and you know a given drop for the load and rifle on a given distance then work from the 100yard zero to make adjustment. In your case it’s dropping 2.75” below the 100 yard zero.

Either physically wind back the 4 clicks and it should be on at 100 and then add the 11 clicks to achieve an increase of 2.75” a 200 zero

Or minus the 4 from 11 in your equation to calculate the 7 clicks required to be on at 200 that is known as to be 2.75” lower than 100.

As a stalker you possibly don’t have time to range, calculate and dial. Most hunters shoot within 200 and dialling is not required and probably most don’t do it.

Enter the age of long range hunting where people are ranging animals past 500 yards with less chance of spooking the animal and time to make calculations and adjustments then it’s a different story and a different scope and rifle combination.

If you are stalking with a hunting rifle and a 3-9 or 4-12 scope designed for “Stalking” then is designed to be zeroed and used.

The rule of thumb rules I know are

.222 or .223 zero at 50 and it’s good to 200.

.222 or .223 an inch high at 100 is good to 200
Both methods work for Kangaroo shooters who harvest daily for a living. Yes, the trajectory is not flat but they make the subtle holdover or hold under as required. Most shots are likely to be under 150 with 200 being a long shot.

Another is an inch and a half to 2” high at 100 works for most hunters. Forget dialling and work out the hold over or under for your purposes.

Or just sight at 150yards for that .243 I expect your group will be over an inch on a calm day but you will be in the kill zone between 100 and 200 for your purposes.
 
Just reading this thread while searching on the forum. Can someone clarify what is probably a stupid question!

You're zeroed 1inch high at 100yards. With your chosen bullet (EG: 243 100gr sako gamehead) you're flat out to 150yards. The drop at 200yards is 2.75 inches. Assuming 1/4 moa per click you add 4 clicks (6 clicks - 2 clicks for the 1inch high zero). I think I understand that if you were dead on at 100yards it would be 6 clicks but I'm struggling to be sure of how I account for that initial inch high at 100 in terms of MOA clicks. I'm thinking 2 clicks of 1/4 at 200yards being 1 inch?

We are doing the math differently.

Yes 2clicks is a half inch at 100 and 1” at 200

The same way that 4 clicks is 1” at 50.

Aside from my rambling above my idea is that to do the math work back from the 100yard zero.

You are already 4 clicks up at 100.

Dial back or Subtract these from the calculation.

Start from the start based on a 100 yard zero the bullet strikes 2.75” low at 200 yards . To be 2.75” high at 100 you need 1 click per quarter inch. That’s 4 clicks to an inch, 8 for 2” and another 3 for the 3/4” required totalling 11x1/4” clicks to come up 2.75” at 100 as the drop from 100-200 is 2.75”.

The answer is 11 clicks minus the 4 already in play.

Just re reading the question and trying to explain my process. Hopefully it’s making sense.
 
If you are dead on at 100m the trajectory of a given load and projectile path may well go higher past that point before it drops again and after 200 the rate of drop increases .
No it won't. You'd need to have something remarkable (cartridge and/or rifle setup) to have 100m "near zero".

Mil Radians is another angular measurement in target scopes that uses an angular measurement of 1/3600th of a circle It’s by coincidence that it is used in multiples of tenths that make it simple for those who use the metric system and decimals. And some European hunting scopes click adjustment values are 1cm at 100m. That equals 0.1 of a mil radian.
It's no cocincident, it's the definition of radian. One radian is the angle where the radius of the circle is the same as the part of the circumference covered by that angle.

When you get to milliradian (1/1000th of radian) you can approximate the circumference by a straight line. So the part of circumference / straight line is 1/1000th of the radius. And this plays nicely along with the 10 based SI system.
 
Yes clicks will move your POI up
But… without shooting the actual distance with the ammo you intend to hunt at you are guessing on Point of Impact at range.

Now within reason if you are boiler room shots a couple of inches may not matter to a cartridge and bullet combo with the right efficacy

But it astounds me the number of guests and club members we have that dont know the drop of their rifle/ammo at any given range but are prepared to shoot “out to 250-300m on a good day”….

Put a guest on a red deer target at 240m after he missed a deer.
He persisted with the same aim point under the illusion the cartridge dropped “a couple of inches” at 200-250

Best part of 2 feet!!

Shoot targets beyond where you expect to shoot deer

Cartridge boxes lie (MV)
Bullet makers lie (BC)

Your app is using flawed info unless you have measured MV and tested trajectory at range


Oh…and for those discovering “instability at 200m but not 100m…
I would say look deeper.
Bullets dont suddenly become unstable
In my experience group size at 200m opens up due to shooter input much more often than sudden instability.
Unless your group at 100m is 2-3” as standard and the “instability” is the natural opening up at 200m….

There are very few non lead bullet weight/rifle twist/velocity combinations that create instability unless you are running the longest, Highest BC bullet out of spec for no good reason
Most makers don’t produce bullets for the major market in this form

Some rifle just dont like some bullets but that is shown at 100m very clearly.
 
Last edited:
I think you’ve got yourself muddled.

4 clicks is definitely not 1” at 50. 4 clicks is 1” at 100 (as you clearly imply when you say 2 clicks is half an inch at 100).
Correct, that was in error.

What I think I was trying to to convey was that at 50 then you needs more clicks at half the distance if the adjustment is 1/4” at 100 yards.

8 clicks at 50 to the inch because it is half the distance that the click value is set at.
 
Correct, that was in error.

What I think I was trying to to convey was that at 50 then you needs more clicks at half the distance if the adjustment is 1/4” at 100 yards.

8 clicks at 50 to the inch because it is half the distance that the click value is set at.
the old clicks game is not an exact science .a scope zeroed dead on at 100 yards and then assuming the 4 "up" clicks will lift it the sacred inch out at the same 100yards is a gamble at best. id strongly advise checking zero after 4 clicks and id wager its not the inch people assume it will always be. Scopes are not always refined enough to comply with our assumptions
 
  • Like
Reactions: VSS
Correct, that was in error.

What I think I was trying to to convey was that at 50 then you needs more clicks at half the distance if the adjustment is 1/4” at 100 yards.

8 clicks at 50 to the inch because it is half the distance that the click value is set at.
I use metric and imperial and do the cals in my head for machining on the mill or lathe

So if it needs a little bit more in is the same in metric and imperial.

Bird walks into a bar the boring metric ****er will be using the 25.4 calc while his mate is saying
look at the tits on that Shelia got to be 38D
 
the old clicks game is not an exact science .a scope zeroed dead on at 100 yards and then assuming the 4 "up" clicks will lift it the sacred inch out at the same 100yards is a gamble at best. id strongly advise checking zero after 4 clicks and id wager its not the inch people assume it will always be. Scopes are not always refined enough to comply with our assumptions
Scopes are very good these days, but people skimp on zeroing. So their zero isn't what they think it is, and this results in chasing it.
 
How many people are actually ranging the target ?

I learnt my lesson the hard way as to why ranging deer is important a few years back.

I took a shot at a roe doe in a large forestry ride, I had estimated it to be about 150m based off the size in the scope, so having it set 2 clicks high with my WSM I was good out much further than that with no adjustment. I took the shot and saw it run, which is unusual for that rifle.

When I got to the shot site I found a long shard of bone, where the bullet had evidently gone low and hit the leg.

On ranging back to my firing position in the tree line the shot was about 300-350m, and my scope which I normally carry on 8X was set to 16X - hence underestimating the range by about 1/2.

I had range finding binos on my chest but didn’t use them, despite having time and being under no pressure - that was the lesson, always check the range if you have time, and make sure to carry your rifle in a very consistent set up, so I check my scope every so often to make sure I haven’t left anything set I don’t intend.

Despite a lot of looking for the deer on the day I didn’t manage to find it, the deer was finally caught up with a few days later, but it’s not an experience I’ve forgotten since, and one I hope not to repeat.


Ben
 
I learnt my lesson the hard way as to why ranging deer is important a few years back.

I took a shot at a roe doe in a large forestry ride, I had estimated it to be about 150m based off the size in the scope, so having it set 2 clicks high with my WSM I was good out much further than that with no adjustment. I took the shot and saw it run, which is unusual for that rifle.

When I got to the shot site I found a long shard of bone, where the bullet had evidently gone low and hit the leg.

On ranging back to my firing position in the tree line the shot was about 300-350m, and my scope which I normally carry on 8X was set to 16X - hence underestimating the range by about 1/2.

I had range finding binos on my chest but didn’t use them, despite having time and being under no pressure - that was the lesson, always check the range if you have time, and make sure to carry your rifle in a very consistent set up, so I check my scope every so often to make sure I haven’t left anything set I don’t intend.

Despite a lot of looking for the deer on the day I didn’t manage to find it, the deer was finally caught up with a few days later, but it’s not an experience I’ve forgotten since, and one I hope not to repeat.


Ben
What we did years ago was stick a small target out at 100 and a fox size target at 250 take the same shot at the painted on bull
Shoot the close one then quickly move on to the 250 yd life size fox target. The results were aim higher as you don't get much time when a fox has run back (as they do)
Reading a lot of posts people just don't spend enough time or have the will to learn what or how to react
 
I learnt my lesson the hard way as to why ranging deer is important a few years back.

I took a shot at a roe doe in a large forestry ride, I had estimated it to be about 150m based off the size in the scope, so having it set 2 clicks high with my WSM I was good out much further than that with no adjustment. I took the shot and saw it run, which is unusual for that rifle.

When I got to the shot site I found a long shard of bone, where the bullet had evidently gone low and hit the leg.

On ranging back to my firing position in the tree line the shot was about 300-350m, and my scope which I normally carry on 8X was set to 16X - hence underestimating the range by about 1/2.

I had range finding binos on my chest but didn’t use them, despite having time and being under no pressure - that was the lesson, always check the range if you have time, and make sure to carry your rifle in a very consistent set up, so I check my scope every so often to make sure I haven’t left anything set I don’t intend.

Despite a lot of looking for the deer on the day I didn’t manage to find it, the deer was finally caught up with a few days later, but it’s not an experience I’ve forgotten since, and one I hope not to repeat.


Ben
I’ve done exactly this.

Fortunately I shot clean under it.
 
What we did years ago was stick a small target out at 100 and a fox size target at 250 take the same shot at the painted on bull
Shoot the close one then quickly move on to the 250 yd life size fox target. The results were aim higher as you don't get much time when a fox has run back (as they do)
Reading a lot of posts people just don't spend enough time or have the will to learn what or how to react

As it was in a narrow ride, despite being quick on the bolt it was in cover before I could have another round ready, or I’m quite good at a rapid follow up shot as it’s something I practice.

It was an unfortunate mistake with no ability to correct after the first shot.

The irony being if I had know it was 300M, I would have still taken the shot but just been able to dial for it, which would have put the shot centre chest having looked where the bullet actually went and my dope I would have added.

Just shows it’s worth checking range, as it can very much catch you out no matter how much you practice.
 
As it was in a narrow ride, despite being quick on the bolt it was in cover before I could have another round ready, or I’m quite good at a rapid follow up shot as it’s something I practice.

It was an unfortunate mistake with no ability to correct after the first shot.

The irony being if I had know it was 300M, I would have still taken the shot but just been able to dial for it, which would have put the shot centre chest having looked where the bullet actually went and my dope I would have added.

Just shows it’s worth checking range, as it can very much catch you out no matter how much you practice.
Easily done. I've shot a roe buck through both front legs because I thought it was at 200m when it was 300m and the shot ended up 6-7" low. Fortunately it wasn't very mobile and I was able to dispatch it up close. There's a lot of folks online who never make mistakes...
 
Back
Top